Something weird with FFL transfer

[joshb]

Two of my local favorite gun stores recently changed their policies. They no longer accept guns shipped from Out of state individuals. At both stores, they gave the same(weird coincidence) excuse about not knowing/trusting the guy sending the gun. I have used both stores in the past. Any one else seeing a change?

 

[Dusty Stevens]

They keep in pretty close touch with their local agents- casual conversations maybe when asking about laws. Right now the agents are overwhelmed and are trying to keep their districts out of trouble so that one agent may have heard something or interpreted something and passed it along

 

[Lapua40X]

The local shop I use requires a FAX copy of the sender's FFL, makes telephone contact in coordinating any transfer from that FFL, and verifiable business address that corresponds with the FFL before he'll even discuss an out of state transfer. Of course, there's a fee for all the work he has to do to get the job done. Haven't had anyone in my area refuse to handle it though.

 

[shortgrass]

ATF has advised NOT to send/supply a 'private party' (seller) with a copy of my FFL. Give the sender the first three and last 5 digits of the license number and have them use E-Z Check. These 'private sellers' are convinced they need a copy of the FFL before they can ship. A Federal Firearms License holder does, but a "private seller" does NOT. If the private seller uses E-Z Check and only ships to the address given on E-Z Check he has done his 'due diligence'. He should download the E-Z Check 'results' page. A 'private seller' shipping a firearm is the same as shipping your rifle/shotgun/handgun to a Licensed gunsmith for work, except in the case of a sale, the firearm can not be shipped directly back to the 'private seller' if the buyer decides he doesn't want the firearm. Confused yet? That's the way it's been for a long time. Except the 'private sellers' are convinced they need a copy of the receiving shops' FFL. They don't understand the laws/rulings. ATFE enforces firearms laws/rulings, not the 'private sellers', so,,,, I think I'll go what ATFE directs me to do, not what the 'private sellers' think needs to happen. Many of these 'private sellers' have become too much hastle to deal with, hence the refusal to do 'business' with them. On top of that, seems there might be a lot of other potential issues when dealing with an unLicensed seller who is half or two thirds of the way across the country.

 

[Alexander-M]

ATF has advised NOT to send/supply a 'private party' (seller) with a copy of my FFL. Give the sender the first three and last 5 digits of the license number and have them use E-Z Check. These 'private sellers' are convinced they need a copy of the FFL before they can ship. A Federal Firearms License holder does, but a "private seller" does NOT. If the private seller uses E-Z Check and only ships to the address given on E-Z Check he has done his 'due diligence'. He should download the E-Z Check 'results' page. A 'private seller' shipping a firearm is the same as shipping your rifle/shotgun/handgun to a Licensed gunsmith for work, except in the case of a sale, the firearm can not be shipped directly back to the 'private seller' if the buyer decides he doesn't want the firearm. Confused yet? That's the way it's been for a long time. Except the 'private sellers' are convinced they need a copy of the receiving shops' FFL. They don't understand the laws/rulings. ATFE enforces firearms laws/rulings, not the 'private sellers', so,,,, I think I'll go what ATFE directs me to do, not what the 'private sellers' think needs to happen. Many of these 'private sellers' have become too much hastle to deal with, hence the refusal to do 'business' with them. On top of that, seems there might be a lot of other potential issues when dealing with an unLicensed seller who is half or two thirds of the way across the country.

I was under the impression that is was the Post Office and UPS that required that the recipient of the package was an FFL holder. I don't know about FedEx.

It has been several years since I sold and shipped a rifle, but if memory serves me right, I had to show UPS a copy of the recipient's FFL, but I may be mistaken.

Should we refrain from selling (or trying to) rifles on the forum unless the buyer is a resident of our State; i.e., from where we would ship the rifle?

Thanks!

Alex

 

[lawrence97]

I've sold several rifles out of state and I always ask for copy of FFL and that is where I send the rifle.

As for FedEx or ups asking to look at the copy is hit or miss. Sometimes they have even asked to look at the contents. As of yet no problems sending firearms with them. A lot of it depends on the clerk and how experienced or inexperienced they are.

I wouldn't refrain from selling! The firearm is going to a dealer and the purchaser has to pick up at that dealer and go thru a background and that satisfies govt. needs.

In the past I've had dealers refuse to accept from an individual so in that case I go to a different dealer that will accept from an individual. Some require a copy of my DL or a phone call.

 

[shortgrass]

I was under the impression that is was the Post Office and UPS that required that the recipient of the package was an FFL holder. I don't know about FedEx.

