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Small Pistol Primer Separation Question

Recently I've been having the primer separate in the case and wanted see if others have had this.

This is on 9mm small primer - Remington No 1 1/2 pistol primer.

The two cases on the right have the primer cup wall still inside the case - the one on the left is normal.

20240610_084920.jpg

The load is 4.5grain Tite Group and Berry's 115gr rn.

I'd appreciate any input about this...it's pretty new to me and not sure if this is primer problem or something else.

TIA.
 
Are you wet tumbling your brass during processing?

This event is known as ringers where the primer can become corroded in the primer pocket, leading to just the head/cap of the primer being punched out during the depriming step.
 
Are you wet tumbling your brass during processing?

This event is known as ringers where the primer can become corroded in the primer pocket, leading to just the head/cap of the primer being punched out during the depriming step.
No - dry polish with walnut shell. I de-cap for polishing - so empty primer pocket. Yes- I don't see that before de-priming fired cases.
REM 1 1 1/2 SPP are not for “high pressure” cartridges. I use them in 38 S&W with powder puff loads.
So that's pressure sign? I am on the high side of the scale, so I go down to 3.8 or 4.0 and see how that does.

Thank you both for the input.
 
The big question is when did this happen, when fired or when removing them, I suspect the latter.

Was the crimp removed before seating the new primers?

Those Military 9mm were crimped.

They should be fine for normal 9mm loads. 35,000 psi. But may show pressure before you get there.
 
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The big question is when did this happen, when fired or when removing them, I suspect the latter.

Was the crimp removed before seating the new primers?

Those Military 9mm were crimped.

They should be fine for normal 9mm loads. 35,000 psi. But may show pressure before you get there.
I've seen NOT this at firing - I'm seeing in de-cap and size operation.
Interesting article on the subject.

Good article - thanks for posting. I got these Rem 1-1/2's when that's what I could get, not my first choice but they do go pop and start the 9mm party going.

EDIT: fixed auto correct errors.
 
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Something jumps out at me . . . . The cases with the problem are NT; originally loaded with non-toxic primers. Note the large flash holes. This was done with non-toxic primers for a reason I can't recall.

This might be the cause of your problem. While I've read that people see no difference in loading large vs. smaller flash hole cases, that's just an unconfirmed (by me ) story.
 
Data point. I ended up with a load of 45ACP SPP Win NT brass and have used CCI500 primers in them with no problems.

Also that same problem occurs with military brass and primers when decapping with crimped primers. This is especially true if you tend to get fast.
 
I've only ever seen the ringer issue with 223s and they were range pickups and had been in the weather some time. I was trying to get a bunch of the same head stamp and was getting successful at removing them, but its been so long I can't remember how.
 
Crimped primer pocket is your nemesis with pistol brass. You just don't expect it so most people don't inspect their cases for it. Good news is that range brass is abundant for 9mm. It isn't worth the time to swage 9mm so I just toss them in recycle bin when I encounter them.
 
Crimped primer pocket is your nemesis with pistol brass. You just don't expect it so most people don't inspect their cases for it. Good news is that range brass is abundant for 9mm. It isn't worth the time to swage 9mm so I just toss them in recycle bin when I encounter them.
I agree. Most military calibers are crimped whether made at a fed arsenal or not because they dont know what that round will be fired in. I find most all makes of 5.56 are crimped now and more and more 45acp are crimped as is 308. Always check, sometimes its hard to tell. They make go-nogo primer pocket gauges. I used them and they work.
i find primers breaking like this mainly in 5.56 ammo i find at the range. This has only been seen by me in the last couple years and ive been reloading military brass since the 70’s. Ive even had the occasional primer pierced by the decap pin over the yrs. Has anyone found sealer around these primers When they dig out the ring? Ive never dug them out.
good catch @Doom on the NT and large flash hole.
 
SeabeeKen - by "Sealant" are you referring to the lacquer seal (usually red but sometimes green) that is on base of cartridge. I see this mostly on rifle cartridges (Eastern Block made ammo) and on rare occasion of pistol. This is to environmentally seal the case. I toss any cases with any sealant... it isn't worth the effort. Often, the tip of the decapping rod pierces through the spent primer or can even be bent by amount of force to press out primer. NOPE not worth the effort.
 
SeabeeKen - by "Sealant" are you referring to the lacquer seal (usually red but sometimes green) that is on base of cartridge.

A lot (that's "lot" as in quantity, not batch) of Federal factory rifle ammo has sealed primers using a blue sealant.
 
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Most, if not all, NT brass is crimped at the primer. If the pocket isn't swaged or reamed, you will get ringing.

I gave up on NT brass because of the extra work.

I load with a Dillon 1050 and it has the swager built in and I still will get a ringer.
 
I have had a ringer with 9mm in a Dillon 1050, when it got to the primer seating station it went bang. and my I went white. The Dillon is supposed to swage out the pocket, I cant recall if it was milsurp brass or a second / third firing the event was about 30 yrs ago.

So just to be clear, a detonation of the new primer occered because there was a ringer in the pocket.
 
About 2 months ago I finished a batch of 9mm loads using Rem 1-1/2 primers (1k of them). My load was 4.9gr CFE Pistol under 124gr coated LRN bullet. My process is to deprime first, then clean in crushed walnut media, inspect, then place in the ready to reload bucket. I did not have any problem you describe with the primers. The statistics on the load are to simulate our self defense load (124gr Fed Hydra-shoks). My load avg MV 1064.2 fps, muzzle energy: 311.8FP. Hydra-Shok load 9mm 124gr bullet, Avg MV: 1060.7fps, ME:309.8fp. All of the brass used was either CCI Blazer (99%) or starlaine (1%).

Mike
 

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