Switch Barrel - Best torque wrench?

[Leaddog]

I will be switching barrels on my BAT B. Need a good torque wrench. What do you recommend? What torque settings do you use?

Thank you.

 

[fdshuster]

Charlie: Picked up a used Snap-on Heavy duty auto mechanics torque wrench at 200 ft. lbs. The guy retired, had no use for it, so got it for a very good price, way less than what it's worth. Might be able to find one on E-Bay or Amazon or a local garage sale(?) More important to me: "Made in the USA".

I've always set my switch-barrels at 65 ft. lbs., on the advice of my gunsmith. Naturally a fresh light coat of anti-sieze is applied every time.

 

[BoydAllen]

At one time, I was as the saying goes, all about torque wrenches, having overhauled about 30 engines to help defray my college expenses, I would have never even considered not using one for head bolts, main cap bolts, rod bolts and the like, BUT they are not a requirement for switching barrels. I am a big fellow, and have done considerable manual labor in my youth. Using a Kelbly, T handle, through the back, action wrench, I have tightened barrels as tight as can be done, standing beside the stock's butt, flat footed, with an even balance between the up and down pressure applied with my hands even with the ends of the T. There has never been any sign of a problem loosening a barrel after it has been tightened in this manner. If you view the barrel tenon as an 1.062 diameter bolt that you are tightening a nut onto, 65 ft. lb. is a relatively puny number. I am sure that I am well above that. If it makes you feel better, use a torque wrench, but I am convinced that that is all you will be accomplishing, that and enriching the fellow that sold it to you.

 

[johara1]

I too use a t handle, center it and pull it tight. Seems to shoot small that way 8)...jim

 

[Steve Blair]

I torque mine to 40 lb-ft. As Boyd and Jim noted, you can also hand tighten to "heavy snug" and I'm confident that it would work fine. I already had the torque wrench from building VW and Porsche engines, where torque values are dead critical. Some of the cartridges I shoot are probably heavier recoiling than Boyd or Jim's and I have never had a barrel come loose. I use the popular Loctite C5-A copper anti-sieze, but there are many others. BTW, it is a Snap-On, given to me as a gift by a girl friend I let get away.

 

[Leaddog]

All good advice and much appreciated.

And Steve.... About those lost loves... We all have them. Just a bump on memory lane.

Thanks, guys.

 

[fdshuster]

"Enriching the fellow that sold it to you". Yup, he really became "enriched" with that $20 bill in his pocket, now good for about 5 gallons of gasoline.

Kelbly rear entry wrench (at least mine to fit my Panda) cannot be used with a torque wrench, so no choice other than with the T-handle.

The Snap-On torque wrench is used with the Davidson (Rem 700's) and Bat receivers that have the required socket head connection, unlike the Kelbly.

For that matter, a 15" breaker bar could also be used, in place of a torque wrench, for all but factory installed barrels.

Charlie's question concerned torque wrenchs and my response addressed that issue.

 

[BoydAllen]

Obviously , there is more than one way to skin this cat, and of course you are right about which wrench would be required to use a torque wrench, if you take comfort from using one. I might also point out that evidently Kelbly's did not feel the need to sell a wrench that lends itself to being used with a torque wrench. Given their experience, I would say that that in itself is significant.

 

[fdshuster]

And given Bat's experience, they chose to make a rear entry wrench that accomidates a torque wrench, breaker bar, or whatever. Ditto for the Davidson, Holland, and others.

So, they must believe there is some value in using that design.

 

[spclark]

For an action wrench not conpatible with a standard torque wrench (T-handle style) why not take a suitably sized socket then cut two slots to allow it to slip over the T-handle? We're not talking about > 100 ft. lbs. so strength oughtn't be the issue as much as concentricity...?

With proper machining (likely not attempted with a hack saw!) the result ought to be entirely reliable. (All my action wrenches accommodate sockets since I sold off my T2k.)

Since acquiring a (Sears) torque wrench I run my barrels at 40 ft lbs. Too, as I mostly use match sights, applying consistent barrel torque's helpful for ensuring front sight bases are returned to something close to their prior orientation with respect to their rear counterpart.

