stupid newb question

[nwflycaster]

I have a new unfired 6br with a .271 nk. When I checked my new Lapua empty brass it's .267 and it chambers and the bolt closes easily. After adding the powder charge and seating the bullet I am still only at .268 but the bolt will no longer close all the way and lock down. My coal is just under what the Berger bullets reloading manual is calling out for.
What do you think it is that I need to be doing.

 

[Turbulent Turtle]

Seat the bullet deeper.

 

[CatShooter]

Seat the bullet deeper.

What he said...

 

[treeman]

get a hornady lock and load o.a.l. guage and a modified case for your caliber the instructions come with it. saves a lot of headache. you'll feel like this

 

[Clod-NC]

Hi Caster,hi all

Caster,your question isn't in any way stupid....I find it rather interesting,even if it's been asked many times I suppose. But,that is what teaching and learning is made of,asking,answering,then asking then answering,and if it's not enough asking and answering again and again....Good shooting to all,take care.

 

[dickn52]

What treeman said. Check YOUR rifles OAL with the gage. The book is for a starting point and not the gospel in any way. Every gun is slightly different. Sounds like your gun likes them shorter than the book calls for. That's not bad though. You just need to find out and then load accordingly.

 

[nwflycaster]

Bingo, thanks guys. I had to shorten them almost 60/1000ths.

I have a Hornady gauge, but it calls out for measuring a fired case which I don't yet have. I've loaded from 29.2 to 30.7 in 3 tenths increments to test using Varget.

 

[Lapua40X]

Bingo, thanks guys. I had to shorten them almost 60/1000ths.

I have a Hornady gauge, but it calls out for measuring a fired case which I don't yet have. I've loaded from 29.2 to 30.7 in 3 tenths increments to test using Varget.

IMO that's a little hot for a starting point with the 6BR.

 

[Area Man]

IMO that's a little hot for a starting point with the 6BR.

According to Hodgdon on-line data, starting at 29.2 gr would be ok except for bullets >90 gr (and a 62 gr BAR VG).

I don't see where the OP stated what bullet he was loading.

 

[Lapua40X]

IMO that's a little hot for a starting point with the 6BR.

According to Hodgdon on-line data, starting at 29.2 gr would be ok except for bullets >90 gr (and a 62 gr BAR VG).

I don't see where the OP stated what bullet he was loading.

Nor do any of us know what bullet he is loading. But the Hodgdon data is for 6BR Remington. We also don't know if that's the 6BR cartridge he's shooting. If his bullet is long enough to generate a chambering conflict it's likely he's loading something heavier than 90 grains. My goal is to make certain he's got all the accurate data necessary to produce a safe and successful load.

 

[nwflycaster]

It's a 6br norma and the bullet was Berger 105 vld target. Shot today with no signs of excessive pressure. The smallest group was 5 shots just under an inch at 300 yds and 30.4 grains. I need to take some measurements next and pick up a comparator and find the best seating depth. 30.1 wasn't very impressive but 30.7 wasn't too bad, just not as good as the 30.4. wondering of I should keep going a little hotter to test that, or test further between 30.2 and 30.6

 

[Lapua40X]

It's a 6br norma and the bullet was Berger 105 vld target. Shot today with no signs of excessive pressure. The smallest group was 5 shots just under an inch at 300 yds and 30.4 grains. I need to take some measurements next and pick up a comparator and find the best seating depth. 30.1 wasn't very impressive but 30.7 wasn't too bad, just not as good as the 30.4. wondering of I should keep going a little hotter to test that, or test further between 30.2 and 30.6

Congratulations. Looks like you're well within the ball park of what your rifle likes. Of course, "hotter" doesn't necessarily mean more accurate. If 30.7 wasn't as good as 30.4 I'd expect the node to be in that 30.4 range. My 6BR Norma shows pressure signs at 30 grain loads of Varget with 107 gr Sierra pills without neck turning.

 

[nwflycaster]

Does this make sense?
Still using new brass I went back and fired 5 each 5 shot groups in 1/10th grain increments filling in the gap from 30.2 - 30.6
Of the five groups three had a single flier that opened them up from .64" (4shots 300 yds) to 1.4", 1.4" and 2.2". the other two groups were 1.31" and 1.33".

