STILL having runout issues

[HolyMeekrob]

So I've posted before about runout which I thought might be coming from turning. (I've ultimately decided that was just 'revealing' runout that already existed) The general response was to fire form the brass and it would all be good. Well it didn't help much, so I figured it was the remington brass I was using, and I've since found and started using LC. However even though this brass is definitely better quality, I'm still having the same trouble. It's been fired and neck sized twice (some no turn and some turned), and now the third round of reloads still shows significant runout, about .005" or worse. Where is this coming from??? I haven't run it through a sizing die yet, but that never seemed to help with the remington anyway. Also the remington did eventually square up to acceptable levels, but that wasn't until after 4-5 firings, which not only leaves me little brass life, but is also gets damned expensive just to square up some brass.
I don't think it's in my reloading process (Which is to FL size every 3-4 and neck size in between, and I use an inline seater) which is actually leaving me wondering if maybe this is coming from my chamber? But I'd think if that were the case the sizing die would take care of it.
I'm at a complete loss. If there are any ideas they would be appreciated, or perhaps someone who experiences little runout could explain what they do differently. Anything to give me an idea what I'm missing.


On a side note, what's with the verification questions? Are we honestly making sure someone knows what MOA and LOP are before they can post?

 

[necchi]

"which is actually leaving me wondering if maybe this is coming from my chamber? "
1st question to mind is what is the runout comming out of the chamber before any sizing?

 

[Kenny474]

In response to the MOA and LOP, if you are using a mobile device to post, it may have something to do with it. If you are using a public wi-fi or different internet source than you normally do, this may cause it as well. If you are using your home network and still have the issue, speak to the Forum Boss, he will help you.

But the questions are there so we don't get spammers joining and posting nonsense as we did in September and I believe October.

I don't get the questions, so I think it's related to the server or network your using as it may be public or have some other issue.
Kenny

 

[Erik Cortina]

You said you have .005" runout before sizing, that sounds like it's your chamber. They should come out with .001" or less from your chamber. Mine usually run about .0005" or less, and after sizing and seating I usually end up with a loaded round that has about .001" or less runout.

If you start with run out, it's hard to end without runout.

 

[BoydAllen]

If your brass eventually squares up I would think that the chamber is not the culprit. Tell us about your sizing equipment. What kind of dies are you using? What caliber?

 

[Erik Cortina]

He said he had .005" before sizing, so, dies have nothing to do with it.

The part that I dont understand is that he said eventually the brass straightens out. ???

 

[Kenny474]

It's an AR-15 using Remington brass in .223.

His previous thread:
http://www.accurateshooter.com/forum/index.php/topic,3748964.msg35868062.html#msg35868062


I have heard that some of the AR's with chrome lined chambers will have issues with run-out from the plating not being evenly applied or effecting chamber dimensions because metal is first removed and then built back up during the plating process.

Just seems strange that after 5 firings the brass becomes straight.

Kenny

 

[15Tango]

Neck sizing only on an AR? uh . . .

Do you have another AR, upper or some other .223 you can run the stuff through to eliminate that particular chamber? I'd have a hard time measuring brass from an AR after firing, that brass gets beat up upon firing and ejecting no matter what.

Wayne

 

[HolyMeekrob]

Above: Don't worry, I wouldn't be neck sizing only if it was giving me feeding issues. But, yeah, it's tough to get a runout reading after firing. I catch the brass instead of letting it fly so the necks are minimally damaged, still they typically have nicks, I think, from the feed ramps, and dents behind the shoulder from the deflector. So it's hard to filter out the 'noise'. Nevertheless the runout seems to be in the range of .001-.003 out of the chamber.
I'm using wilson dies to neck size and seat and in my experience whatever the runout was going into the dies is unchanged coming out, so I'm willing to accept the possibility it's the dies, but I doubt it.
As to the rifle, this is a SS hbar, no chrome lining. It's a pretty loose chamber if that might cause an issue.

 

[Kenny474]

Is the rifle producing acceptable accuracy? If it's accurate, then maybe your just looking too far into it. I never bothered to try improving my AR-10, as it grouped under 1/2" regularly, and had TIR between .003 and .006 on loaded rounds with Winchester brass. I think some of this was due to the beating it took on ejection, as I used the adjustable gas block to turn the gas down enough that it didn't eject my Lapua brass, and TIR improved to .002-.004 on loaded rounds. I never measured TIR before sizing though.

Maybe look into disabling the gas system so it doesn't eject to see what the brass looks like without getting beat up on ejection? Just a thought.

Good luck, hope it all works out for you.

Kenny

 

[HolyMeekrob]

I agree, who cares if it's pretty or perfect as long as it shoots, and I do have a good load for the 69gr's, still working on 77 and 80s. But I've been playing pretty exclusively with my AR and my concern is that any issues I'm having with technique now will translate into other rifles/calibers.

 

[brxbrad]

Are you shooting competition? I dont think it makes a whole lot of difference until you get out to that 600yrd mark. If your'e not having any problems with the gun other than .005 runout, shoot the heck out of it and have fun.

 

[kdvarmint]

Definitely not an expert, but is your expander plug in your sizer die centered? Just a thought.