 

[BoydAllen]

I used one similar to this on a friend's Nesika, and it seemed to do a good job, but I would not want to risk nicking the anodizing around the port on my Viper. On the other hand, for a steel action , in the torque range that we have been discussing, it should be fine. http://www.batmachine.com/products/accessories.htm

 

[4xforfun]

I didn't read all of the replies...I got 1/2 way through Boyd's first post. Agree...100% don't bother with the torque wrench. I change bbls more often than I change my Jockeys!! Spin em till I get the "chunk", then I give it a little bit more with the wrench, and you are done. It takes me less than two min to switch out a tube.

Good luck,
Tod

 

[alf]

I'm with Tod,

I've never used a torque wrench, and all my wrenches are ports.

On a good fitting barrel, screw them on till the touch, back it off, and snap it together. You'll find you have a hell of a time getting them apart w/o a wrench and vise. I just lean into the wrench to snug it and call it a day......

 

[johara1]

I guess you got your answer, I see a lot of heavy hitters have the same idea.These guys above this post are on top of the game....... jim

 

[tenring]

In the past 10 years, I have used two well known BR smiths, and both of them did not torque barrels. One used a rear entry wrench and heaved down rear hard on it; the other used a port wrench, got it tight and then pounded on it with a 5 lb. hammer!! (Be sure to remove scope).

I change my own now, using the second method; then put a black marker witness mark on barrel extending to action so I can see any changes

 

[fdshuster]

tenring: For rifles leaving a gunsmith's shop, after he's worked on it, it's a matter of liability.

One of the gunsmith's I used to use, builds mostly hunting rifles, I was one of his first customers to have him re-barrel a dedicated benchrest rifle and set it up for a switch-barrel. He also never had a torque wrench & when I wanted him to set the barrel at 65 ft. lbs., he was not comfortable with the idea. I had to lend him my torque wrench to set the barrel. All the previous barrels he mounted were set at well over 125 ft. lbs., using a massive breaker bar with the over the receiver V-block clamp. The same setup he would use to remove a factory installed barrel.

I asked him to coat the threads with anti-sieze before mounting the barrel, even providing a small amount for him to use. He put it on dry, and after firing about 350 rounds, and trying to remove the barrel, I could not get it off. Had the torque wrench set at 100 ft. lbs., the maximum I'd go with the rear entry wrench. Had to take the barreled receiver back to him & have him remove the barrel. That's when I discovered dry threads. He no longer does any work for me.

The 'smith I am using now has been building benchrest competition rifles for many years, does not hesitate to do a switch-barrel & in fact, taught me close to everything I now know about them.
He does have a torque wrench & one of his requests was that he compare the settings between my wrench & his, they are exactly the same, and he made that notation in his build records.
Many fear a lawsuit, as do the factories, and I'm sure, on the advice of their lawyers, have been told to put them on as tight as possible.

 

[BoydAllen]

I would agree that if one wants a switch barrel rifle, that choosing a gunsmith who builds them all the time for actual benchrest competition is a must. I am lucky. The fellow who does my barrels is one of the partners in the company that made my action. My PPC reamer lives in a drawer in their shop. When I need a new barrel, I have it shipped to them, call him with instructions as to how I want it done, he ships it to me, and I install it. I have had done five this way. Yes, I know that I am fortunate. Sometimes you get lucky.

 

[fdshuster]

tenring: I also used a witness mark when mounting my barrels. Took a wooden toothpick with a tiny drop of paint on it & put it between the barrel & recoil lug, to the rear of the barrel ident engraving.

Always checked them, but over a 2 year period, never saw the slightest movement & always checked under magnification. A very good idea at least for your own piece of mind, but I'm not doing it anymore.

 

[tenring]

tenring: For rifles leaving a gunsmith's shop, after he's worked on it, it's a matter of liability.

Prior to retirement, I was an insurance claims manager. Every piece turned out by a gunsmith opens him to liability exposure. If he assembles the parts, he is considered a manufacturer of firearms. If he doesn't carry product liability and completed operations coverage, he is taking an ell of a risk.

 

[fdshuster]

tenring: I hear you. But as cautious as he is for installing barrels, super tight, he is one of the few local skilled (and he is good) gunsmith's who will do trigger work, taking them down as low as possible, using factory parts only. Other's will not touch trigger work because of the liability issue.

When he was doing some of my re-barrel jobs he always did 2 test firings, and he kept one fired case with his records of the build(s) and returned the other to me.