Thin, Light Barrels

[bsekf]

So, we all know light thin barrels heat and after a shot or 3 begin to make patterns instead of groups. After being heated and starting to shoot patterns, do they lose POI after they cool? I am thinking of building a light accurate rifle with a short light barrel but am concerned the POI may change with the same POA if it is allowed to get hot. (one shot per hour for 10 hours, nice group. then 10 shots as fast as you can cycle, group enlarges. Question, after the rifle barrel cools will it shoot one shot per hour in the original nice group?)

 

[drop_point]

My POI returns where it was when it cools on all my thin sporter barrels. I don't really get a shift when my barrels get hot, just big groups. Most guns about four rounds are all you get.

 

[rockhound78]

Had a Savage 99 in 358 win that would put the first 3 in about 3/4". 4th was about 2" out of that group and 5th was off in another direction. Let cool and first 3 back into about 3/4" same place on target as first three shot group.

 

[JEFFPPC]

50 years ago while attending PSU I had a heavy Douglass barrel on a 722 in 6mm Rem. It had lost its accuracy edge and I decided to make a light deer rifle out of it. I had a local gunsmith turn the barrel down as thin as I could talk him into and reduce it to 18 inches length. I whittled out a stock from a piece of beech. The gunsmith asked how I was going to bed it. I said glass the action and rear of the recoil lug leaving everything else floated. He suggested with that very skinny barrel to glass bed the entire thing. I did and it was great advice. Gun shot as good as it did before being turned done and cut off. Just an idea you could try. For deer I would zero it at 50 yards which put me a bit high at 100 and just a bit low at 200. The 3 50 yd shots would be a tight cloverleaf. Shot a lot of deer with it until years later I needed an action to build a silhouette rifle.

 

[D-4297]

I have several ( 3 ) Mosin - Nagants , with what I call "pencil barrels". Original stock , 30" barrels , and they do move POI as they heat up . Nothing major . Maybe 3/4 of a inch , to one inch , but they do move . They also go back to their original POI after completely cooling off , too . Guess it would depend on the size and length of the barrel you choose .

 

[K22]

My Rem Model 7's have 20" long, number 2 contour Douglas match barrels. In my experience the key to consistent POI is a free floated barrel with high quality bedding.

I do not shoot sustained fire sequences since I am a precision varmint hunter. The cold / cool / warm barrel is the "money" shot for me. However, in the 90-degree temperatures, I can retain desired POI in these thin barrels in a warm barrel condition with about 5 to 10 minutes between shots as verified by range shooting.

 

[Old Navy]

So the moral of this topic is to work up a good three shot load that will do it cold today, tomorrow and next week without cleaning. This is exactly how Bob Melick recommended many many years ago.

 

[std7mag]

You're worried about 3 shots?

Try doing an F-Open with 7mm-08AI.
Stevens 200 with factory sporter barrel.

 

[Webster]

So, we all know light thin barrels heat and after a shot or 3 begin to make patterns instead of groups. After being heated and starting to shoot patterns, do they lose POI after they cool? I am thinking of building a light accurate rifle with a short light barrel but am concerned the POI may change with the same POA if it is allowed to get hot. (one shot per hour for 10 hours, nice group. then 10 shots as fast as you can cycle, group enlarges. Question, after the rifle barrel cools will it shoot one shot per hour in the original nice group?)

I cannot think of a good reason to buy a light barrel. I can carry 8-9 pounds.

 

[Heavy Metal 1]

Well, some of us are 65 years old and still like to hunt in the Cascades so at altitude pounds saved are helpful.

 

[JB10]

On the rifles i use for hunting with skinnier barrels i do 3 shot load work up. In my mind i want it to shoot consistent every time for the first 3 shots. Hunting never goes as planned and 1 or 2 follow up shots may be needed. On the rifles i target shoot with I have thicker barrels. While i do not compete i only fire a few rounds and then let cool. Even with an AR i have a slow trigger finger.

 

[wright brothers]

Lots of Pa. walk hunters like em light. That said I have a hankerin for a fat barreled girl.

 

[rdremsek]

if you are building it for hunting and you are shooting 4 to 10 quick shots from a thin barrel a thick barrel ain't going to help either one shot one kill take your time and aim.i have a rem 700 mountain rifle it shoots great I shoot 7 to 10 shots at the range before hunting season with no problems it is a 7mm 08

 

[Iowa Fox]

50 years ago while attending PSU I had a heavy Douglass barrel on a 722 in 6mm Rem. It had lost its accuracy edge and I decided to make a light deer rifle out of it. I had a local gunsmith turn the barrel down as thin asI could talk him into and reduce it to 18 inches length. I whittled out a syock from a piece of beech. The gunsmith asked how I was going to bed it. I said glass the action and rear of the recoil lug leaving everything else floated. He suggested with that very skinny barrel to glass bed the entire thing. I did and it was great advice. Gun shot as good as it did before being turned done and cut off. Just an idea you could try. For deer I would zero it at 50 yards which put me a bit high at 100 and just a bit low at 200. The 3 50 yd shots would be a tight cloverleaf. Shot a lot of death with it until years later I needed an action to build a silhouette rifle.

When I was young and really stupid I did a really thin 6 mm Rem like that. Crazy thing shot pretty good.

 

[pdog06]

Question, after the rifle barrel cools will it shoot one shot per hour in the original nice group?)

Short answer is that it should return to your original zero.

I have a CA Mesa in 6.5cm, which is a real thin barrel. It threw me for fits trying to test some loads for it cause it would heat up so fast. only way I could do it ended up shooting 3-4 to foul it, then I would shoot 1 round every 5-10 minutes to try to have the barrel at a similar temp each firing. This has worked for me anyway

 

[Doug Casner]

Ive got a got a 257 wby. got a pencil barrel on it. Dont shoot more than 3 shot groups because it will spread after that. It always came back to zero. That 257 would heat up a chimmey though. Doug

 

[GotRDid]

Lots of Pa. walk hunters like em light. That said I have a hankerin for a fat barreled girl.

We still talking about Rifles, yes?!?

 

[HandgunHTR]

So, we all know light thin barrels heat and after a shot or 3 begin to make patterns instead of groups.

Actually, a barrel that is properly heat treated will not do this, even if it is a sporter contour.

In my experience, it isn't the barrel that is the problem in these situations, it is the shooter. The light guns recoil more and that causes the shooter to start influencing the shots.

I have a few "sporter" barreled guns (2 Tikkas, a Remage with an aftermarket barrel, and a Sako) that will stack shots with a barrel hot enough to cook off water.

 

[4xforfun]

FALLOWING...

I have a 6mm, 1 -8 twist Kreiger blank that is .67 at the muzzle. Probably end up at 22 inches. Figured on building a cheap, light pickup gun. My thoughts are that a properly stress relieved tube should hold POI. Like to hear real world experiences on that topic.

Tod

 

[RabbitSlayer]

Actually, a barrel that is properly heat treated will not do this, even if it is a sporter contour.

In my experience, it isn't the barrel that is the problem in these situations, it is the shooter. The light guns recoil more and that causes the shooter to start influencing the shots.

I have a few "sporter" barreled guns (2 Tikkas, a Remage with an aftermarket barrel, and a Sako) that will stack shots with a barrel hot enough to cook off water.

I think you are right. I have a t3 lite 223 I got so hot that I could smell the stock cooking. It was still stacking them like when cold. I also think barrels and guns in the last 15 or 20 years have improved tremendously. Some issues are a lot less common if at all now.