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The Proper Response-Get Rid of the Guns

i’m confused. isn’t it illegal to take a gun into a school? isn’t it illegal to kill someone with no threat levied at you? it was probably against a city ordnance to drive around with a loaded rifle. if none of these laws stopped him what are more laws going to do?

the law abiding citizens are the ones that get shit on with new laws not the criminals….
 
There are no more guns per capita in this country than there ever was -- actually less. Firearms tech may be improved from years past, but these atrocities could have been accomplished by most of the weapons that the gun banners would still allow us to have.

What there is more of, is psychopathic, soulless, broken young men. (and women) We've got an overabundance of young people who have been raised to be selfish, self centered, often fatherless and Godless. Many have been medicated with cocktails of psychoactive behavior modifying drugs to replace the self esteem and physical energy that hard work and athletic hobbies used to provide.

These broken people aren't going away anytime soon, and will likely increase with time. We are also about to start seeing the increase of several different gangs composed of lawless young men who have recently swarmed over the border. Many of them have been born into and survived conditions that would curl the hair of most of us who have lived in this country. They are not all hard working, kind hearted young folks who simply want to improve their lives.

The thought of giving up any of the efficient self defense weapons which we currently possess, is stupid -- actually insane.

We are about to enter a "fire season" and I for one don't care to give up my extinguishers, shovels, and buckets.
 
Absolutely, and overall school security has to be improved upon.
I live in Erie Pa. Other then the typical hallway bully/thug fights
It been quiet, but.....Just a very short time ago a kid brought a
pistol into school and shot another kid in front of everyone.
The high school was closed and a demand to have metal detectors
installed before reopening. They are in place and all back packs
searched. This however can be circumvented by an open window
or unlocked side door. Biggest joke from a teacher I know says,
no one gets screened during sports events at the school.
 
More gun laws, is not the answer. Over 300 are on the law books now. Do criminals obey any of those ? No and they will not others added.
This person broke one present gun law, taking a firearm onto the school grounds, no other present gun laws were broken by him, the rifles were purchased legally and he was cleared with the short background check that his state required and was able to legally take his rifle/s home.
He then decided to commit numerous crimes of murder, first the attempt on his own grandmother, than the murders of the children and adults at the school.
Have you heard anything about the murders, a big NO, just the repeat, repeat of the US needs more gun control and laws to stop this. That will not stop a criminal, intent on murdering another person and even if they are arrested and eventually charged with the murder/s, the bleeding hearts will not execute the person responsible for murdering another, all they want is to execute, ban and place more gun laws on the books.
 
It was reported by police that a teacher propped the door open
to retrieve a cell phone. It made it convenient for the perp, but
even if the door was closed, he probably would have gone in
the front door emptying magazines.

I understand the exercise of this thread but Pandora's box has
long been open. What needs to be done will be painfull as the
views of each populace in a state does vary widely. I also believe
compromise has been lost to the ages because of hate......I have
no solution to offer.
Well, a solution must involve a real change of heart and spirit on the part of the perpetrators. But one possible “deterrent” might come in the form of returning to public lynching. Kinda takes the fun-factor out of being the star attraction.
 
My continued prayers are made for the families in Uvalde.

As those that cherish our right to bear arms, we should feel obligated to provide a proper rational response to addressing this tragedy. It is appalling to here the number of people calling to ban guns as a fix for this situation. This claim is nothing more than a useless and irrational appeal to emotion. Yet, we have to be careful and empathetic in how we respond.

First, it is impossible to disarm the citizens in our country from guns that they legally purchased and own. Second, mentally ill, sick or evil people will do the unthinkable or evil acts, whether by use of guns, bombs, cars, or any other means they choose to use. Taking law abiding citizen’s guns will not change this fact.

We should redirect this conversation to focus on what we as a society are doing to deal with these sick or evil people. Clearly, we have to do more.

And, pointing the finger at the police for not running in fast enough is short sited. Truth is that we do not properly select and train our law enforcement servants to deal with this situation. Not every person is cut out to charge head first into an active shooter situation and take on gunfire. (Being on the SWAT or TAC team does not change this fact.) It is all too easy to criticize those that don’t, when we do not do due diligence to get the answer to this question before the time of truth. In addition to not properly selecting or training our law enforcement personnel, we do not pay the ones that we are asking to do this fair wages. One would have to be a fool to expect any different response with this type of inadequate preparation. (I was actually thinking piss poor half ass preparation.)

Yet, if we as law abiding citizens do not properly direct the focus, we will continue to hear the and reap the consequences of the irrational appeal to emotion, “if the assault weapons ban had continued, and we get rid of these guns, then all of these killings would not be happening.”
For those who don't know, I am retired from the Baltimore Police Department after 32 years of service.

No, not everyone is cut out to charge into an active shooter situation. Those who are not should refrain from becoming police officers. When you put on a badge, you have to accept the dangers that come with that badge.

What we had here was a group of police who hid outside a school and hear children begging for some to help them. Breaching a locked door is not brain surgery. It is a very simply process that almost any person who has ever watched TV knows what to do. Meanwhile, a group of children were laying on the floor of a classroom bleeding out. Who knows how many of them could have been saved with quick medical help.