It has been several years since I sold and shipped a rifle, but if memory serves me right, I had to show UPS a copy of the recipient's FFL, but I may be mistaken.

Should we refrain from selling (or trying to) rifles on the forum unless the buyer is a resident of our State; i.e., from where we would ship the rifle?

Thanks!

Alex

They can use the E-Z Check, too! Hmmmmmm,,,,,, let me think about this........ ATFE can make my life miserable to the point of me standing in front of a federal judge in federal court, where my FFL can be revoked , and an unlicensed seller can decide to not ship a firearm to me because I decide to follow directions given by ATFE and not provide him with a copy of my FFL. Now, which one should I choose? (sic)

 

[fx77]

All's I know is that my FFL charges 75$/ FFL to FFL transfer...

 

[joshb]

And the one closest to me wants $100 plus shipping.

 

[dryhumor]

I expect many dealers will make some pretty good beans and rice money when all these private sales need background checks completed. My guy charges $30 a pop.

 

[RockyMtnMan]

I have sold and shipped a lot of firearms to out of state individuals. I have always had a copy of the FFL license and a photo copy of my driver's license enclosed with the firearm because the receiving FFL always requested that a signed copy of their own license and a photo copied ID of the seller be in the package. Not sure about the EZ check being all that is required. I have always just shipped in the manner requested by the receiving FFL.

On the other note, I have NEVER revealed the contents of the package to any shipping companies, whether it be USPS, FedEx, or UPS. My firearms are always fully concealed in boxes with no markings when I ship them. Nothing frustrates me more than when I buy a gun from a seller in another state and it shows up in a gun case with no concealment and nothing more than a shipping label stuck to it, or a factory box with the manufacturer's name and all the info on the box.
Letting everyone handling the package know that it is a firearm is a good way to "lose" your package in the mail. There have been a LOT of cases where shipping company workers stole firearms in transit.

There are some FFL dealers around here that will not receive firearms from private non-FFL parties because there are a lot of people that don't know how to ship them properly. All the headache it has caused isn't worth the trouble to them anymore. There is no ATF law restricting the dealers from receiving private party firearms, it's just their personal preference.

 

[Cold Bore]

Sales of long guns can be shipped directly from a private party to an out of state FFL dealer. Sales of handguns MUST be shipped from a FFL dealer to FFL dealer.

Incorrect.

That only applies if shipping via US Mail.

An individual can ship handguns via common carrier (FedEx, UPS, etc).

 

[RockyMtnMan]

Incorrect.

That only applies if shipping via US Mail.

An individual can ship handguns via common carrier (FedEx, UPS, etc).

OK. My fault. I will look into that. Honestly I have only ever sold one handgun in all my years where it had to be shipped. All other out of state sales were long guns. I apologize if my statement was incorrect.

 

[RockyMtnMan]

Incorrect.

That only applies if shipping via US Mail.

An individual can ship handguns via common carrier (FedEx, UPS, etc).

Looked up the ATF laws. You are correct, it only applies to USPS. My mistake. I have removed it from my original post. Thank you for catching that.

 

[Cold Bore]

No

OK. My fault. I will look into that. Honestly I have only ever sold one handgun in all my years where it had to be shipped. All other out of state sales were long guns. I apologize if my statement was incorrect.

No worries.

Just look up the BATF site and find the Firearms FAQ section.

Even with FedEx/UPS "requiring" overnight shipping, it will can still come out cheaper than paying an FFL fee on the front end and USPS Priority Mail charges.

Of course, some guys challenge the legality/validity of requiring the more expensive overnight charges and just ship "standard" parcel rates, saving even more......

 

[bheadboy]

my local ffl check to see if the receiving ffl is in good standing before he will ship

Bob

 

[dickn52]

And the one closest to me wants $100 plus shipping.

Going rate here just went up to 35.00 and we squealed when it did.

 

[Dgd6mm]

Going rate here just went up to 35.00 and we squealed when it did.

My FFL is still $30.00 and if I do 2 at once the FFL transfer charge is still only $30.00.

 

[dogdude]

I recently sold a pistol FTF to an out of state buyer, went to a FFL and he charged $35 + $30 shipping..buyer had no problem. Sold another pistol to a out of state buyer and went to UPS to ship to his FFL...$127!!!!!!

 

[dickn52]

I recently sold a pistol FTF to an out of state buyer, went to a FFL and he charged $35 + $30 shipping..buyer had no problem. Sold another pistol to a out of state buyer and went to UPS to ship to his FFL...$127!!!!!!

Yeah handguns have to go overnight as I recall. Or was it 2 day express. CANNOT go surface though.