Stainless tumbling or ultrasonic?

[Artisan]

Don't know how these will work for cleaning out the primer pockets or if they will get stuck in any of the different size cases I process. Here's what they look like.

Magnetic SS chips. The commercial brass cleaners use these.
Something else I was wondering, the manufacturers of these wet pin tumblers put timers on them, but more importantly why didn't they put a speed adjuster (potentiometer) on the different models. I've added one to mine because it spins to fast when using dry media in it.
More food for thought. When getting into wet tumbling, I pondered the drying process. Heard from many, on all the way possible. I did use my wife's food dehydrator, which worked really well since it is a commercial model with metal shelves. But found the boiling hot water faster with less machines or mess or time involved.
I had considered making an air dryer for the wet brass. For about $50-$75 one can make a real nice model which will last for quite some time. I've only seen one, but it was to small and only did 50 cases at a pop. My thought was similar.
Build the frame out of light weight aluminum angle. Easy to work with and cut to fit. Use 4 small square plastic loading case holders. So you can still use them for loading (dual purpose). The ones which are square, small and hold 50 cases. Drill about a 1/4" hole all the way through, in the middle of the hole which holds the case in the tray. The trays should have holes on both sides for every case imaginable. The drilled hole is for air flow to go through the case. Make the frame to set 4 of the 50 cases trays as close together as possible. Under the trays, mounted to the frame will be 4-140mm computer case fans, which run on 12 volts. The 140mm fan is almost the same size as the loading trays. The fans, splitter and converter can be bought at Newegg.com. Take and wire the 4 fans to a fan controller which will control at least 4 fans. This way you can adjust the speed of drying with the fans. The fan controller will wire to a converter, to convert the 12 volt to 110 volt, to plug in any house receptacle. I was once going to manufacture these but I would have had to sell them for about $100 plus add shipping. Didn't think there would be a market for them. You would be able to air dry 200 cases at a time for pennies with the 12 volts and still use the 4 trays for hand-loading, since they just sit there and not attached to anything. The 140mm fans are super quiet, so not really much noise to speak of. They can be bought in a 4-pack also. The fans mounted underneath the trays will blow the air up through the drilled holes and into the cases, either the primer hole or if you can mount neck down, it might be a plus?

 

[justpassinthru]

I like to wet tumble before annealing. Seems easier for me to see the color change when the right temperature is reached.
A food dehydrator works well for drying the brass.

 

[338 dude]

Rice that Orkan recommends works really well in the SST Rebel 17. No drying time, no case neck peening (although that is mainly an overfull or overtime situation with pins) and a bit better results on paper and chrono. I run it for 2-3 hours and primer pockets are reasonably clean. I'm beginning to lean more towards the 2 hour mark as being enough.

I normally run mine for two hours I’m thinking about cutting down to an hour and a half

 

[Straightshooter1]

Most of the time I'm cleaning with rice and find it does a good job at around 90 minutes, though I clean the primer pockets with a pocket uniformer before hand.

Whenever I use my wet tumbler with SS pins, any peening is a non issue for me with bottle neck cases as the trimming is done as the very last thing in my case prep as cleans up the case mouths.

 

[338 dude]

Most of the time I'm cleaning with rice and find it does a good job at around 90 minutes, though I clean the primer pockets with a pocket uniformer before hand.

Whenever I use my wet tumbler with SS pins, any peening is a non issue for me with bottle neck cases as the trimming is done as the very last thing in my case prep as cleans up the case mouths.

Exactly my thoughts all the peening of the case mouths that I see and they mention about ruining their prep work does not make sense to me

 

[BDman]

The SS "rice" has proven to me, at least, that it's a royal pita. It gets everywhere and I don't want it near any of my firearms.

 

[David Christian]

I have wet tumbled for several years now and have found it to be very effective, as long as I thoroughly rinse and dry the brass. I landed on 90 minutes per batch of 100, as that seemed to be the minimum time to clean the primer pockets, enough. I don’t get much peening, but also giraud my brass post cleaning so it does not matter.

At the end of the day all that matters to me is how well my brass shoots? If my ES over a 20 shot string averages around 20 or less, all is good. If it is higher, something is wrong in my brass prep process.

 

[Fire Dog]

For the issue of pins sticking inside cases after tumbling. Give the smaller size SS media from Sleeping Giant Brass a try, bet you will change over very fast.

