Vortex Factory Defect...?

[SartechJF]

Hey all,

I recently bought a Barrett and mounted a Vortex Razor HD Gen III 6-36 on it. It's sitting in a Geissele mount.

Today is the second time I shot the rifle. I'm not an expert marksman, but I'm also not new to shooting. My groups aren't ever this bad. Today was only at 200 yards. I had my dad shoot two three-round cycles to see if it was me. It's not. But I also don't know if it's the scope or the rifle. I suspect it's the scope.

I attached some photos. Does anyone have any thoughts?

I'm contacting Vortex anyway, but I'd like to know if anyone's seen this before with a factory-new scope (or rifle). I've only ever had a rifle shoot this way one time: Many years ago, when I had the store I bought my setup from mount my scope prior to pick up. Dude crushed the scope tube. That was a Vortex, too, and they replaced it. I've set up many of my own rifles since that time, and I've not crushed a tube. I'm pretty certain I didn't on this one, but I suppose anything's possible.

I didn't follow any barrel break-in procedures for this rifle. It's chrome-lined. I did clean it with Boretech carbon remover, copper remover, and oiled (EWL) and dry-patched prior to my first range trip.

These groups were shot today between 11 AM and Noon. 77 degrees, 55% humidity. Sunny, no cloud cover. Little to no wind. Factory ammo: Hornady Match, BTHP, 140gr. Benchrest with squeeze bag.

Thanks,

Jason

 

[ronemus]

Factory ammo or reloads? From the bench or prone? Setup on firing point? Wind or mirage?

1-1/2 MOA from a factory rifle without load development wouldn't be considered bad bymost.

 

[seagate]

Mount a known scope to you to rule out the vortex

 

[jpjulian]

Try different ammo. Break-in on a chromed barrel is a waste of time and ammo. The mount came with torque settings and unless you totally screwed that up it isn't the scope. That leaves the ammo or the shooter.

 

[Clancy]

I’m I’m reading the 1-5 and 6-10 groups correctly, it looks like it’s shooting 6” plus of vertical at 200.

Of course it’s the scope if that’s the case.

 

[NZ_Fclass]

A few tests to do. 1) Dry fire the rifle - to see if the reticle jumps. 2) You need to do a box test. Will it shoot up a vertical and acrross horizontal lines at 50yds as you wind the turrets? 3) Also count the clicks to see if the retical is centered.

I guess the next move is to put the scope on a "known" rifle. Vortex say that they have good warranties, but I suspect that you be without it for a while.

I had a Sightron that passed all the tests - and still shot poorly. Checked on anotherr rifle , it exhibited the same problems Ruturned to US. Sightron simply suggested that they could not fix the issue and replaced the scope

 

[Rob01]

As you were told at the Hide you need to test the rifle with another scope, different ammo etc before going right to saying the scope is an issue with a brand new rifle and ammo it’s never shot. Going right to the scope is just trying to scapegoat. Especially that scope with a very good known track record.

 

[Coyotefurharvester]

I don't recall seeing scope ring halves that make contact when torqued, did you lap the rings?

 

[ballisticdaddy]

It is a factory rifle with a quick change chrome-lined barrel that is not really known for its accuracy. For the record I do see many Razor Gen3 in matches but rarely see a MRAD on the firing line. Pretty shitty to call out a known manufacturer in any public forum when you really have no clue what the problem is and have done zero troubleshooting in order to determine the issue. As other have indicated, swap scopes and/or rifles and ammo to ones you know shoot before you cry wolf.

 

[DGP4]

Two new variables, so yes, mount a proven scope and retest. Rifle may just need a break in.

 

[SartechJF]

I’m I’m reading the 1-5 and 6-10 groups correctly, it looks like it’s shooting 6” plus of vertical at 200.

Of course it’s the scope if that’s the case.

You are correct: 6" plus vertically and horizontally. It looks like different groups, but that's not the pattern. The pattern is as I labeled it. I played it back from my Longshot recording to make sure I got it correct.

Might or might not be the scope. As others have mentioned, there's a lot of troubleshooting to do, but I was curious because I've never had this happen before, new barrel/rifle, 200 yards, factory ammo combo or otherwise. So I asked because a lot of shooters here have a lot more experience than me.

 

[SartechJF]

A few tests to do. 1) Dry fire the rifle - to see if the reticle jumps. 2) You need to do a box test. Will it shoot up a vertical and acrross horizontal lines at 50yds as you wind the turrets? 3) Also count the clicks to see if the retical is centered.

I guess the next move is to put the scope on a "known" rifle. Vortex say that they have good warranties, but I suspect that you be without it for a while.

I had a Sightron that passed all the tests - and still shot poorly. Checked on anotherr rifle , it exhibited the same problems Ruturned to US. Sightron simply suggested that they could not fix the issue and replaced the scope

I appreciate this. Thank you for the comment!

I'm going to swap the scope off my Tikka this weekend and shoot the same batch of ammo out of each rifle w/ the swapped scopes and see how that goes. I'll try the dryfire first, though. Thanks for that!

In another vein, I have a Sightron benchrest on one of my other rifles, and I really like that scope!

 

[SartechJF]

I don't recall seeing scope ring halves that make contact when torqued, did you lap the rings?

I didn't lap them. I've never used Geissele rings, though. It was a little surprising to me that they met, as well, but I torqued to spec.

At 100-yard sight-in, it wasn't this erratic. The groups were what I would expect from a fresh barrel, so I don't think I crushed anything. Possibly, but I don't think so. I suppose I'll eventually find out if all else is ruled out.

 

[Coyotefurharvester]

Did you use 35mm ring mount?

 

[Clancy]

With a straightish vertical line like that it seems likely that it’s the optic, whether a factory defect or user inflicted. The only other time I’ve seen a straight vertical like that was a Brown that had significant pin drag, so do check that as well. A chronograph should have revealed the pin drag?

 

[Rob01]

I highly doubt it’s the optic in having about 7 of those scopes and using them hard in matches.

OP when you tightened the ring caps what were they torqued to?

When you installed the mount on the rifle did you push it all the way forward in the picatinny slot until it stopped and then torqued it down? To what torque?

Also did you retighten the knobs after zeroing at 100? The single screw.

 

[SartechJF]

Did you use 35mm ring mount?

No, I used 34mm. The spec for my scope is a 34mm tube. The Geissele mount is 34mm.

 

[Coyotefurharvester]

Just asking since they have a 35mm also.

 

[SartechJF]

Just asking since they have a 35mm also.

No worries! I appreciate the thoughts.

I thought for a moment I fucked up and had to go back and check, though.

 

[kyotekiller25]

Factory AR and factory ammo, I wouldn't get too excited.

I highly doubt it's the scope. I'd be looking elsewhere.

Also, how well do you shoot ARs? Because I can shoot 1/4-3/8 MOA from my bolt 223s, but when it comes to my AR it's just not happening. They take a lot more finesse to drive straight apparently...