Second focal plane scopes

[Ing. Michael W. Mayerl]

Thank you for this thread! I have often wondered what the differences were between ffp and spf scopes. However, I'm left a little confused on the same token. I am a varmint hunter, that ranges targets with a range finder, and then acquires said target in the scope, adjust elevation/windage for the shot and dispatch. I don't use reticles that have mildots/bdc because I feel they "clutter" the view in the scope! A target dot doesn't bother me much but, I prefer a fine crosshair. Am I correct that a sfp scope is better for varminting because the reticle size doesn't change with magnification changes? Also, if a rifle's poi is centered on the crosshairs does the poi change with magnification changes? These two questions are what have me confused! Thanks in advance for the clarification!

Mike

A varmint hunter shoot on very small targets so a SFP would be better because the reticle is much finer.
Thats the big disadvantage at FFP scopes - most reticles are too thick.
Some IOR FFP scopes have a 0,1mil center dot and thicker outher reticle lines, thats the best solution for FFP scopes when shooting on small sized targets. But with a conventional reticle in a FFP scope it`s realy very hard to aim because the reticle cover too much.

Both systems have advantages and disadvantages. That`s live. Nothing is perfekt.

Some decades ago, most scopes in europe were FFP. And very popular was the reticle # 1. Some like it - some don`t. But it`s a nice solution when a FFP is prefered and small targets must be aimed.

 

[cnorm129]

If using a SFP your best bet would be too zero on the highest magnifications you have. So in a since once you dial it back the POI will always be the same. But if you zero on a lower magnification and zoom in that's not always the case?

 

[flatlander]

Judd, if my experiences with a Vortex Viper PST SFP 6-24x50 are typical, I think you'll be happy with your PST. I put mine on a 223 AI that I built on a M700 action in a McM A5 stock, and recently used in a steel match at distances from 200 to 1400yds. I used a 26" Krieger 1:7tw sendero contour, and was shooting Berger 90s (both LRBTs & VLDs) at just over 2800fps from 700 on out. Used S80MKs & JLK 80VLDs in fireforming loads on the closer stuff.

I had the PST in TPS TSR rings on an EGW 20 MOA sloped base, and ran out of elevation while going up from 1300 to the 1400yd target. I'd zeroed the scope at 100yds, and my data (obtained using my chrono data, Bryon Litz's G7 BCs for the Bergers, & the Point Mass Solver included with Litz's LR ballisitics book) called for a 58.88 MOA come-up for 1400. The scope topped-out at 53.25 MOA, so I held over using the 5 MOA hashmark on the reticle, and got a good, mid-elevation hit on the 1400yd target. To me, that speaks well for the accuracy of Vortex's clicks & their reticle.

Vortex also includes a package of shims to be used on the elevation capstan under the elevation knob to provide a zero stop feature, which is very helpful when shooting at distances requiring multiple revolutions of the elevation knob. If you ever get 'lost' and forget where you're at, just turn the knob down until you hit the zero stop, then work your way back up to where you need to be. We shot several stages after the 1400yd one at that last match, from 200 out to 500yds, so I cranked the scope's elevation knob back down to the zero stop, then worked my way back up for these shorter distances. Scope's elevation adjustments were right on the rest of the day, which is a must for this type of shooting where you get no sighters.

This is my first - and so far - only Vortex scope. I'm a big fan of Sightron's SIII line of scopes (own eight of them), but now find myself wishing they'd see fit to offer a zero stop feature and more sophisticated reticle like the EBR-1 MOA of the PST. From what I've seen during several late afternoon shooting sessions, the SIII's optics have a bit better resolution than the PST's when the afternoon shadows have fallen over steel targets; it's pretty difficult to resolve 22 cal bullet splashes on painted steel from 600yds with the PST in these conditions, while the SIII can just do it. OTOH, the Vortex's knobs don't catch & move while I'm putting the rifle into or removing if from my drag bag, while the SIII's tactical knobs will catch & move if you're not extremely careful. Give me a scope with the Vortex PST's accuracy & features, combined with Sightron SIII's optical quality, at a price point just a bit higher than where the SIIIs currently sell, and I'd be one very happy camper.

 

[BoydAllen]

Some good posts here..

 

[Forum Boss]

There is no way to range a target of unknown size with any type of reticle. target size has to be known to do the math

Yep. For example, if you're ranging a silhouette target that is 36" tall but you think it is 24" tall, your distance calc will be way off. Most people shoot at known distances 95% of time so they don't need ranging. Hunters that need ranging will probably be happy with a laser rangefinder. These work reliably out to about 800 yards or so on deer-sized objects. Some mfgs. claim their lasers work farther, but if you actually go out in the field and play with the LRFs you will see that it is very, very difficult to range a small object at 1000, unless the LRF is mounted on a tripod. It is very difficult to hold the LRF steady enough, even if you rest it on a rucksack or sand sock.

 

[Ing. Michael W. Mayerl]

Hunters that need ranging will probably be happy with a laser rangefinder. These work reliably out to about 800 yards or so on deer-sized objects.

I`m also a hunter and I have tested a lot of range finder and with most I was not very happy.
The best product I find was the Leica Geovid. It`s a high end binokular with the best glas, combinated with a realy accurate range finder that also work on very high distances.
Only disadvantage is the high price but the quality is realy outstanding.

http://de.leica-camera.com/sport_optics/rangemaster_new/Geovid_new/

 

[CanusLatransSnpr]

Thanks for the replys to my questions gentlemen! I now know what I have to do, which just so happens to be what I was doing anyways, which is sight in the scope on the highest power! It all makes much better sense to me now. As far as the laser range finders, thanks for you input Ing. Michael!

Thanks,
Mike