Thanks for the tip, I have ordered some to give them a go.
I have been using a Frankford Arsenal tumbler for several years and have refined the process a bit. The one thing that has really put a finishing shine on my brass was the addition of some "Burnishing Compound" that I get from a Lapidary supply. It is for metal and they too sell their version of their rock tumblers set up for cleaning brass with SS pins.
I have found that if the brass is really dirty that a bucket full of scalding/boiling water with a good squeeze of dish detergent + 1/2tsp of Lemi-Shine is the go and I stir them with a flat stick several times over the next hour and leave to soak over night. Brass must be de-primed before hand if you are wet processing, this is true for SS pin tumbling or Sonic.
Hot rinse and then into the tumbler with fresh Lemi-shine and dish soap though I have just started trialing BoreTec "Case Clean" and add 15ml to the tumbler as well.
The case clean adds a bit of a preservative coating that minimizes tarnishing, even when the cases are annealed electronically.
I separate the SS pins from the cases simply by dumping the worst of the dirty water out of the tumbler several times and then dumping the whole lot into a plastic tube with water to cover and sloshing the cases in the water until all the pins fall out {about 2-3 back & forth} and then drop them in a live bait bucket that I bought at a sporting goods store. The bucket is made of plastic and has holes perfroated all around + top and bottom. The bucket is agitated and rolled in a bigger bucket of clean water and I find that only a few if any pins fall out.
I have Never had a pin stuck in a case and that covers all calibers from 22-338.
I dump my clean brass onto a large towel and roll up and toss, then spread on large pizza tin on a shelf in the oven set at about 100-120*F with the Fan Force blowing for about 2 hours till completely dry then bag for storage with a couple of desiccant packs tossed in though I usually anneal the cases directly after drying and after a trip into my AMP annealer I know they are bone dry.
I do Brass Service for a number of folks across two clubs and everyone is amazed at the results.
Note of Caution: Better to tumble less brass then try to do the maximum the tumbler is rated for. It will clean cases faster and more thoroughly.
I find a ratio of 2.5 lb pins to 1lb of brass.
If you tumble too long you can end up peening the case mouth and then you need to chamfer the inner and outer case mouth.
Same for Sonic Cleaning... Do less cases and get a better job and DO Preheat solution. Sonic Solutions are $ and do not clean quite to the level of SS pin tumbling but is a bit quicker process.
Cheers, Fire Dog

 

[Fire Dog]

Forgot to mention that it is a good idea to regularly clean your SS pins and tumbler as the rubbish that is cleaned off your cases will be left behind and build up a coating on both resulting in a reduction in the cleaning of subsequent loads of cases.
I saw this advice on YouTube a couple of years ago at the time I noticed that the cleaning was falling off.
I just toss in a table spoon of enzyme soaker like the stuff for cleaning diapers and stains. Fill tumbler with hot water and turn on for about 15 minutes. Rinse the whole lot and set out to dry or in my case I drain the pins into a commercial SS fine mesh sieve and after rising and draining I also dry them overnight in the oven set on low though about 200* and the tumbler just gets an air dry.
No matter which brand of SS pin tumbler you use, Always buy the magnetic pin handler or you will go through a lot of pins going down the drain or lost on the ground... {:~)

 

[Fire Dog]

Rinsing with methanol, ethanol, or acetone to expedite the drying process will not harm brass in any way. Another alternative is a food evaporator, which has worked very well for me over the years. This is the one I have:

https://stainlesstumblingmedia.com/shop/reloading-products/accessories/brass-dryer.html

It is relatively inexpensive and typically, 30-40 minutes is plenty of drying time. Although it requires slightly more time, the benefit of a food evaporator is that you don't have to continually buy organic solvents and then find a way to dispose of them (pouring organics down the sink probably isn't the greatest idea).

Solvents are never a good idea not only for the smell and cost but the danger of fire and of course absorption through breathing and handling...
I towel dry my tumbled cases by folding them up and tossing them then spread them out on large pizza tray in the fan forced oven mid-shelf at 100-120*F for about two hours.
Bag up and toss in a couple of desiccate bags if storing or straight to the bench to prime and load...

