The Proper Response-Get Rid of the Guns

[jds holler]

The scenario goes as such:

Sensationalize particularly dramatic murders and mass shootings, to convince folks that they are becoming "everyday common".

Ignore the fact that these occurrences are nearly as rare as death by lightening.

Ignore the fact that homicide stats include justifiable defense against attack.

Ignore the fact that a great number of gun deaths involve dirt bags killing other dirtbags.

Ignore the fact that these horrific numbers of homicides are occurring in a population of THREE HUNDRED AND THIRTY MILLION people, which makes the odds veeeerrrry slim.

Totally ignore the occurrences of good people with guns preventing evil perpetrated by bad people with guns, knives, knuckles, clubs,---etc.

I could go on, but with a totally biased news media which has no love for the truth, these words seldom get heard. jd

 

[darkangel_r2]

Thinking about it practically. The amount of mental health screening to catch almost all of these bad guys would be unconstitutionally invasive. And not all of them will be found. And government programs are composed of the laziest and most incompetent people on earth so a system based on them will fail. So that route is a dead end in my mind.

These incidents almost always end with a good guy with a gun putting a bullet in the bad guy. Unless the bad guy offs himself or surrenders.

So I would suggest two things right now that should be done concurrently.

1. Voluntary program for teachers that has mandatory mental health checkups ,screening, drug tests for those that opt in on a regular basis who will then be provided a concealable firearm and concealable body armor. Only ones that want to can opt in. They get tested for mental health and drugs on a regular schedule and get provided concealable arms, armor, and training. There is no extra money for doing this (except improved health and life insurance as they are in more danger) as I want it to be a service and not an incentive.

2. Add an extra swat style officer that is armed with a rifle and rifle proof plate that is either at these schools if the schools are big enough or float between a few schools on a changing schedule where they go to each a few times a day at different unpredictable times. Well trained, well armed, and well paid. That way we at least have someone with a set of nuts that won't wait outside listening to gun shots and screaming kids for an hour because they are scared.

These two things will get good guys with a gun to the bad guys much faster and will also act as a deterrent against shooting up a (insert large public place here).

There are a million things that should be done to help adress the cultural issues that lead to these problems but these are two that make a lot of sense to do right now.

 

[Coyotefurharvester]

Isn't odd at all that the marxist/socialist/democrats would intentionally try to convince you the 2nd amendment ISN'T ABOUT HAVING PROTECTION FROM A TYRANNICAL GOVERNMENT which they are desperately trying to usher in.

 

[Webster]

My continued prayers are made for the families in Uvalde.

As those that cherish our right to bear arms, we should feel obligated to provide a proper rational response to addressing this tragedy. It is appalling to here the number of people calling to ban guns as a fix for this situation. This claim is nothing more than a useless and irrational appeal to emotion. Yet, we have to be careful and empathetic in how we respond.

First, it is impossible to disarm the citizens in our country from guns that they legally purchased and own. Second, mentally ill, sick or evil people will do the unthinkable or evil acts, whether by use of guns, bombs, cars, or any other means they choose to use. Taking law abiding citizen’s guns will not change this fact.

We should redirect this conversation to focus on what we as a society are doing to deal with these sick or evil people. Clearly, we have to do more.

And, pointing the finger at the police for not running in fast enough is short sited. Truth is that we do not properly select and train our law enforcement servants to deal with this situation. Not every person is cut out to charge head first into an active shooter situation and take on gunfire. (Being on the SWAT or TAC team does not change this fact.) It is all too easy to criticize those that don’t, when we do not do due diligence to get the answer to this question before the time of truth. In addition to not properly selecting or training our law enforcement personnel, we do not pay the ones that we are asking to do this fair wages. One would have to be a fool to expect any different response with this type of inadequate preparation. (I was actually thinking piss poor half ass preparation.)

Yet, if we as law abiding citizens do not properly direct the focus, we will continue to hear the and reap the consequences of the irrational appeal to emotion, “if the assault weapons ban had continued, and we get rid of these guns, then all of these killings would not be happening.”