I spent six years in the Homicide Squad and three more in the Escape and Apprehension Unit. I couldn't begin to estimate the amount of locked doors we kicked in.

Law enforcement officers are in many cases underpaid, that is certainly true. In my opinion, if you don't like the payscale then go find another job. If you take the job, then be ready to face whatever is put before you. These guys give police officers a bad name. Shame on them.
 
Did not research to verify because the Transgender Nazi Party controls the 1st Amendment. Do I believe, without doubt.





A hundred and fifteen years ago, in 1907...our great grandparents were first able to buy the rifle pictured. The semi-auto Winchester Model 1907.

This is a gun they could buy from a Sears catalogue and have delivered via US Post. It was/is a semi-automatic, high powered centerfire rifle, with detachable, high capacity magazine.

About 400,000 semi-automatic rifles were produced before WW2. Civilians had hundreds of thousands of these for 40 years, while US soldiers were still being issued old fashioned bolt action rifles.

The 1907 fired just as fast as an AR15 or AK47 and the bullet (.351 Winchester) was actually larger than those fired by the more modern looking weapons.. The ONLY functional difference between the 1907 and a controversial and much feared AR15 is the modern black plastic stock.

The semi auto, so-called "assault rifle" is 115 years old. It isn't new in any way. The semi auto rifle was not a weapon of war. The government MADE IT a weapon of war 40 years after civilians had them. The semi-auto can be safely owned by civilians. The proof is that literally 3 generations of adults owned and used them responsibly and no one ever even noticed.

Want to fix the horror of mass shootings? Fix the things that have changed for the worse in the last 50 years - Family Values, Prayer from Schools, Ten Commandments from Court Houses, Spanking Kids, Morals, What is socially acceptable, Confusion on Genders, Left Wing Liberalism, Socialism, ect.

- because the rifle technology in question was here long before this insanity.

GOD SAVE THE USA.IMG_6815.JPG
 
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For those who don't know, I am retired from the Baltimore Police Department after 32 years of service.

No, not everyone is cut out to charge into an active shooter situation. Those who are not should refrain from becoming police officers. When you put on a badge, you have to accept the dangers that come with that badge.

What we had here was a group of police who hid outside a school and hear children begging for some to help them. Breaching a locked door is not brain surgery. It is a very simply process that almost any person who has ever watched TV knows what to do. Meanwhile, a group of children were laying on the floor of a classroom bleeding out. Who knows how many of them could have been saved with quick medical help.

I spent six years in the Homicide Squad and three more in the Escape and Apprehension Unit. I couldn't begin to estimate the amount of locked doors we kicked in.

Law enforcement officers are in many cases underpaid, that is certainly true. In my opinion, if you don't like the payscale then go find another job. If you take the job, then be ready to face whatever is put before you. These guys give police officers a bad name. Shame on them.
Thank you Sir.
First for your service.
Second for your factual stance.
Third for your very realistic acknowledgement that a badge, a gun, a set of handcuffs, a position and a cushy paycheck will not buy a backbone when the noise is real.
 
Not to be misunderstood, I am not making excuses for law enforcement not entering. My point is that we have lived this same story before. Every police department needs to be properly funded to select and train responders that are up for the task. Time and time again, it is proven that this is not being done and we find out about the incompetency after the fact— way too late.
 
I read the New York Times everyday (online). And other publications. There is an editorial slant for sure, and quite a few Opinion pieces and news articles that allow one to comment ( and give one's own opinion) on the article and the comments are available in real time for viewers to read, also. Many articles are about the Texas shooting and the need for "gun control" (whatever that is) and outright abolition. I am actively writing comments to rebut the many hundreds of readers' views - mine in favor of unfettered gun ownership. I can make a reasoned argument and I know how these NYT readers "think". Unfortunately I am now likely seen as a gun nut. I'd bet 99% of these readers have never seen a gun, nor touched one. Many have never been west of The Hudson River. I am fighting the good fight to convince people (in comments) that there is a vast silent majority of decent, honorable, law-abiding, morally upstanding, safety-minded, gun-owning individuals. The common response by others is fairly closed-minded...just "get rid of all guns". And they are obsessed with AR bans. Granted, a specific and small subset of readers.
 
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More gun laws, is not the answer. Over 300 are on the law books now. Do criminals obey any of those ? No and they will not others added.
This person broke one present gun law, taking a firearm onto the school grounds, no other present gun laws were broken by him, the rifles were purchased legally and he was cleared with the short background check that his state required and was able to legally take his rifle/s home.
He then decided to commit numerous crimes of murder ...

It's a perfect example of how no laws on paper actually create a practical barrier to a psychopath deciding murdering people is "just the ticket" today. Nothing will.

It must be assumed that, at some point, there will be somebody who'll behave just like that, in disregard of all that's reasonable and lawful, in order to kill.

The only question, therefore, is: how to effectively halt such a person if/when he or she decides to go down in flames while taking numerous others along for the ride?

