The anticipation is killing me! Waiting on the new 20VT rifle...

[Rick in Oregon]

Stunning wood grain on the left side! Very nice overall!

Our sage rats won't appreciate it one little bit!

 

[gunsandgunsmithing]

I understand about the anticipation. I just ordered a pneumatic beer can crusher and can't wait to try it out!

 

[snert]

I have a BAT SV, Hart HV 1-10 Twist in a MCM/Bruno stock. It is a 20 VT. I found happy with 20 grains of 2200, CCI 400, 34 grain Dogtown "econo" bullet at @3700 FPS in LC and Rem brass. ADVICE: Step down 1/2 gr for anticipated hot weather.

 

[SShooterZ]

I love my 20VT. My favorite rifle actually. A Bob Green built M7 that was originally a 221FB.

 

[TheCZKid]

Based on the fired brass I got from the seller, I was able to make up about 25 pieces of what I think is "final" sized brass. I'll anneal them tonight, and they should be ready. I bumped the shoulder about .002 from the fired cases, and turned the necks so they are the same as the RP 221 brass he sent. Tonight might make up the first rounds to be shot by me! and that's very cool. I'm probably going to try both small ladder test of CFE BLK and AA2200, with 32 Vmax, CCI400 primers. I'm not sure of seating depth, but the former owner liked them just touching the lands, 1.810", and I think I'll back off about .020 from the lands. This has Zero freebore from what he said, I'd love to verify that somehow. I don't have a 20VT case for my Hornady dealie.

 

[SShooterZ]

I've had great luck with H-4198 but I think you'll do well with AA2200 as well. No experience with CFE BLK yet though.

 

[snert]

I found CFE BLK to be similar to 2200, only tons cleaner. sadly, I had 4 pound of 2200 and one of BLK. Sooo...I went with 2200.

Mine shoots just a smidge (mathmatical scientific term used by master reloaders) off the rifling. I started with a square mark on the bullet and went shorter by 5 thou each test. When the line went away, it shot best. But that is my Hart 10 Twist. YMMV'

We will, of course, expect photos...

 

[TheCZKid]

Well, the previous owner said he loaded the bullets to have a OAL of 1.810 for Hornady 32 Vmax, which he said was just into the lands, so I thought... I'll make mine start at 1.805 and be almost touching the lands! Not sure where the 1.810" came from, but at 1.805" the rim of neck was past the ogive of the bullet. So, I'll figure it out myself.

From what you said, do you mean you load the bullet so you see the lands make contact, then back it off 5 thou until you see no mark, and test 5 thou off in increments of 5 each test? Sounds like a good idea. Not sure how to get to that first one that just touches the lands... I think I'll take a spent piece of brass and drill and tap the back of it, use it with my Hornady OAL tool.

 

[snert]

Yes, that is exactly what I meant. I am too poor and too lazy to create a proper measure so I took a crap piece of brass and seated a bullet, and grabbed a sharpie. I seated long. I painted the bullet with sharpie ink and chambered it. Repeat repeat repeat till it shows only a short square mark on the sharpie paint. Then start going back 005 at a time, till it disappears, and then go 005 more. I tried groups touching, "not showing" and .005 shorter than that. Am I really .005 off? Heck if I know. Measurements are relative using this method. I just stopped when it shot betterer. Highly scientific. And it has a double benefit. When I write it up this way it drive machinists, math guys and engineers crazy! Since I am far from any of that, and made my living in the highly scientific world of human behavior modification, this method works for me. and in the end, it worked.

 

[TheCZKid]

Well, I ended up drilling and tapping a piece of fired brass last night, for the Hornady OAL gauge, what a PIA! but it's done. And I tried the Hornady OAL test, pushed the bullet into the chamber until it touched the lands, did it a few times. It looked like the bore was not zero freebore, but maybe .050" so I tried a test with dummy round, and if I seated it long, it got stuck in the chamber... so I'm not sure where the lands are! I've had this issue before with the Hornady OAL Gauge, it appears the bullet goes in a LONG ways, and when I test it with a dummy round, the bullet ends up being too long! Ahhh!

 

[snert]

Sharpie my man, sharpie...

 

[TheCZKid]

Sharpie my man, sharpie...

I took your suggestion, I sharpied the crap out of the bullet and the full shoulder of the case too, wanted to see what was touching. And I saw... nothing
No contact seen, it was confusing. I appreciate your following up.

 

[snert]

Longer seat. Keep going out till the bullet falls out. If it touches when it is way out, just seat it LONG and start there. (I had a worn swift that was only about an 1/8 inch into the case! It shot)

 

[TheCZKid]

I did seat one way for out last night, and the bolt stopped about 1/8" short, had to pop the round out with a cleaning rod. I shortened it slightly, tried again, tried again, until the bolt would go into battery. So I think I have a fairly close idea to where the lands are, and figure I'll shorten the test loads about another .005 for my initial shots and figure it out. I still haven't shot the rifle yet, I'm just trying to get the specs right first. I have tested different thickness of neck turning, and now seating depth is at a good starting point. Next will load up some initial tests with CFE BLK and go shoot it!

Looks like Sunday afternoon, no rain 3-4 mph wind, 60 degrees.

 

[Rick in Oregon]

Doug, try not to overthink all this. Keep those one-hole targets in mind that I sent you from my VT showing bughole groups with seating depth .005" off the lands, and the same degree of performance with .080" of jump. It makes no sense, but facts are facts, and the targets tell the story, even if it's hard to understand "why".

Good luck at your 'range' Sunday. Hope you come home with a big smile. I'm interested to hear how CFE BLK works in your VT.

 

[TheCZKid]

Good advice, thanks! I've had a number of weeks of thinking about this new wildcat caliber, even before I found this rifle I purchased, and now have the rifle in hand. It's taken a bit of testing and tweaking to get the brass I've formed from LC 5.56 to the right shoulder length, and neck thickness, especially since I haven't had any examples of correctly loaded ammo to look at. It helped a lot when I got that fired brass to measure from.

 

[Coyotefurharvester]

If you believe there is 0.050 freebore, just find on the bullet where .204 starts from bullet tip. Seat out 0.020 from that first max bullet diameter. Marker the bullet and chamber, should be no land marks on bullet. Run your ladder, find the flat vertical node. Seat bullets +,- .005 steps testing for best group if your not satisfied, or groups are not nice and round. I would think 3(0.015) steps either way will catch a seating node with tangent type ogive bullet.

 

[TheCZKid]

I thought the freebore was longer, because I made a modified case from a shot piece of brass, and when I tried it, the bullet went almost an 1/8" out. But when I tried a bullet seated out a bit, I found the bolt wouldn't close, not until I seated it almost all the way into the case on my test round. I think the modified case is not going all the way into the chamber for some reason, and it's giving me an inaccurate reading. Likelihood is it might be zero freebore, as the previous owner said.

I'm just going to seat it .005 under the length it was after the bolt ended up going into battery. That will be a safe starting depth. I'll revisit the seating depth later, for now will focus on a ladder test with CFE BLK and AA2200, see how it does! I appreciate the input!!

 

[TheCZKid]

Got the Leupold VX III 6.5-20x40 with VHR varmint reticle scope mounted...


and some test ammo loaded...

A nice calm day with light winds and warmer temps. Gonna go shoot it for the first time!!

 

[Coyotefurharvester]

The seating stem is leaving ring marks on the bullet jackets.