Testing Carbon Removing Chemicals

[BoydAllen]

I think that in any discussion of this type, that an important distinction needs to be made between powder fouling, which seems to be what most posters are referring to, and so called hard carbon, which some may not be aware of, and which is so hard, that an abrasive must be (carefully) used to remove it. If you do not have a bore scope, or have access to one, you are just guessing as to the condition of your bore. That is a fact. True hard carbon will not show on a patch after soaking with solvent. I have a friend that had read an old article in Precision Shooting in which the author had recommended against brushing barrels. After that, my friend has made a habit of doing repeated soakings and patching until patches were clean. Unfortunately this did not tell the story with regard to hard carbon. Recently I had him bring over a .20 caliber barrel for bore scope inspection after cleaning. It had hard carbon in the back of the bore, and after we determined that that was the case, I used a little IOSSO and a nylon brush to carefully clean that out, working only in the problem area, because it will tend to polish a bore, and that will cause copper fouling if it happens in the front of the bore. After that, we inspected again with the scope, and the hard carbon had been removed. He is not the only one that has run into these kinds of problems. Within the group that he shoots varmints with, people have changed powders because a particular one would develop a problem after too few rounds.

 

[johara1]

Boyd, Right on, but i don't need a bore scope to know it's still in there. I can feel it left in there by pulling the rod back that has a dry clean patch on it, and pull the rod back toward the chamber and you can feel sticking or tighten up. Then it''s Kroil and Iosso time…… at home i use the bore scope but i still go by feel….. jim

 

[Lapua40X]

...
Anybody else tried it? ???

I guess not

 

[johara1]

...
Anybody else tried it? ???

I guess not

No, but i will. Getting desperate. I see two on here i didn't try………… jim

 

[Patch700]

Removing baked on carbon and coke is something everyone struggles with at some point , those who have dealt with it in other disciplines such as the engine rebuilding industry are aware that you need a few things to effectively remove it and they are

1) Heat
2) Caustic materials
3) Agitation
4) A soak period

Sadly for what we do there is sometimes a window of time that we must work in so having said that we aren't able to play the soaking game for too long..

What we can do is use caustic materials such as the ones already mentioned and further to that , use them when the barrel is in a state where it is heat soaked (immediately after a string if possible)

Obviously carbon and coke are best kept in check from a preventative stand point but here again this isn't always feasible for some disciplines where cleaning cannot be done until after a certain string is completed or one does not wish to clean the barrel until a match is completed in its entirety , so you are left to fewer options and this is where you must have a form of agitation be it bore paste or stiff brushing or some type of scraping tool .

It's carbon , there is no miracle product that will remove it in it's entirety within a short period without some type of agitation .... For those that believe you can , simply find a piece of steel such as an old cylinder head from an engine and try using your 5 minute miracle solution to remove the baked on carbon in the combustion chamber without using any scraping or rubbing.

I will say this on the topic of products , if you are in a position to clean with the barrel heat soaked give aerosol oven cleaner a try... I have used it on some stubborn spots and it has worked however it too works best with a good brush. (Note if you have an anodized bore guide it will do neat things to it so be aware lol)

I don't know for certain if it helps but I also try to keep the bore soaked in kroil when put away , my theory is that if there is any remnants left after cleaning the kroil will loosen them up for when I patch it out prior to the next shoot.

 

[Alex Wheeler]

Is there a reason you guys don't just use Iosso? Takes about 2 minutes to clean up the throat.

Jim, are you really getting carbon between matches? I usually only have to go after carbon every 100 rounds or so.

Alex

 

[michaelnel]

Do you guys find that carbon buildup in the throat area has a big adverse impact on accuracy?

I have used C4 to remove it, but I don't have a borescope to verify. It did get LOTS of black stuff out of there after having cleaned it well with other methods.

I have some JB paste now and some IOSSO on order, is there much difference between using the JB and IOSSO?

