Stuck on getting stuck...

[Dave Armento]

I am new to the reloading forum and I just attempted to load my first set of rounds. I have a 22-.250 Cooper, and I am trying to reload Hornaday brass. I necksiized them with an RCBG single stage, then put new large primers in, then 33 grains of 4895, then seated them with Hornaday bullets. I fired two rounds. With each round, the brass would not extract, and I had to tap the bolt back out with a rubbber mallet to get it unstuck. When I fired factory rounds after trying my own rounds, the fired fine. By the way, the two rounds I reloaded were very accurate, so that was not a problem.

So the question is this - what would be the reason for the brass getting stuck in the chamber after firing my reload rounds? Do I need to trim down the length more, or neck size them deeper, or what? I am very confused and frustrated. Has this ever happened to other members? I thought I was being really really meticulous about my reloading process. Maybe I should just purchase fresh unfired brass and quit trying to recondition my used brass....

any help is greatly appreciated!!!! thanks

 

[jimcasey01]

Dave,
I am not familiar with the load data for your round, so I can not speak of pressure/over pressure in this instance, another member may chime in with info. Since this is previously fired brass, try chambering a few pieces of the brass without a bullet or primer. I suspect that the brass is too large (diameter) for your chamber or extremely close to maximum diameter, prior to firing. I would suggest full length sizing of the brass, every time that you load it, which probably will cure your problems. Good luck.
Jim

 

[Barlow]

Dave, You didn't say what weight bullet you used, though I just checked a Hornady manual and it doesn't appear to be hot with 45-60 gr bullets. Is the brass new or once fired? Did you check case length and trim to spec if needed? Did they chamber fine or were they tight going in? If it were me I would FL size the cases and not set the shoulder back too far (.002), try less powder, & check primer fit. Generally hard bolt lift is an indication of too much gunpowder. Others will chime in. Barlow

 

[RemingtonAI]

I think they key question is, where did you get the brass? Did you buy new factory ammo, shoot it, and now have the left over brass? Or did you buy once fired, or new brass? Without knowing, it sounds like what would happen if you tried to reload once fired brass that was originally fired in someone else's rifle.
Like they said above, size it how ever you size it, see if the casing will load into the chamber and close the bolt. If it doesn't , then at least you wont have to go through the whole reloading process to assess whether you have fixed the problem or not. Jesse

 

[Preacher]

If the factorys come out OK but the reloads don't, that right there tells you something.
Full length size them with attention to the shoulder being pushed back just enough to be able to chamber without pressure.
Run the die out of the press a ways and then keep tweaking it down a little at a time till your sized cases chamber with very little resistance...
Pull the firing pin assembly out of the bolt and you can feel how tight the case is in the chamber, when you close the bolt.....
I like the empty bolt handle to fall about half way down on a nicely sized case before it starts to feel tight, then a tiny bit of pressure will drop it all the way down..
Give it a try, you'll be happy with the results...

 

[jlow]

There is a lots of information missing in your post that we need for us to help you.

First and foremost, how did you end up with that load in terms of powder charge? I am assuming that as in all safe reloading practice, you must have started low and worked up to this charge weight? If so, you need to lead us through what else you have done and what you saw BEFORE you got to this point.

 

[22BRGUY]

If the factorys come out OK but the reloads don't, that right there tells you something.
Full length size them with attention to the shoulder being pushed back just enough to be able to chamber without pressure.
Run the die out of the press a ways and then keep tweaking it down a little at a time till your sized cases chamber with very little resistance...
Pull the firing pin assembly out of the bolt and you can feel how tight the case is in the chamber, when you close the bolt.....
I like the empty bolt handle to fall about half way down on a nicely sized case before it starts to feel tight, then a tiny bit of pressure will drop it all the way down..
Give it a try, you'll be happy with the results...

The 22 250 cartridge is prone to something called "case head separation" problems because of it's design. What Preacher said here is the right way to prevent that problem by not pushing the shoulder back too far, just far enough to chamber with slight resistance at the end of bolt down travel.
Welcome and best wishes and don't give up.