I hadn't measured to the lands until returning today, and I'm not sure I did it right from my numbers. I used a Sinclair seating gauge and followed the directions, but here is why I'm wondering.

I seated all original shots deeper because the bolt wouldn't close (thanks all for that tip by the way). After returning today I measured the fired brass and a bullet according to the directions on for the Sinclair tool. After doing the math I have a difference of 150/1000 from where the bolt closed on the originals to what I show as the lands depth.
Now I've loaded up another 25 rounds using once fired brass this time using the numbers From the Sinclair depth gauge and loaded 5 jammed 10/1000, 5 at lands, 5 jumping 10/1000, 5 jumping 20/1000 and 5 jumping 30/1000.

Another thing that seems strange to me is when I measure the 30/1000 jump, the ogyve is just barely short of going inside the case when measuring.

Does all this seem right to you?
The bullet is Berger 105 VLD

 

[gotcha]

It seems right if you have a very short throat. If you chamber a cartridge that is supposed to be .005" into the lands do you get an imprint of the lands on the bullet? Abrade the bullet w/ Steel wool to make it dull and the lands will appear as bright spots. The width of the bright spot should approximate the distance into the lands. No dumb questions on this forum. Can't always say the same for the answers

 

[nwflycaster]

Now I'm confused again. I loaded up what I thought was the best charge with the seating depths mentioned above in my last post and hit the range this morning. Nothing worked worth a darn, pretty much all of my fire forming loads worked superior than what I thought would be my final workup. here were the five groups:

10/1000 jammed 2.36"
touching 1.93"
10/1000 jump 1.51"
20/1000 jump 1.48"
30/1000 jump 1.57"
Not one of the groups even had two shots touching

I can't seat any deeper or I wouldn't even be able to check ogyve length as it's about to disappear into the case. Maybe I did the measuring wrong and I should be going longer. If I did measure correctly why would loads that would measure 159/1000 into the lands before closing the bolt on them work that much better than workups.

What would be your next step if this was you?

 

[gotcha]

If you can answer the question I posed it would be a good start. Not trying to be a wise guy.

 

[Lapua40X]

Are you using "gotcha"'s method for determining when you're into the lands? If you take your calipers and open them up to .010 you can see how, when moving a tapered bullet into the lands, it doesn't take much "push" to overshoot their starting point. It's critical to be able to read the marks on the bullet to determine where the contact begins and how far, if at all, you might have pushed past the initial contact point. "Jammed" is somewhat easier to read because the depth of the "jam" is essentially the length of the mark on the prepared bullet surface.

 

[nwflycaster]

I came by the measurement using a Sinclair bullet seating gauge tool. I did what the instructions listed by dropping a bullet into the chamber and sliding on a device that sits in the recess where the bolt closes, then inserting a steel rod through it until it just touches the base of the bullet (not pressing on it) next I inserted the ring that you tighten down on the rod against where the device sits on the bolt recess. I next popped out the bullet and set it aside and dropped in a fired case (with fired primer still), then slid the other locking ring on the rod and re inserted it through the device and lowered it until it was just touching the case. Then tightened that lock ring in place, pulled the rod back out and measured form outside to outside on the rings as per instructions and wrote that number down, retrieved the bullet used on the prior measurement and measured its length, added figures together and according to the instructions that number should be length from case bottom to the lands.

 

[BoydAllen]

Actually, it is the length from the case head to the tip of that bullet, then you load one with the same bullet and take a measurement using a tool that measures from the ogive to the head of the case. That is the useful measurement for the setup of a seater, + or - how far you want to be into or off the lands.

 

[nwflycaster]

I still think I'm reading it correctly. I says to take the measurements as I stated before then steps 9 and 10 are as follows:

9) You now have the stops set to duplicate the distance from the head of the cartridge/bolt face to the base of the bullet. Measure this distance from the outside of the two large diameter steps.

10) Now measure the length of the same bullet you used in step 3, add this figure to the measurement you received from step 9. The result will be the overall cartridge length, measured from the case head to the bullet point. These measurements will produce a loaded round that will have the bullet just touching the rifling.

I also see below where it says to load a dummy round and check the measurements and will do that. After confirming my numbers I think my next step will be to go with a jump of 10/1000 and return and do a load charge range from 28 grains this time up to 30.5 again.