Talking about case prep...How about primer pockets?

[cocopuff]

With all the chatter about full length-neck sizing etc
what about primer pocket cleaning?
Is it really important to do so? I find no difference
in cleaning or not cleaning..I seat all my primers with
the RCBS bench primer tool,and it gives lots of
seating pressure....So lets hear about the pockets...John

 

[geordiesniper]

I shoot a 284 Shehane in F class and also long range benchrest. I currently do not cut the primer pockets to uniform my cases and also do not clean the primer residue out after each firing. I find that it does not make any improvement accuracy wise as any presumed improvement however great or small is negated by the wind. But if it makes you feel good then do it.
I used to square my primer pockets and clean them religiously after each firing in my 6.5 x 55 Ack Imp, but only found that my primer pockets did not last as long because of the removal of brass, so that is another reason why I do not bother this time with the .284 brass.

 

[jlow]

I don’t think it is seating pressure that is the problem.

First of all, if you don’t uniform the depth of the primer pocket, some of your primers may seat proud i.e. higher than the surface of the case, and this might give you problems in terms of resistance to bolt closing, and incorrect measurements such as OAL, bullet seating depth, etc and for that matter in extreme case you might have problem with misfires as it takes some of the firing pins energy. Not cleaning the pocket will allow build up and this will have the same effect as not uniforming the pocket depth and adding to the problem if you pockets are shallow to begin with.

I have looked inside the pocket after uniforming with the Sinclair carbide bit and it really does not make the pocket deeper, just squaring the sides at the bottom which does not end in a sharp 90 degree angle and this is what your primers will run into and prevent it from seating properly which is below the surface of the case.

Of course, there is also the inside exit of the flash hole which may have burrs and theoretically affect the even conduit of the primer flame to ignite the powder. I use the Sinclair Flash Hole Deburring Tool,

Have never been able to test to see if any of these things actually makes a difference but these are the things people do and their rationale.

 

[necchi]

[quote author=jlow] it really does not make the pocket deeper, just squaring the sides at the bottom which does not end in a sharp 90 degree angle and this is what your primers will run into and prevent it from seating properly which is below the surface of the case.[/quote]

Yup, that's just why I uniform pocket too, just once. After that is the RCBS pocket cleaning brush, it's simply too easy to clean them so why leave crud to build up.?

Of course, there is also the inside exit of the flash hole which may have burrs and theoretically affect the even conduit of the primer flame to ignite the powder.

And I do the inside, many primer holes are punched out at the machine instead of being drilled. A small bit of brass can easily be left hanging on.
I have felt the inside deburr tool knock pieces off many many cases.
It doesn't take allot of pressure to "deburr" a hole. I've seen guys really horse the deburr tool and cut a bunch of brass out. That's not what's needed, all you want is too knock off any small bits, making the inside of the hole smooth.

 

[DennisH]

I uniform the primer pockets, I feel this is an important step, I was told by several well known shooters to do this. I don't know what would happen if I didn't uniform them!

 

[tenring]

I found no need to uniform Lapua pockets. After each firing, I clean them out with the rotating brush on my Chargemaster.

 

[Clod-NC]

Hi Cocopuff
Well,to make it kind of simple,and sort of answer your question on the rebound side,sort of,would you like to buy new cases,whatever the make,that would have primer pockets all filled with soot;would you be willing to pay for them,and then trust them to be any good at shooting accurately?If you are lucky enough to have fired cases 'unsooted'as to the primer pockets,Good,you're a blessed man,if not,then I think you'll have to clean them from now on....I'm sorry for you,but I'm afraid there's no alternative to it,as painful as it looks.

 

[Tozguy]

I have been skipping cleaning of the primer pocket for the last year. Cleaning pockets had been part of my routine for more than 35 years up to that point. Skipping a specific pocket cleaning step was done out of curiousity and not out of laziness. There seems to be a lot of residue that falls out of the pocket automatically along with the spent primer. Then, insertion of a new primer loosens a bit more residue. By placing the case neck down in the block, that residue falls through the flash hole into the block. Any residue that may be left does not seem to matter. My targets have only improved this year.
Primers all seat properly in the Lapua brass and there is no accumulation of residue in the pockets. All this is with small rifle primers and small flash holes.
It seems to me that a bit of soot in the primer pocket is no more of a problem than soot on the case walls or than barrel fouling. The difference is that primer pocket fouling is 'in your face' while the others mentionned are not.