 

[Fire Dog]

Why not. Hears my flavor on it. I have and did or do use wet pins and dry media.
First Wet. I found, presoaking the cases in a big squirt of Dawn with a pinch of Lemi-Shine in boiling hot water soaking for 1 hour, mixing it around with a wooden spoon every 10 minutes or so. This will remove 50% or more of the carbon build up. Then I pour it in the wet tumbler and fill almost to the top with boiling water. Tumble for 15 min- 1 hour. What ever works. Brass cases cleaning is a process, always evolving. You do have to experiment. I have gotten mixed results, from wet tumbling, as far as the finished product is concerned. The primer pockets never do seem to get clean, maybe 50%.
For those using pins, there are other SS media (small chips) which are suppose to clean the pockets better. I have yet to buy any, but will one of these days. If anyone is interested, I can give you the sites that carry them (about $37 for 5lbs). If you want the cases to dry quicker, when separating from the pins (I do it in the tub) rinse with only super hot water. Strain and dump on a towel, rub dry, lay out somewhere and they will be completely dry in a couple of hours. Boiling water does not hurt brass. Water boils at what 200 and to ruin brass it needs to get to 450. Even when the military experimented with Ammonia on brass, it took one hell of a lot to even make a difference, I've educated myself about this scare.
After wet tumbling, tried my wife's food dehydrator, worked great, but using super hot water works much quicker without more mess, another machine and process.
I now use my wet tumbler with dry media. After a cleaning soak in hot water and there completely dry. I have 1 wet tumbler and 4 vibratory tumblers. Later this year I may buy a small concrete mixer and customize it.
Walnut with a good additive to clean and Corn Cob with additive to polish after I size the case with lube. Harbor Freight has the best price on walnut media (25lbs), if their out Home Depot has it (25lbs) for a little bit more. Grainger's has the best price on Corn Cob by the 50lb boxes.
I sell quite a bit of cases, since I have access to it and the spare time to work with it. Difference is mine is mostly step at a time, no progressives or AutoDrives. Way to rich for my blood. I provide brass to shooters and loaders, the same way I do for myself.
View attachment 1180424
A cleaned up pile from 2 months ago.
View attachment 1180425
A pile from last weekend. I do this about every other month.
The red bucket has over 300-.243 cases
The large bucket behind it has over 5,000-.223 cases
View attachment 1180429
Wet pin tumbled, drying after hot water rinse.
View attachment 1180430
These are how all my dry tumbled cases finish. Look at the difference in color from the 2 above pics, upper with wet pins and the lower with dry media.
And yes I clean all my primer pockets by hand, gauge them and remove flash-hole burrs before cleaning.
As much as I handle my brass, unless I want to wear rubber gloves all the time, the dry media leaves a protective polish on the case, no matter how much it's handled, just rub it on a towel and it's like new.
Wet tumbling takes it to bear metal with no protection. I have had cases show tarnishing after just a couple of weeks. I don't know about yours, but my hands produce quite a bit of oils while working and it shows. My cases seem to glide into my sizing dies with very little lube, haven't had a stuck case yet, which has been polished. This is a plus for me, soon I'll be offering sized cases also.
Just my take on cleaning cases. We all have our own flavor, right?

WOW you have a post that combines almost exactly things I have posted about wet tumbling. I too have ordered the SS chips that Sleeping Giant Brass sells
https://www.sleepinggiantbrass.com/Stainless-tumbling-media and cannot wait to try them as I suspect they will really shine in getting the primer pockets clean quicker and thus reduce the amount of time necessary to get the brass totally clean. I have added "Burnishing Compound" that I buy from a lapidary supply to my tumbler and that really brings up the finish to a look straight out of the factory press. I am also trialing Bore Tec "Case Clean" which puts a coating that inhibits tarnishing, even after a trip through my AMP annealer. I use 15 -20ml in my Frankford Arsenal tumbler. Pre-soaking the brass helps to soften the carbon in the primer pockets and of course gets rid of some worst of carbon fouling in the case and thus reducing time necessary to physically tumble.

 

[Ned Ludd]

Solvents are never a good idea not only for the smell and cost but the danger of fire and of course absorption through breathing and handling...
I towel dry my tumbled cases by folding them up and tossing them then spread them out on large pizza tray in the fan forced oven mid-shelf at 100-120*F for about two hours.
Bag up and toss in a couple of desiccate bags if storing or straight to the bench to prime and load...

I did not advocate using organic solvents to dry brass. I merely stated that some commonly-used solvents will not harm the brass. As I also stated, I use an inexpensive food evaporator to dry my brass. I cannot imagine doing it any other way.

 

[D-4297]

I've used both Ultrasonic and tumbler processes , and have gone to a slightly modified tumbler system , without S.S. pins . Ultrasonic worked good , and I had no complaints with the finished product , using the process recommended on this forum . I could clean approx. 90 .308 cases per run , and was satisfied with the results .

I wanted to see if I could run more cases faster , so I purchased one of the two drum Harbor Freight tumblers , and set about to learn that process . For me the end result was gratifying , in that I could run the same amount of cases in approx. one half the time , and get a better , cleaner case , while still having some residual left-over powder in the necks . Avoiding the "To Clean" neck issues .And there was less physical work involved .

