Time to make the donuts....

[JoeDuke]

When pointing, what are some thoughts on having a positive stop versus a little bit of over center at the top of the stroke? -Al

I have made bullets both ways. As you know, the Blackmon press is a cam over press. It makes very good bullets. I also have an Ulrich converted Lee press that hits the stops built into the press linkage and thus does not cam over. It also makes very consistent bullets. I have always figured that the normal method of measuring a bullet "base to ogive" length is fraught with a few problems. Firstly, I use a caliper which is not as accurate as a micrometer. Second, you have to use some kind of device that approximates the diameter close to a bullet diameter to fit against the ogive portion of the bullet and I find that varies by how I insert the bullet. So, in my experience, the measurement can vary from time to time. I just sort of work to make sure it stays close over time if you will. Having said all that, both methods seem to me to be very consistent as long as you the operator are consistent. It probably makes sense that you are removing one variable from the operation if you pull against the positive stop. But I am not experienced enough to say for sure.

I would like to see George's and Randy's comments for sure.

 

[JoeDuke]

what my Blackmon press

wants to be when it grows up!

 

[liseo]

youtube.com/shorts/p5Gc1XslSak?feature=share


Steady dial indicator base

 

[brcman]

Per my previous conversations with George I am pretty sure he prefers the positive stop versus camover

 

[dcali]

When pointing, what are some thoughts on having a positive stop versus a little bit of over center at the top of the stroke? -Al

I modified the links on my Lee Press that George made me. Before they were the stock links with holes drilled for better leverage. They had the factory stop. After, they were heat treated tool steel without a stop (same leverage, though). My bullets were *much* more consistent in OAL after the change. I don't know for sure if it was better links or the over-center, but it was notable. I don't recall the actual numbers before hand, but I want to say it went from something like an SD of .004 down to about .0015.

I still use a stop (same custom links) for seating because I didn't want to fix something that isn't broken, and going over center on the seating operation was pretty jarring for the lee press when doing .30s.

 

[liseo]

Since buying a new press from George is out of the question due to shipping costs, I'm designing one based on the Lee Classic, but much more robust and larger, with shaft diameters double the diameter.

 

[Kiwishooter]

Since buying a new press from George is out of the question due to shipping costs, I'm designing one based on the Lee Classic, but much more robust and larger, with shaft diameters double the diameter.

I don't think increasing the shaft diameter will add anything to the press as the shaft is operating in compression, if you build a press that operates on the same principle as the Lee (and most others) the links, pivots and frame operate under tension

 

[liseo]

I don't think increasing the shaft diameter will add anything to the press as the shaft is operating in compression, if you build a press that operates on the same principle as the Lee (and most others) the links, pivots and frame operate under tension

Kiwi, Since English is not my language, I think I'm not using the correct terms. Here's a drawing of what I'm planning.

 

[RGRobinett]

The new Ulrich bullet swage press has now pointed several thousand bullets (mostly thirty Cal. 10 ogive) , as expected, without a hitch - it is simply TERRIFIC! Ten ogive thirty Cal. require the most effort of any
of the bullets I make - most presses are 'wanting' leverage for .30 Cals. When I switched over to pointing some 10 ogive 88 Gr. FB .25 Cal. bullets, the effort went on vacation . . . 6mm and .224s will be just waving the lever up & down.

Getting to that level required a modification, which I believe George will tolerate (hell, he ain't gettin' it back!) and may well consider it an option - a simple ball on the end of the lever, to accommodate an aging hand and wrist! I'm guessing that a shiny DOO-DAD bronze ball would be worth some serious dinaro!

I'll probably obtain a larger ball - this is just a spare RCBS 2" Dia. ball - will likely end up with a 3" ball.
The ball greatly improved the ergonomics. A simple installation: drilled a proper sized bore & threaded 5/8"-11tpi with a cheap tap.

That bucket of Blackmon .224 jackets are some left over from a purchase I made, what seems, 'almost 100 years ago', before MR. Blackmon sold his jacket drawing equipment.
RG

P.S. I was able to air-drop a couple of short videos to Al, which he may be able to post here - I am unable to post video. If Al is able to accomplish the mission, I'll add a few comments - the video displays a couple of interesting results of leverage at work.

 

[Kiwishooter]

The new Ulrich bullet swage press has now pointed several thousand bullets (mostly thirty Cal. 10 ogive) , as expected, without a hitch - it is simply TERRIFIC! Ten ogive thirty Cal. require the most effort of any
of the bullets I make - most presses are 'wanting' leverage for .30 Cals. When I switched over to pointing some 10 ogive 88 Gr. FB .25 Cal. bullets, the effort went on vacation . . . 6mm and .224s will be just waving the lever up & down.

