Want an example of why to true an action? Heres why!

[ASbobcat]

Well with a username rifleman700, my guess is, your a REM 700 fan. You have got to be the most unlucky guy I have ever heard of dealing with accurate(inaccurate)guns. Owning all those savages and not one good enough for a tent stake. Damn. I'm a Savage fan ONLY because of there inherent accuracy. Yes there's a dinger in a batch every now and again but I've never owned one. No the design is not as elegant as the 700 and clones and Trigger options arent as plentiful. We all can agree even if your not savage action fans that they do shoot well in all but a few cases. Remington's aren't all shooters either. I've had a couple that couldn't varmint hunt past 300 yards until I had the action trued and barrel replaced. I own a couple savages that shoot as well as custom guns I own. I'm not a Savage guy today like I was years ago as Remington and custom actions have replaced that preference. I will not sell my accurate savages either. They do shoot. Floating bolt heads DO make that possible and if it's because savage doesn't have top notch QC, I'm not sure but the fact is, that system works. Call it what you want.

Well put. Has anyone asked why there are so many aftermarket triggers for Remington 700's, but NONE for Savage's.

 

[gotcha]

Per 284winner post. I have a question that might help me better understand the benefits of the floating bolt head. ..... The bolt head floats on a fixed axis meaning it moves only in one plane at right angles to the bolt heads locating pin. To me, a non engineer, it seems a bolt head that operates like a Heim joint would be more appropriate and offer a wider range of compensation of bolt face to chamber alignment. This is only a hypothetical question but I'd like to hear some input that might satisfy my curiosity. I'm WAAAAY over the hill but always eager to learn.

 

[Ledd Slinger]

Didn't realize that a good looking action shot better than an ugly one.

You can't make this stuff up.

Rifles used to just be 'tools' for me back when money was tight and I wasnt such a firearms enthusiast. Looks didnt matter back then. I owned Savages and even an old customized Mauser. They worked and served their purpose well. But as I got my hands on other rifles over the years with timed 700 actions, Sako actions, Stiller actions, etc...the old Savages just paled in comparison to quality and feel of those rifles, especially when outfitted with Jewell triggers. Are my custom rifles with other actions more accurate than customized Savage rifles? Maybe, maybe not. But they sure as heck operate a lot smoother, have more reliable feeding, WAY better triggers with much more reliable safety mechanisms, and sleek good looking lines. An old junker car will get you from point A to B just the same as a new luxury sports car, but I know I'd sure as hell rather drive that luxury sports car if given the choice

 

[gotcha]

Well put. Has anyone asked why there are so many aftermarket triggers for Remington 700's, but NONE for Savage's.

Sorry to differ but there are several after-market triggers available for Savages. I've found the SS supply trigger works very well adjusted in the 11 oz. range. I HATE dealing with SSS so I buy them from tactical works. Rifle Basix also makes a pretty good trigger for the Savages. Not trying to "dis" you just providing accurate info if you weren't aware.

 

[ASbobcat]

Sorry to differ but there are several after-market triggers available for Savages. I've found the SS supply trigger works very well adjusted in the 11 oz. range. I HATE dealing with SSS so I buy them from tactical works. Rifle Basix also makes a pretty good trigger for the Savages. Not trying to "dis" you just providing accurate info if you weren't aware.

Never too proud to admit when I'm wrong. Thank you for setting the record straight. I almost added "that I'm aware", just to cover myself. I am not familiar with the triggers on Savage models other than the PT or BA, but I have no idea why anyone would make or buy a replacement trigger for those two models.
I can only assume that the aftermarket units to which you refer are for their cheaper models?

 

[gotcha]

Never too proud to admit when I'm wrong. Thank you for setting the record straight. I almost added "that I'm aware", just to cover myself. I am not familiar with the triggers on Savage models other than the PT or BA, but I have no idea why anyone would make or buy a replacement trigger for those two models.
I can only assume that the aftermarket units to which you refer are for their cheaper models?

 

[Ledd Slinger]

Sorry to differ but there are several after-market triggers available for Savages. I've found the SS supply trigger works very well adjusted in the 11 oz. range. I HATE dealing with SSS so I buy them from tactical works. Rifle Basix also makes a pretty good trigger for the Savages. Not trying to "dis" you just providing accurate info if you weren't aware.