 

[markr]

My old mentor used to say to me..."if you know someone isn't cleaning their primer pockets betwee firings, they may be suspect of not wiping their a$$ either.
In other words, there is no good reason not to clean the primer pockets between firings and it makes you feel better about yourself!

 

[cocopuff]

Only reason I ask the question about CLEANING and not deburing-etc is because the f class shooters I know say it is a waste of time.There is nothing written about how it effects accuracy..Even the guys at the PA 1000 shoots do not clean them as well...I was just courious,is all....I seldom clean mine and still shot the so called bug holes..And as for wipeing my ass of course I do..lol

 

[markr]

Just saying that IMO there is just not a good reason not to! Just like deburring, brushing inside the neck and wiping the neck off before sizing...If you do these things, you will never wonder if that flyer was caused by lack of case prep. Yet many will weigh their powder charges to within .001 or anneal their brass every firing. One without the other does not make sense to me.

 

[Bob3700]

Puff,

I think that cleaning primer pockets is not an accuracy thing but a safety thing. Keeps rounds from going boom when you dont want them too.

If you want to add a step to your reloading for accuracy, try uniforming the inside of your case necks with a mandrel. If you have a factory chamber (or not), I believe this is a beneficial step to consistent neck tension and accuracy.

It is the concept that the Lee mandrel sizing die is made on. You can FL resize your cases and run a mandrel (like the old Lymann M die) into the neck. That makes all the inside case necks the same diameter and provides the same bullet release.

Try it, you may like it.

Bob

 

[40X Guy]

On all my Lapua brass, I leave the primer pockets totally alone and clean only with the Dewey Crocogator. It gets the majority of the debris out and usually after tumbling the pockets are almost totally cleaned up. Winchester and other domestic brass i used to uniform the primer pockets and had every tool known to reloaders to uniform and clean primer pockets. Can't say it made any difference one way or another but as already said, "it made me feel good" But after gravitating to lapua brass and this site I pretty much only use lapua brass and have about shelved all the other calibers I used to shoot because of the lack of quality brass. If plannig a new rifle build I go to the lapua brass chart and go from there.

Frank

 

[Forum Boss]

On all my Lapua brass, I leave the primer pockets totally alone and clean only with the Dewey Crocogator. It gets the majority of the debris out and usually after tumbling the pockets are almost totally cleaned up. --Frank

+1 . This is my procedure. I like the Crocogator because it is virtually indestructible, goes in square, and is double-ended so it works on large/small primer pockets. I used to use an RCBS wire brush tool, but after some use, some of the bristles broke/bent, so it was more awkward to use. The crocogator will also fit inside a plastic film canister along with my caliper-mounted comparator for measuring shoulder bump!

 

[cocopuff]

Puff,

I think that cleaning primer pockets is not an accuracy thing but a safety thing. Keeps rounds from going boom when you dont want them too.

If you want to add a step to your reloading for accuracy, try uniforming the inside of your case necks with a mandrel. If you have a factory chamber (or not), I believe this is a beneficial step to consistent neck tension and accuracy.

It is the concept that the Lee mandrel sizing die is made on. You can FL resize your cases and run a mandrel (like the old Lymann M die) into the neck. That makes all the inside case necks the same diameter and provides the same bullet release.

Try it, you may like it.

Bob

Bob I agree with you about the neck tentiion 100 percent....I can see where this is important..But having to clean the primer pockets is a myth....Unless they are very crudy,I do not see the need to clean them.....

 

[1holeaddict]

On all my Lapua brass, I leave the primer pockets totally alone and clean only with the Dewey Crocogator. It gets the majority of the debris out and usually after tumbling the pockets are almost totally cleaned up. --Frank

+1 . This is my procedure. I like the Crocogator because it is virtually indestructible, goes in square, and is double-ended so it works on large/small primer pockets. I used to use an RCBS wire brush tool, but after some use, some of the bristles broke/bent, so it was more awkward to use. The crocogator will also fit inside a plastic film canister along with my caliper-mounted comparator for measuring shoulder bump!

Gotta get me one of these!!