Stuck Bolt

[Link]

I'm sorry but when they make a custom reamer and the plus or minus is .0005 and they pretty much know what size a certain off the shelf b/d is why would anyone make the chamber smaller than the die? Yes I know you can send fired brass and have special dies made for that chamber then throw away the dies when you re chamber. Or grind the bottom of the b/d off and get comp shell holders. For those of you who know what you are doing and order a tight chamber, all is well n good. However for Ol dumb me it's just another thing to deal with. I had my ppc re barreled and none of my just broke in brass would re size enough to chamber. So I ordered $300 worth or prepared turned brass [ which is great, nice job ] Just a pain to figure and more unanticipated expense. I guess I'm just a KISS guy.
Respectfully Link

 

[cblanchard]

If you didn't have any problems with the factory FGMM maybe your issue is with your FL die not sizing it far enough. I believe I read an article on this site of someone needing to have a 6br die machined shorter because it wasn't sizing enough. I ran into the same issue with a 260 die.

 

[Webster]

Is it reamer dimensions or how far the reamer went into the barrel?

 

[eww1350]

Anneal the brass even if it is new or once fired...you may be surprised that it solves your problem...I saw this same problem with a newly chambered 30BR barrel and new "Blue Box" Lapua brass...the owner was preplexed that the loaded round was hard going in and coming out after firing...I annealed 5 pieces if the problem brass and it worked butter smooth going in and out...lesson learned even new brass can be brittle...


Eddie in Texas

 

[DP003]

I'm headed to the range this weekend with less powder in the rounds and see if that solves my problem. I hope there is another node at the low end because the original one was awesome in my opinion... just couldnt eject some of them. If not, I'm just going to get the smith to recut the chamber. To webster, I'm not sure. Sounds to me like it didn't go into the barrel far enough. I may not be the brightest crayon in the box but my logic tells me that if the bolt closed on the go gauge, then its in spec, although probably on the minimum side... thanks for all the input... carry on...

 

[Webster]

Your original post said the bolt closed on the go head space gauge with force. You should be able to close it with one finger and zero force.
There is a better video somewhere on internet showing chambering with a lathe.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ErVOUVszFjY

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1d989VrW_70

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C4PBhiUwEhw

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EaaeOP2DACE

 

[Albany Mountain]

I had the same problem whereas a small base die fixed everything. On a Remington 700 shooting acceptable loadings.

 

[amlevin]

You should be able to close it with one finger and zero force.

Provided that this is being done with a fully stripped bolt. Firing pin, ejector and extractor removed.

 

[CatShooter]

You should be able to close it with one finger and zero force.

Provided that this is being done with a fully stripped bolt. Firing pin, ejector and extractor removed.

The extractor can stay.

 

[fguffey]

“Or should I bump my shoulder a little more? I seek thee advices...”

I do not know what press, die and shell holder you are using. Then there is “bump a little more”, next comes the “like he barely got the go gauge to close”. There is no such measurement as ‘barely’, the bolt closes by advancing, it is possible for a few to measure the advance, it is possible for a few to measure the length of the go-gage. Between the advance, length of the gage and bolt close a very few can determine ‘how short’ the chamber is. I only know of one smith that used one gage to determine the length of a chamber (in .000), he used the field reject gage.

Barely? The difference between the length of the go-gage and the length of the case is .004”, then there is the advise against forcing the bolt closed on a go-gage. The length of the chamber is referred to as go-gage length, the length of the case is referred to as being minimum length/full length sized. Not a big problem but I recommend you measure the length of new ammo before firing, logic says if the new ammo chambered you could use the new ammo dimensions when sizing fired cases.

http://www.saami.org/PubResources/CC_Drawings/Rifle/308%20Winchester.pdf

F. Guffey

 

[fguffey]

After 28 responses the OP should have am answer. This is another question about the length of the chamber, head space, a good understanding of datums and how head space is measured.

DP003, I use a 280 Remington case to measure the length of a 30/06 chamber, or I use a field reject gage, in the perfect world the field reject for a 30/06 chamber will prevent the bolt from closing by .011” when used with a perfect go-gage length chamber. “like he barely got the go gauge to close”? The 1.622” measurement from the datum to the case head in no where near an acceptable measurement for the case and or chamber, meaning, without knowing what ‘barely’ represents as a value. SAAMI list a case length from a .400” datum.