Whining about the non-existence of this or that law, or the ineffectual nature of this or that law, actual physical barriers must be in place to put a halt to such a person when he/she makes the attempt. Tougher entry areas; blocked alternate entrances; difficulty in getting from one section of a venue to another; ease of "holing up or escaping" for occupants of such facilities, when it's deemed a threat is coming down; and the staffing and procedures necessary to put a rapid halt to such a person when it's clear murderous violence is that person's choice.

Like with our own homes. Only a fool has no front door, no lock, and no plan for halting somebody who disregards those things. Have to be capable of keeping the violent at bay, at least for a little while. Have to be capable of putting down a violent person, if needed, when it's clear it's his life or the lives of your loved ones. Whining that he won't allow a phone call to the cavalry won't go far. Whining that he ignored X number of laws won't help. Putting him down rapidly will, before you watch your family get killed before your eyes.

Schools, office complexes, and the like, should be no different. They ought to recognize the occupants have value. That their lives deserved to be protected at almost any cost. At the very least, it ought to be incredibly hard to forcibly enter such a place of "soft" and "valuable" targets. At the very least, it ought to take some time (and noise) to break through the barricaded spots. It ought to be the simplest thing to heavily lock-down zones of such a facility, to make it difficult for a violent intruder to make it from one zone to the next.

It's a complete wonder, to me, why after all these years "modern" facilities continue to fail to have any such features.

And it's an unconscionable embarrassment how law enforcement staff can't be counted on to execute a rapid-entry plan to forcibly take out a murderously violent intruder in such circumstances.

Those are the changes most needed, IMO. Yet one more silly stack of bloated ink on paper won't be something such psychopaths take heed of. A handful of .223 through the chest ... perhaps that'll work. One murderous perp at a time. Better that than an entire school full of children.

I just wish the self-aggrandizing twits in the legislatures would "get" it, at long last. Practical steps toward disallowing entry and putting a halt to those who disregard dictates. Instead of the customary screeching and posturing such people seemingly prefer.
 
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My parents enjoyed freedoms that I will never have and their parents enjoyed even more. And today you will enjoy freedoms that your children will never have. As a Boomer I consider myself the last generation of freedom loving Americans. Sorry, but that is just the way it is.
 
My parents enjoyed freedoms that I will never have and their parents enjoyed even more. And today you will enjoy freedoms that your children will never have. As a Boomer I consider myself the last generation of freedom loving Americans. Sorry, but that is just the way it is.
Yea, these most recent generations are too self-centered and really could care less about freedom. They think playing some game on a lap top or cell phone is the only freedom they will ever need to have.
 
Not to be misunderstood, I am not making excuses for law enforcement not entering. My point is that we have lived this same story before. Every police department needs to be properly funded to select and train responders that are up for the task. Time and time again, it is proven that this is not being done and we find out about the incompetency after the fact— way too late.
I just finished watching the evening news. Here, the federal response
team grabbed what was available, and told the local departments that
they were going in after being told not to. The feds put no less then 12
slugs in the bastard. The audio of the 911 calls from the kids that could
get to a cell phone shown it was active and not a barricade situation.
 
Correct me if wrong;

Hasn't the supreme court repeatedly ruled that the police are NOT legally obligated to protect the lives of individuals? They're responsible for inmates and the mentally ill,but not the general public?

That would have to be addressed if there's any more gun control. So that's my first "response",even if it is in the form of a question.

Second would be about places like Chicago,Baltimore,and other big cities that already have extremely restrictive gun laws..... meaning,"are you willing to bet YOUR life on it"? And this has to be on an individual basis. Great thing for DC politicians to have armed security,but that's them.... what happens to us peons?

And speaking of Baltimore.... a city that I travel to frequently enough,downtown,and which...besides the criminal side of things, I actually like it's history,and have equipment/antique furniture biz there. Would pay serious $$$ to drop off a few DC politicians in the west end,no security and THEN ask them how they feel.

It's all fine and good for folks who sit in ivory towers to literally play games with other people's lives.
 
Correct me if wrong;

Hasn't the supreme court repeatedly ruled that the police are NOT legally obligated to protect the lives of individuals? They're responsible for inmates and the mentally ill,but not the general public?

That would have to be addressed if there's any more gun control. So that's my first "response",even if it is in the form of a question.

Second would be about places like Chicago,Baltimore,and other big cities that already have extremely restrictive gun laws..... meaning,"are you willing to bet YOUR life on it"? And this has to be on an individual basis. Great thing for DC politicians to have armed security,but that's them.... what happens to us peons?

And speaking of Baltimore.... a city that I travel to frequently enough,downtown,and which...besides the criminal side of things, I actually like it's history,and have equipment/antique furniture biz there. Would pay serious $$$ to drop off a few DC politicians in the west end,no security and THEN ask them how they feel.

It's all fine and good for folks who sit in ivory towers to literally play games with other people's lives.
The ruling of the court was more about the prevention of a school shooting in Florida. Not the taking of an action to stop an in progress crime.

A crime being committed in real time in the presence of a law enforcement officer is an entirely different circumstance.

For instance: I am standing on the corner and an altercation starts in my presence. It is dereliction of duty for me to stand there and just watch. What would you think if I just decided to walk away or just stood there with my hands in my pocket.
 

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