Getting to that level required a modification, which I believe George will tolerate (hell, he ain't gettin' it back!) and may well consider it an option - a simple ball on the end of the lever, to accommodate an aging hand and wrist! I'm guessing that a shiny DOO-DAD bronze ball would be worth some serious dinaro!

I'll probably obtain a larger ball - this is just a spare RCBS 2" Dia. ball - will likely end up with a 3" ball.
The ball greatly improved the ergonomics. A simple installation: drilled a proper sized bore & threaded 5/8"-11tpi with a cheap tap.

That bucket of Blackmon .224 jackets are some left over from a purchase I made, what seems, 'almost 100 years ago', before MR. Blackmon sold his jacket drawing equipment.
RG
View attachment 1683834

That 2" ball gives some context to the size of Georges press

 

[dcali]

That thing is screaming for an 8 ball handle.

 

[ridgeway]

I got these from McMaster...

 

[Mulligan]

The new Ulrich bullet swage press has now pointed several thousand bullets (mostly thirty Cal. 10 ogive) , as expected, without a hitch - it is simply TERRIFIC! Ten ogive thirty Cal. require the most effort of any
of the bullets I make - most presses are 'wanting' leverage for .30 Cals. When I switched over to pointing some 10 ogive 88 Gr. FB .25 Cal. bullets, the effort went on vacation . . . 6mm and .224s will be just waving the lever up & down.

Getting to that level required a modification, which I believe George will tolerate (hell, he ain't gettin' it back!) and may well consider it an option - a simple ball on the end of the lever, to accommodate an aging hand and wrist! I'm guessing that a shiny DOO-DAD bronze ball would be worth some serious dinaro!

I'll probably obtain a larger ball - this is just a spare RCBS 2" Dia. ball - will likely end up with a 3" ball.
The ball greatly improved the ergonomics. A simple installation: drilled a proper sized bore & threaded 5/8"-11tpi with a cheap tap.

That bucket of Blackmon .224 jackets are some left over from a purchase I made, what seems, 'almost 100 years ago', before MR. Blackmon sold his jacket drawing equipment.
RG
View attachment 1683834

This is killing me, I cannot wait to see my press arrive in the mail.
Randy, let us know what angle for the press.

CW

 

[jackieschmidt]

Am I the only bullet maker that prefers the presses mounted vertical.?

 

[dcali]

Am I the only bullet maker that prefers the presses mounted vertical.?

Possibly. Come to the dark side.

 

[dcali]

I’ve never met a punch I couldn’t mangle, sideways or not.

 

[DW T or C]

A little bit off subject but has anyone created a video of themselves going through the core seating and point up process? I'm looking for how some out there are actually making the bullet. I've been making bullets for years but feel there are some out there that are much faster or more efficient in their motions to get the bullet finished.

 

[RGRobinett]

Am I the only bullet maker that prefers the presses mounted vertical.?

Jackie, I've got almost any angle one can think useful: vertical; horizontal; angled - it's different angles for different jobs . . . and, different muscles & tendons! RG

 

[jackieschmidt]

I always insert the core seated jacket in the die and then follow it with the punch. I’s kinda of a fine line between bullet in, up comes press as finger moves out of the way.

Of course, if things do not go as they should, your finger gets intruduced to the concentrated pressure generated by tip of that punch.

I do it this way because with the 30 point up, I can use my body to apply the pressure on the handle rather than just my arm and shoulder.

Which brings up a point that no body has talked about in this thread.

Several years ago, a very well known bullet maker and Hall of Fame Shooters gave details on seating cores to where the core seated jacket is undersized from the finis diameter of the bullet. The idea was, there is always a small amount of spring back with the jacket, which is a copper alloy. However, the lead core has zero spring back. If the seated core is the same size as the finished bullet, it could produce a loose core.

Or something like that.

I tried it. I put just enough core pressure on the seated jacket so the core seated jacket was a tenth under the final bullet size.
They were the worst shooting bullet I ever made. So I continued seating the cores where they have a certain “feel” coming out of the core seating punch, (and of course the correct length), and they are the same size as the finished shank on the bullet, which is .3081.
When I insert it into the point up die, it sticks enough so I can get my finger out of the way.

 

[andrewc6.5]

Am I the only bullet maker that prefers the presses mounted vertical.?

Nope. I like to do it vertically. And pressing a little green button is awfully tiring