Agreed, but the Timney is no improvement. When compared to the older Savage non-accutriggers, it is the same exact design with virtually no improvement in feel or weight. Complete waste of money. The SSS triggers are a night and day improvement over factory Savage triggers, but still a far cry in quality and feel of triggers like Jewell and B&A.

 

[ASbobcat]

Rifles used to just be 'tools' for me back when money was tight and I wasnt such a firearms enthusiast. Looks didnt matter back then. I owned Savages and even an old customized Mauser. They worked and served their purpose well. But as I got my hands on other rifles over the years with timed 700 actions, Sako actions, Stiller actions, etc...the old Savages just paled in comparison to quality and feel of those rifles, especially when outfitted with Jewell triggers. Are my custom rifles with other actions more accurate than customized Savage rifles? Maybe, maybe not. But they sure as heck operate a lot smoother, have more reliable feeding, WAY better triggers with much more reliable safety mechanisms, and sleek good looking lines. An old junker car will get you from point A to B just the same as a new luxury sports car, but I know I'd sure as hell rather drive that luxury sports car if given the choice

I never owned a "pre-accutrigger" Savage, but I understand that many of them may have been of suspect quality.
I walked into a custom rifle shop 20 years ago and was told they could build me a competitive bench rest gun for about $5,000.
Soon thereafter I visited Cabela's and bought my first Savage F-class 6BR off the used rack for $800. I was amazed at the range when my bullets all went through the same .2moa hole from a used factory rifle/barrel that already had who knows how many rounds through it.

Since that day I've never bought anything else. I buy them used, shoot them until they don't shoot under 1/4 moa anymore and then put a custom barrel on them in my garage in 5 minutes.

 

[gotcha]

You're right asbobcat The older/cheaper three lever triggers benefit hugely from the upgrade triggers, as well as , the earlier accutriggers. I've never shot the PTA with the newer version target/competition accutrigger and assume its a pretty nice set-up based on feed-back here. Thanks for the gentlemanly reply.

 

[ASbobcat]

You're right asbobcat The older/cheaper three lever triggers benefit hugely from the upgrade triggers, as well as , the earlier accutriggers. I've never shot the PTA with the newer version target/competition accutrigger and assume its a pretty nice set-up based on feed-back here. Thanks for the gentlemanly reply.

You're very welcome. I laughed the first time I saw an accutrigger. It looked like a "Rube-Goldberg" thing. Then I tried one and was absolutely amazed. If you visit the Savage website, you can find information comparing their trigger to other well known types. The testing is done on a machine comparing let-off, creep and over-travel and the results are presented graphically. My real world experience verifies their claims.
When I owned a Rem700 I paid good money for a custom trigger from a well known maker and it was no improvement over the factory trigger. So I am skeptical whenever I hear of claims about custom triggers.

 

[rifleman700]

Well with a username rifleman700, my guess is, your a REM 700 fan. You have got to be the most unlucky guy I have ever heard of dealing with accurate(inaccurate)guns. Owning all those savages and not one good enough for a tent stake. Damn. I'm a Savage fan ONLY because of there inherent accuracy. Yes there's a dinger in a batch every now and again but I've never owned one. No the design is not as elegant as the 700 and clones and Trigger options arent as plentiful. We all can agree even if your not savage action fans that they do shoot well in all but a few cases. Remington's aren't all shooters either. I've had a couple that couldn't varmint hunt past 300 yards until I had the action trued and barrel replaced. I own a couple savages that shoot as well as custom guns I own. I'm not a Savage guy today like I was years ago as Remington and custom actions have replaced that preference. I will not sell my accurate savages either. They do shoot. Floating bolt heads DO make that possible and if it's because savage doesn't have top notch QC, I'm not sure but the fact is, that system works. Call it what you want.

This is the reason I do not post comments much on these type of threads. There are always some that seem to get butt hurt when you may say things about their favorite rifle or manufacturer that they think as negative. Let me clarify this by saying I had no intention to ruffle anybody's feathers with the comments I made. So if I did, I apologize. That being said I think if you were to go back and reread what I typed you would see that other than criticizing Savage's CS I was very fair about my admittedly "SMALL" sample. At the end you will also notice that I gave my opinion on Remington products as well and that they differed very little from what I said about Savage products. It would be nice to be able to actually give your opinion and then have a responsible discussion without all of the pointed comments.

And finally, yes I like Remington products and they are far from being perfect. But I also like Browning ( I have one that is the most accurate production bolt rifle "I" have ever shot ), CZ and some Ruger ( the worst bolt action "I" have ever shot). I hope that's ok. I even have customs built on Mauser 98's / VZ24's. And as far as custom actions I own are Pierce and Defiance Machine.