I am in favor of stricter gun laws if they make sense. The HIPA medical laws make it impossible to identify people with mental disorders or mental illness. You have to pass a background check in Ohio and I guess every state to get a carry permit or buy a gun. By HIPA law they can only ID mentally ill that have been had a psychiatric exam ordered by a court and found mentally ill or incompetent or if you voluntarily admitted yourself to a mental institution. Every other disturbed person gets to purchase a pistol or rifle and get a carry permit. The most effective way to prevent mass murders is for us as citizens to report everyone we know of that’s disturbed to the police. It’s up to the police to find some way to act on this info. Maybe the court can order a mental exam for people that act goofy or make threatening statements. Many of the mass murders are by people that are too young to purchase a gun? Do restrictions help when there is 393 million guns in public hands.

US gun owners possess 393.3 million weapons, according to a 2018 report by the Small Arms Survey, a Geneva-based organization,

 

[kneedtospeed]

Wake up.
More, or more strict gun laws make zero sense.
Criminals, by definition, DO NOT follow Any Laws.
Laws Only regulate the Law abiding citizens, who were never a threat in the first place!
Laws regulate the same people that could possibly defend themselves, or others around them, if criminals imposed a life threatening situation.
More “gun control” will simply empower the evil do’ers , and give the ignorant a warm fuzzy feeling. It will Worsen gun violence.
Capital Punishment, and enforcing the many existing laws, that are constantly disregarded, would be a great place to start!

 

[Dusty Stevens]

I am in favor of stricter gun laws if they make sense. The HIPA medical laws make it impossible to identify people with mental disorders or mental illness. You have to pass a background check in Ohio and I guess every state to get a carry permit or buy a gun. By HIPA law they can only ID mentally ill that have been had a psychiatric exam ordered by a court and found mentally ill or incompetent or if you voluntarily admitted yourself to a mental institution. Every other disturbed person gets to purchase a pistol or rifle and get a carry permit. The most effective way to prevent mass murders is for us as citizens to report everyone we know of that’s disturbed to the police. It’s up to the police to find some way to act on this info. Maybe the court can order a mental exam for people that act goofy or make threatening statements. Many of the mass murders are by people that are too young to purchase a gun? Do restrictions help when there is 393 million guns in public hands.

US gun owners possess 393.3 million weapons, according to a 2018 report by the Small Arms Survey, a Geneva-based organization,

You are proposing “red flag laws” or snitch on your ex or neighbor law to get their guns taken away without due process

 

[Webster]

You are proposing “red flag laws” or snitch on your ex or neighbor law to get their guns taken away without due process

Are we saying there is nothing that can be done. Kind of looks that way. The school shootings are usually done by school age children not criminal types. I kind of agree it's to late to fix the problem when there is more guns than people in our country. Most Western European countries don't have this problem. Do we have more mentally ill than most other countries? Almost every week it's on the news that some very young person shot a family member with a hand gun that wasn't locked up. Stupid parents. Hand guns don't go off by accident. You have to point it at someone and pull the trigger with about 5 pounds of force.

 

[Dusty Stevens]

Are we saying there is nothing that can be done. Kind of looks that way. The school shootings are usually done by school age children not criminal types. I kind of agree it's to late to fix the problem when there is more guns than people in our country. Most Western European countries don't have this problem. Do we have more mentally ill than most other countries? Almost every week it's on the news that some very young person shot a family member with a hand gun that wasn't locked up. Stupid parents. Hand guns don't go off by accident. You have to point it at someone and pull the trigger with about 5 pounds of force.

First thing we gotta do is enforce the laws already in place, then we gotta figure out whats different between the 80’s&90’s where my high school had guns in the parking lot back then but nobody got shot and now we have gun free zones where lots get shot. The guns are not the problem. If law abiding citizens with guns were a problem we would damn sure know it, so why punish the law abiding gun owners? Why go after the NRA when none of these shooters are members?

 

[Ccrider]

I would not mind being required to submit medical information confirming that I am mentally competent to purchase a firearm. I had to pass a vision test to get a drivers license. I could drive at age 12 but not allowed to get a driver’s license until I was 16. So, I am ok with the government putting sensible age restrictions on certain things.

Keeping information obtained during the vetting process for obtaining a gun confidential is something that is already done. There is no HIPPA issue.

I realize that there is no simple solution. That is no excuse for not taking steps to try to make things better.