 

[dedogs]

Dave, As was said above, we need more information.
1) Is this once fired brass or new?
2) What length did you trim this brass to?
3) Did you trim brass before re-sizing or after?
4) When you say you neck sized this brass, was this done with a bushing neck die or a full length bushing die?
5) What bullet are you shooting and what is the COAL (length from tip of bullet to base of cartridge) of a loaded round?
6)This ? may be difficult to answer but I would like you to pull the bullets from 2 of your re-loads, dump the powder and measure the case length (making sure the primer is properly seated below the base of the case). Please report back this measurement.
7)Whose re-loading manual are you using?
8)Are there any marks at the bottom of your fired re-loads and are the fired primers really flat compared to fired factory rounds?

It sounds to me as if you have a high pressure situation and we need the above ?s answered in order to help you narrow it down. Please report back and feel free to ask more questions in return. dedogs

 

[expiper]

OP ,,,if the factory loads extract properly and your "loads" do not ,,yours are either not sized to fit your chamber properly or you have tooooo much powder in em.....Roger

 

[Dave Armento]

Thanks everyone who has replied so far. I don't know where I would be without the advice of people with experience in this area. Just to add a little more info..... I am using 35 grains of Hodgdon 4895 and Sierra Match Kin 52 grain boat tail bullets. I am seating them at the max overall length that is recommended by the Lee Collet necksizing die manual that came with the product...this material is recommending a max overall length of 2.35 inches, which is what I am seating them at. Also, the brass is once-fired Hornaday V-Max brass. Not sure if that helps solve the mystery......thanks again for the advice....

 

[Barlow]

Dave, Your op stated you used 33 gr of 4895, your last post says 35 gr of 4895, that's a big difference! Check your data, and start low. Barlow

 

[jlow]

Thanks everyone who has replied so far. I don't know where I would be without the advice of people with experience in this area. Just to add a little more info..... I am using 35 grains of Hodgdon 4895 and Sierra Match Kin 52 grain boat tail bullets. I am seating them at the max overall length that is recommended by the Lee Collet necksizing die manual that came with the product...this material is recommending a max overall length of 2.35 inches, which is what I am seating them at. Also, the brass is once-fired Hornaday V-Max brass. Not sure if that helps solve the mystery......thanks again for the advice....

The new added info is certainly useful but we still have no idea how you ended up with that load.

 

[Dave Armento]

Dave, As was said above, we need more information.
1) Is this once fired brass or new?
2) What length did you trim this brass to?
3) Did you trim brass before re-sizing or after?
4) When you say you neck sized this brass, was this done with a bushing neck die or a full length bushing die?
5) What bullet are you shooting and what is the COAL (length from tip of bullet to base of cartridge) of a loaded round?
6)This ? may be difficult to answer but I would like you to pull the bullets from 2 of your re-loads, dump the powder and measure the case length (making sure the primer is properly seated below the base of the case). Please report back this measurement.
7)Whose re-loading manual are you using?
8)Are there any marks at the bottom of your fired re-loads and are the fired primers really flat compared to fired factory rounds?

It sounds to me as if you have a high pressure situation and we need the above ?s answered in order to help you narrow it down. Please report back and feel free to ask more questions in return. dedogs

Thanks for your excellent questions ... here are the answers...

It is once-fired brass - Hornaday V-Max 55 grain
To trim the brass, I bought a Frankford Arms trimming machine. You press the brass into the unit and it shaves off brass. Not sure I am using the system perfectly. I did not measure the shells after trimming them. I am not sure how long they should be.
I trimmed the brass BEFORE re-sizing it.
I used a Lee Precision Neck Sizing die, not a full length die. I read somewhere that using neck-sizing die gives longer brass life.
I took the bullets from 2 of my reloads and measured them, as you suggested... the first is 1.892 inches, the second is 1.906 inches.
I am not using a manual...I am just using Youtube videos.
My primers are pretty flat after I seat them. I am using the RGBS rockchucker to seat the primers. There are no marks on the bottom of the loads.

One potentially important other piece of info is this - on the second round, the primer fell out of the brass.

Thanks again for your excellent help...hoping I can get to the point where I can successfully reload and shoot my own ammo.....

 

[M-61]

First thing is to NOT fire any more of your reloads until you find the problem, which you will.
Between the mallet and the primer falling out there is obviously something wrong therefore stop shooting these reloads.
This 'once fired brass'....I may have missed it but was this fired in YOUR rifle?