 

[rifleman700]

I never owned a "pre-accutrigger" Savage, but I understand that many of them may have been of suspect quality.
I walked into a custom rifle shop 20 years ago and was told they could build me a competitive bench rest gun for about $5,000.
Soon thereafter I visited Cabela's and bought my first Savage F-class 6BR off the used rack for $800. I was amazed at the range when my bullets all went through the same .2moa hole from a used factory rifle/barrel that already had who knows how many rounds through it.

Since that day I've never bought anything else. I buy them used, shoot them until they don't shoot under 1/4 moa anymore and then put a custom barrel on them in my garage in 5 minutes.

20 years ago - 1996 and you bought an F-class soon thereafter?? Didn't the f-class come out in 2007, 4 years after the accutrigger?

 

[Ledd Slinger]

.....Since that day I've never bought anything else. I buy them used, shoot them until they don't shoot under 1/4 moa anymore and then put a custom barrel on them in my garage in 5 minutes.

5 minutes? Im very impressed now! Would take me longer than that to get a scope off, then get the barreled action out of the stock and into a vice...But what do I know? I'm just a dumb guy who's unenlightened on the phenomena of Savage rifles

Have you ever heard of "chasing the lands"? Just because a barrel quits shooting quite as accurate as it used to, doesn't mean it's done being accurate. Things change as the barrel wears down, and every so often, your load and seating depth will have to change with it.
Even when the lands gets to a point where its badly worn, or unevenly worn, there's no reason to waste a good barrel if it has proven to be very accurate. Just cut it back and touch up the chamber.....in your garage it should only take 5 minutes.

 

[vmaxpro]

Just remember, If there was only one rifle manufacturer this site and many others would be pretty damn boring.

 

[jsthntn247]

The 783's have the same type of trigger and barrel attachment assembly as Savage because it is the cheapest manufacturing method used to produce a rifle. Not saying it doesn't work, but it is all about ripping them through the line in quick order. Why do you think the 783 is the least expensive centerfire rifle Remington now makes?

And yes, with careful handloading and good optics, I have seen a few of the older Remington 700 Sendero and VSFFII model rifles print that same 400 yard group in your target picture...and those are hunting/varmint rifles, not target rifles.

Savage gets people to pay more with their more expensive models by giving them an appealing name for marketing like, "Long Range Hunter" or "Model 12 Long Range Precision". It's the same cheap crap in a little bit nicer stock.

The higher priced Remington rifles actually have much higher standards for QC, nicer hand lapped barrels, and quality stocks so you really do get more for your money.

But this topic isn't supposed to be about Remington vs. Savage. It's about the lack of QC in factory Savage rifles. Like I said, they are economy priced rifles, so you can't expect them to be perfect every time. You want top level QC where the machining is excellent, you're most likely gonna have to pay more from a different company.

The only economically priced rifles where I have seen beautiful machining inside and out, above and below the stock lines, on every single rifle, is the Thompson Center Venture. I challenge anyone to pull a TC Venture barreled action out the stock if given a chance and compare the machining quality to any Savage or Remington. Then take a bore scope and inspect the finish of the 5R rifled barrel. For the price, you will truly be amazed.

It's ashame TC doesn't get more attention with their centerfire rifle lines. They truly are a step above Remington and Savage at any comparable price point. Get into the TC Icon, and they are a whole 'nother level while still maintaining a price point under $800. Unfortunately lack of sales drove the Icon out of production with the Venture soon to follow. Quality and accuracy was never the issue, just lack of exposure and not being able to get a foothold amongst giants like Reminton, Ruger, and Salvage

I've got a Venture that has the worst barrel of all times. Railroad tracks down the barrel that you don't need a bores cope to see

 

[aloreman]

does anyone make a 2 stage trigger for the savage?

 

[savagedasher]

does anyone make a 2 stage trigger for the savage?

Factory Larry

 

[Ledd Slinger]

I've got a Venture that has the worst barrel of all times. Railroad tracks down the barrel that you don't need a bores cope to see

Yeah well that's factory rifles for ya I guess. Even the best custom barrel makers let a few bad ones out the door every once in a great while

 

[aloreman]

Factory Larry

huh?

 

[savagedasher]

huh?

Savage with a blade is a two stage trigger . Larry