 

[dkhunt14]

I don't believe they ate allowed to ship Warthog anymore. Matt

 

[dkhunt14]

Do you guys find that carbon buildup in the throat area has a big adverse impact on accuracy?

I have used C4 to remove it, but I don't have a borescope to verify. It did get LOTS of black stuff out of there after having cleaned it well with other methods.

I have some JB paste now and some IOSSO on order, is there much difference between using the JB and IOSSO?

I have seen it destroy accuracy if it is bad enough. Matt

 

[michaelnel]

Well, my IOSSO has not arrived yet, but I decided to go ahead and do a good cleanout with Kroil and JB paste, following Brownells' instructions. This barrel (Criterion 6mm BR 1:8 hand lapped) was supposedly clean. I have been cleaning it with Boretech Eliminator, and occasionally with Boretech C4.

I ran a Kroil-soaked patch down the bore first, followed by a patch on a PH jag with a bunch of JB worked in. Pushed it straight through, it was black... like a charcoal briquette. Another JB patch, stroked back and forth in the first 1/3 of the bore, then on thorough, same thing. Another couple soaked Kroil patches, more black, then grey. Several dry patches, then some Hoppe's #9. Still some black showing, so I repeated the same thing.

Kept getting more black out. Figured I should stop so I don't have to start shooting 7mm bullets in the darn thing!

I've been shooting mostly RL15 in it since I got the barrel, and that stuff shoots pretty dirty.

 

[CJ6]

JB and Kroil . Soak the patch with Kroil ,smear JB on it and short stroke a few patches, a couple patches Kroil only (full push), and a dry patch or 2 then Hoppes #9 (1 patch) and into the case/safe it goes.

 

[fredhorace77]

tag

 

[Alex Wheeler]

Well, my IOSSO has not arrived yet, but I decided to go ahead and do a good cleanout with Kroil and JB paste, following Brownells' instructions. This barrel (Criterion 6mm BR 1:8 hand lapped) was supposedly clean. I have been cleaning it with Boretech Eliminator, and occasionally with Boretech C4.

I ran a Kroil-soaked patch down the bore first, followed by a patch on a PH jag with a bunch of JB worked in. Pushed it straight through, it was black... like a charcoal briquette. Another JB patch, stroked back and forth in the first 1/3 of the bore, then on thorough, same thing. Another couple soaked Kroil patches, more black, then grey. Several dry patches, then some Hoppe's #9. Still some black showing, so I repeated the same thing.

Kept getting more black out. Figured I should stop so I don't have to start shooting 7mm bullets in the darn thing!

I've been shooting mostly RL15 in it since I got the barrel, and that stuff shoots pretty dirty.

It will always come out black. When you feel that roughness in the throat just give it 10 strokes in the first 1/3 of the barrel and push it out. Usually thats all you need to smooth it out again.

 

[michaelnel]

Thanks Alex!

 

[dmoran]

When you get the IOSSO, just like the JB, it will turn black. The IOSSO is white in color in the tube, but turns black when in use. I use the "IOSSO - Triple Action Oil" (as there instructions recommend) on the patches and dry patches to get it out (the black residue).
Donovan

 

[michaelnel]

Thanks Donovan. Oh goody, something else to buy! ;-)

 

[butchlambert]

In the olden days I used Mercury Quick Silver carbon cleaner. When GM was discontinuing the old GM Top Engine cleaner. I still have 2 cases of it. I probably need to take it to the Shilen Swap meet to sell. I have way more than I will ever need.

 

[marwitz89]

Is warthog 1134 still sold, just not available to be shipped?

 

[TimP]

I contacted them about a year ago and at that time it was. I don't remember if it was North or South Dakota but if your in the area you can arrange a pick up.

 

[jsthntn247]

In my 223, I can run a few patches of kg-1 or tm solution down the bore until they come out clean. Run a brush down the bore a few strokes and the next two patches soaked with solvent will be black, then the third and so on will be clean. I can repeat this for hours and the first two patches always will be black. Why is this? I don't have this problem with any other gun, but it shoots excellent.