My system does not use S.S. pins , but only filtered tap water , Dawn dish detergent , and Lemmi-shine . After about a two - two and a half hour tumble , cases get rinsed with very hot tap water . Drained in a mesh colander , and spread out on towels . Towels are then used to "roll" the cases back and forth , followed by blowing the insides out with a low pressure air gun , and set outside to "air-dry" in the lovely Arizona sun for a hour or so . Annealed , sized , trimmed , and then loaded . I do remove primers and run a primer pocket tool before cleaning . I have found this gives me the result I'm after , and also creates the constant for a very consistent primer seating . The biggest benefit I found to wet tumbling was it freed me up to do other reloading functions , while the tumbler was running .

 

[Evan]

I use a tumbler with just dawn and warm water. I tumble for 3 hours - it peens the mouths, but I trim and debur/chamfer afterwards every time anyway, so it isn't a problem. I lay the wet brass out on a towel and leave it overnight. Here in the high altitude desert of Colorado, stuff dries nicely. I tend to keep everything in my reloading process staggered so that I have different sets of brass in various steps of the process. I never do it all start to finish in one sitting.

 

[jlshaw]

I have used both methods. Each has its benefits and drawbacks. Both work pretty well.
Stainless steel is going to get your brass squeaky clean with respect to carbon. I think ultrasonic is probably a little easier on the cases, but have no measurable proof.
Getting the pins out of your brass can be tedious, but it's addressed elsewhere.
Again, both work.
Good luck.

 

[dgeesaman]

Thanks for the tip, I have ordered some to give them a go.
I have been using a Frankford Arsenal tumbler for several years and have refined the process a bit. The one thing that has really put a finishing shine on my brass was the addition of some "Burnishing Compound" that I get from a Lapidary supply. It is for metal and they too sell their version of their rock tumblers set up for cleaning brass with SS pins.
I have found that if the brass is really dirty that a bucket full of scalding/boiling water with a good squeeze of dish detergent + 1/2tsp of Lemi-Shine is the go and I stir them with a flat stick several times over the next hour and leave to soak over night. Brass must be de-primed before hand if you are wet processing, this is true for SS pin tumbling or Sonic.
Hot rinse and then into the tumbler with fresh Lemi-shine and dish soap though I have just started trialing BoreTec "Case Clean" and add 15ml to the tumbler as well.

Re: burnishing compound, the idea of adding anything abrasive is a No-go for me. There is always going to be some that doesn’t rinse out completely and will end up getting in my barrel.

FWIW I got a FA Lite tumbler with their as pins and ran my first batch recently. I am anything but an expert, yet I already learned some interesting things.

1) I used hot tap water, Lemishine, and a squirt of generic dish soap. Because I had trouble getting my tumbler to rotate the bin and I got distracted, it had at least an hour to soak without agitation.
2) I was able to get the tumbler rotating by tilting the base to put more weight on the drive rollers. I tumbled for maybe 5 minutes. Bras was not perfectly clean but very nearly so.
3) I immediately rinsed everything. I was shaking the can over the sink but maybe I should tumble a bit between rinses because cases that were buried in the media didn’t get well rinsed.
4) I manually picked the pieces and spread them on a towel. Later that day I annealed them. Some of the primer pockets weren’t fully dry but they were definitely dry after anneal got the case hot.

Takeaway is that presoaking may help and greatly reduce the tumble time. Of course that means less neck damage.

David

 

[Engrbill]

I use ultrasonic to prepare once-fired .50 BMG military brass. I use Citronex at 1:100 dilution.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B003FZAR1E/?tag=accuratescom-20

I run the ultrasonic for 40 mins. at 30 C temperature processing 10 or 12 cases at a time. I find this temperature is necessary to permit decapping the sealed and crimped primers. The brass is quite dirty and comes out clean enough to process furtherby annealing, decapping, sizing, and then trimming. After removing the primer crimp I ream the flash hole and square the pocket. The LC and WCC brass is polished after trimming with a red Scotchguard pad, in the lathe.

I was using vinegar/salt in the ultrasonic but this reacts with brass metallurgy. The Citronex was recommended in the cleaning article in this site. The once-fired brass is .030 to .040 over 3.900 length, probably from M2 firing. It grows less about .010 to .015 after each firing in my M99.

 

[Engrbill]

I also use the Ultrasonic with Citronox. Run it just like you do per the article.
Pour the basket of cases in a large strainer and run hot water over them. Shake and pour cases on a large towel and do the RUB a Dub Dub with the towel. cases come out almost dry and quickly air dry shiny as new and clean inside and out and your done. Only way to fly.