The chamber list a length from the datum to the bolt face of 1.630 for a minimum and 1.640 for a maximum. Back to a tight chamber, your cases are measuring from the datum to the case head of 1.620, your cases are shorter than the minimum length of the chamber by .008”, an opinion, you have a short chambered barrel that was not chambered. A smith should have the ability to determine just how short a short chambered barrel is, a good indication the smith is a little light on shop skills should be obvious when he expresses a value as ‘barely’.

It is possible to size cases for short chambers, I do it all the time, problem the die, press and shell holder, as a group is designed to return the case to minimum length, also know as full length sized. I form cases for short chambers by reducing the length of the case ‘by as much” as .017”, that is .012” shorter than a go-gage length chamber.

F. Guffey
.

 

[fguffey]

I am with Catshooter, the extractor can stay, and the firing pin etc..

 

[DP003]

fguffey, while I understand what you are saying, I think you have too much faith in my measuring tools. Its my fault for not disclosing this. I am using Hornady's comparator inserts to measure headspace on the cases. Like I'm sure you know, this is literally a comparator and not a dead on balls accurate measuring device like a precision machined go gauge. I did measure the opening and it is .400" but the insert is aluminum and many threads that I've read say these things are off due to a slight rounding on the lip of the opening. The average I've seen is about .007" and a couple say they have up to .012". The only way I could tell exactly how far mine is off is if I had a go-gauge, which I do not (thats how people have found out how far off their comparators are, by measuring a go gauge with it). Also, the RSBC calipers that I have are accurate to .001". While you are absolutely correct that "barely" doesn't represent a value, I doubt if the chamber were .001" short that the smith could have closed the bolt even with force. Doesn't make sense to me that you can compress the steel .001". The man said the go gauge closed and he has been a smith for 25 years. For reference, a new FGMM round measures 1.621" with my system and an unfired lapua case measures 1.6215". Since those rounds are loaded slightly below minimum, I'm assuming my chamber is in spec when I measure a fired case at 1.622". Some people I read have made their own comparator inserts out of stainless steel to be actual measuring devices, but I'm not a machinist. The barrel is not short chambered, or at least I didn't buy it short chambered, it was a Krieger HV.

Thanks for all the ideas fellas. I think I'm going back to the basics of lowering my charge first. I'm shooting tomorrow so I'll update then.

 

[fguffey]

"For reference, a new FGMM round measures 1.621" "

And you said you measured the diameter to be .400", The .400" works if the hole does not have a radius, if the hole has a radius the datum is below the plain (measured from), meaning the hole through the bushing must have a sharp edge with no rounding of the edge.

The 1.621" measurement for Federal Gold Medal Match is short, SAAMI 'says' 1.627 minimum to 1.634 maximum, that leaves .006" difference, then the bushing, if the bushing with the has a radius it's contribution the the error you could indicate you are getting closer.

I believe in transfers and standards. Going by the book of SAAMI requires everyone and thing use one standard, the radius prevents your readings to agree.. Your comparator does not have to agree with SAMMI, you could use a head space gage to verify your comparator.

More complicated to use is the Wilson case gage. Instead of using a datum with a sharp edge it uses a radius, the shoulder at the bottom of the Wilson case gage is convexed .

F. Guffey

 

[BoydAllen]

I have played with using a Stoney Point (now Hornady) comparitor with a GO gauge to look at fired brass, and it works just fine, because you are using the same tool to make a comparison. Recently I ordered a 6PPC GO gauge for a friend, and had a chance to play with it a little before giving it to him. To me, it was interesting to see how several barrels chambered with my reamer "looked like". As it turns out, they were just as my smith had said they were. I already new that they were virtually identical, since I am able to use the same brass for all of them.

 

[amlevin]

Want a real accurate gauge, just have your gunsmith cut piece of barrel stock (perhaps from the piece he cut off the blank to create your barrel) using the same reamer he used to chamber your barrel. Finish the end like the wilson gauges with min/max steps. A case gauge that absolutely matches that rifle's chamber, not a one size fits all in the same caliber.

I've seen several examples of these at the range, some even have "windows" cut so the user can see the seated bullet in relation to the "lands".