 

[kneedtospeed]

Give the govt more “control” over your gun Rights??
One of the very reasons the 2A exists, is to eliminate the government’s ability to disarm US Citizens.
SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED
“…being necessary to the security of a free State…

The Founding Fathers felt that citizens shall be able to protect themselves against the government and any other threat to their wellbeing or personal freedom.

They work for us, to serve, we the people.
We have become an obstacle to their new agenda’s.

 

[Coyotefurharvester]

Not funny how the left fails to mention "their" red flag laws violate the Fourth Amendment. Democrats have attacked the constitution from the inception of the party, defeating a constitutional republic is their goal, no matter what words are said.

 

[Ccrider]

Our rights are subject to regulation, whether one acknowledges it or not.

 

[SecondsCount]

This isn't about protecting kids, it is about control. Those in control want bigger guns than the citizens. You may be able to trust your government today but tomorrow could be a different situation.

We gave up the right to carry in a school and protect the kids. Now who is protecting the kids?

 

[Webster]

Wake up.
More, or more strict gun laws make zero sense.
Criminals, by definition, DO NOT follow Any Laws.
Laws Only regulate the Law abiding citizens, who were never a threat in the first place!
Laws regulate the same people that could possibly defend themselves, or others around them, if criminals imposed a life threatening situation.
More “gun control” will simply empower the evil do’ers , and give the ignorant a warm fuzzy feeling. It will Worsen gun violence.
Capital Punishment, and enforcing the many existing laws, that are constantly disregarded, would be a great place to start!

You cannot cure the people with emotional problems or mental illness by passing laws. Why do we have problems that other counties don't have? A very large % of the programs and movies on TV involve people shooting at each other. This is what we grow up with as entertainment. All problems in a Western are solved with a gun.

 

[kneedtospeed]

Westerns have been shown forever, no problems back then.
Political correctness, and inaccountability are the root problems, caused the majority to become so soft, and aftaid to offend anyone. And…no one got their ass beat enough anymore when they needed it.
This is the results of Coddling the weak.

 

[Dusty Stevens]

Westerns have been shown forever, no problems back then.
Political correctness, and inaccountability are the root problems, caused the majority to become so soft, and aftaid to offend anyone. And…no one got their ass beat enough anymore when they needed it.
This is the results of Coddling the weak.

Participation trophies

 

[Keith Glasscock]

I would not mind being required to submit medical information confirming that I am mentally competent to purchase a firearm. I had to pass a vision test to get a drivers license. I could drive at age 12 but not allowed to get a driver’s license until I was 16. So, I am ok with the government putting sensible age restrictions on certain things.

Keeping information obtained during the vetting process for obtaining a gun confidential is something that is already done. There is no HIPPA issue.

I realize that there is no simple solution. That is no excuse for not taking steps to try to make things better.

So, once a subjective standard is added to the qualifications, what prevents the medical community, party in power, or government from making changes to the DSM to prevent the majority of people from owning guns?

That's a problem with subjective standards, they are malleable. You have fallen prey to the idea that we can negotiate with people that have a demonstrated agenda. I won't move on this issue. Absolutely no "psychological" evaluations as a requirement.

As for your driver's license, Where is the right to one protected in the constitution?

 

[hpshooter]

So, once a subjective standard is added to the qualifications, what prevents the medical community, party in power, or government from making changes to the DSM to prevent the majority of people from owning guns?

That's a problem with subjective standards, they are malleable. You have fallen prey to the idea that we can negotiate with people that have a demonstrated agenda. I won't move on this issue. Absolutely no "psychological" evaluations as a requirement.

As for your driver's license, Where is the right to one protected in the constitution?

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Concise, well stated, and 100% true!!

 

[joshb]

So, once a subjective standard is added to the qualifications, what prevents the medical community, party in power, or government from making changes to the DSM to prevent the majority of people from owning guns?

That's a problem with subjective standards, they are malleable. You have fallen prey to the idea that we can negotiate with people that have a demonstrated agenda. I won't move on this issue. Absolutely no "psychological" evaluations as a requirement.

As for your driver's license, Where is the right to one protected in the constitution?

Yup! When you consider “they” already think we’re crazy for owning any gun!

 

[Rick300]

The answer to all this madness is SO simple - just make mass shootings against the law. Oh wait........