 

[Dave Armento]

Dave, Your op stated you used 33 gr of 4895, your last post says 35 gr of 4895, that's a big difference! Check your data, and start low. Barlow

Thanks - One thing I am learning is you have to be really precise.... I think I need to measure the powder put into each bullet on the scale, and not trust the dispensing machine. I also need to trim the brass down to the exact right length before loading it. It seems like you have to be accurate to within hundredths of inches and single grains..... I wish I could figure out the maximum allowable length on the brass....

 

[/VH]

Dave, As was said above, we need more information.
1) Is this once fired brass or new?
2) What length did you trim this brass to?
3) Did you trim brass before re-sizing or after?
4) When you say you neck sized this brass, was this done with a bushing neck die or a full length bushing die?
5) What bullet are you shooting and what is the COAL (length from tip of bullet to base of cartridge) of a loaded round?
6)This ? may be difficult to answer but I would like you to pull the bullets from 2 of your re-loads, dump the powder and measure the case length (making sure the primer is properly seated below the base of the case). Please report back this measurement.
7)Whose re-loading manual are you using?
8)Are there any marks at the bottom of your fired re-loads and are the fired primers really flat compared to fired factory rounds?

It sounds to me as if you have a high pressure situation and we need the above ?s answered in order to help you narrow it down. Please report back and feel free to ask more questions in return. dedogs

dedogs,

If you're going to walk him through this; I just want to mention as a reminder, don't forget the chamfer/deburr step as I have never seen a Frankford Arms trimming machine and don't know whether it takes care of that or not.

 

[Dave Armento]

First thing is to NOT fire any more of your reloads until you find the problem, which you will.
Between the mallet and the primer falling out there is obviously something wrong therefore stop shooting these reloads.
This 'once fired brass'....I may have missed it but was this fired in YOUR rifle?

Yes - the brass for the reloads I made was once-fired brass that was shot from my rifle.... Yes I agree with your opinion.... I am pretty paranoid about shooting any more of the loads I made. I think I am going to try to do make some loads with brand new brass, and use the minimum amount of gunpowder that they recommend. Hopefully this will produce loads that will not seize up in the chamber.....thanks for your advice....

 

[BoydAllen]

Get a manual. Use a scale for each charge. A trickler will speed things up here. Work up your load in steps, starting at minimum and increasing by small amounts. For this cartridge I would suggest increments of .4 gr. Get a FL die, and learn how to set it properly for shoulder bump. Do not follow manufacturers' instructions telling you to set the die to touch the shell holder and then screw in some more. That will likely lead to case head separations after a few loadings. I looked up your load on line, and it is near max. How many shots on this barrel and how do you clean. The reason that I ask is that if you have not cleaned adequately, you could have some hard carbon in the chamber throat that would increase pressure. One cannot reasonably expect to only neck size cases that are loaded to near max pressures, but if they chamber easily, the cause of your extraction issue is likely pressure, unless you see signs of a rough chamber. Pictures of your fired and sized brass should give us some clues about whether this might be the case. Your ability to throw sufficiently accurate charges with a powder measure is directly linked to the shape and size of the powder granules. I have a lot of experience reloading, and using a powder measure, and I would not depend on thrown charges if I were using that powder. If you want something easy to throw with reasonable accuracy, something like H380 (a fine ball powder) would be more suitable.

 

[whocanitbenow]

If you want to save the projectiles from the rounds you have made, go buy a bullet puller and knock them out. This way you can save projectiles, recover your powder, and still have a primed case to start over.

 

[jonbearman]

Dave for Gods sake get the new Lyman reloading manual as it is a good teaching tool before you get hurt or blinded or worse. You need to read it and familiarize yourself with proper loading technique before you proceed. This is a no joke hobby. I watcghed my cousin who thought he knew what he was doing blow up a M1 Garand worth a lot of money because of high primers(not seated right) and that is only one story as I can tell you other horror storys. Spend 25.00 and get the manual and learn before you dive right in. Please take my advice sir as I want you to enjoy the fun of reloading without accidents. Your mechanical scale, do you know how to level it? I am absolutely not trying to be condescending with any of my advice, just trying to put it in perspective.