Have been using an RCBS Charge master set up for the past 8 years . Results have been totally acceptable.... Until lately. I shoot 2 different 6mm Norma Dasher in local matches,steel plate targets between 200 and 500 meters. I have been shooting 35-38 out of 40. Honestly figured it was my skill level, and was having fun so......Last 2 matches I have been setting scale at 3x.7 and trickling up one granule at a time until up to a count of 6, the scale changes to .8. Well, my last 2 scores have been 39 and a 40. Won both matches (entry fee) and was happy. Now, I'm going down the rabbit hole thinking about upgrading my scale to a .01-.02 gr accuracy level. I'd still use the RCBS to throw to 3x.7 and transfer to new scale and trickle up. So, looking at the new Creed moor scale or something in the $3-$500.00 range. Or do I keep doing it the way I am? Thanks for input, opinions, ridicule, etc....Thanks,rsbhunter
Scale change or?
- Thread starter rsbhunter
- Start date
Mulligan
Silver $$ Contributor
A&D FX-120i - 122g x 0.001g + Calibration Weight
A&D FX-120i is the ideal scale for your reloading bench. Superior accuracy and speed, at an affordable price for this laboratory grade scale. Always in stock. $580.00 USD - Free Shipping to The Lower 48
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this is the ticket
CW
Get an FX120 and down the line consider buying a used v3 with a thrower or just buy the trickler unit new while they are still being made.
RegionRat
Gold $$ Contributor
I’ll ask a background question rather than give an opinion on the scale…
What size are your targets? When you test your system and ammo, what will it hold?
A 6 Dasher at 500 meters is likely to be producing an accuracy of >1 MOA with very sloppy loading, and >0.5 MOA if you are careful with the tools you have now.
If you don’t plan to shoot twice as far as you are discussing now, I doubt your scale is making any score difference at all unless we are looking at targets less than 1 MOA.
I’m not trying to talk you out of spending your money on a better scale, but questioning why you think you need a better scale in the first place for this type of shooting?
If you are just curious about going to Mid Range matches or even LR matches, maybe just test your gear as it is and then see if you still need advice on if a scale change would make any difference at all. Sometimes, there are other stronger factors that dominate the group size and POI shifts than just the powder charge accuracy. A good scale is always nice when it speeds up the loading process, but may or may not help with the score unless everything else is balanced.
What size are your targets? When you test your system and ammo, what will it hold?
A 6 Dasher at 500 meters is likely to be producing an accuracy of >1 MOA with very sloppy loading, and >0.5 MOA if you are careful with the tools you have now.
If you don’t plan to shoot twice as far as you are discussing now, I doubt your scale is making any score difference at all unless we are looking at targets less than 1 MOA.
I’m not trying to talk you out of spending your money on a better scale, but questioning why you think you need a better scale in the first place for this type of shooting?
If you are just curious about going to Mid Range matches or even LR matches, maybe just test your gear as it is and then see if you still need advice on if a scale change would make any difference at all. Sometimes, there are other stronger factors that dominate the group size and POI shifts than just the powder charge accuracy. A good scale is always nice when it speeds up the loading process, but may or may not help with the score unless everything else is balanced.
If your wanting to just test the waters with a .00 scale, something like a Maxus Dante scale from Amazon for around $16 bucks might be a consideration.
I have been using the RCBS scale for a very long time. Sometimes it is very accurate and sometimes it is not. I use it and set it .01 grs low then put the pan on my Ohaus 10-10and hand feed it till it is exactly where I want it to be. The Ohaus is accurate down to 1 granule of Varget.
On the RCBS I believe its resolution is within 2/10 of a grain, I use a Lyman electronic scale after the RCBS with a resolution of 1/10 per grain just to be sure they both jive with one another.I throw the charge with the RCBS 99% of the time it is perfect I use McDonald’s straw and tuned up the programming I also have a back up power supply and line conditioner, Then the next scale with better resolution verifies what the RCBS says or not and it has a little trickler on it if I have to make up the difference. One other tip besides the power supply which is a surge protector and a line conditioner as well I never shut my scales off so they are always warmed up
Mulligan
Silver $$ Contributor
I have an RCBS Chargemaster and I currently use it for loading at the range.
I too, was at the same crossroads you have described. I bought the FX120i scale and Adam MacDonalds auto through and trickler thingys. They have been a great purchase and I still think they are amazing.
But,
I learned a bit with the help of the FX. What I learned is that plugged into the regular 110 outlet in my house, my chargemaster was just as wishywashy as I originally thought when I tested it against my new FX. My old 10/10 beam balance told me the chargemaster wasn’t trustworthy and the FX confirmed it.
So, I decided it was close enough for rough load development at the range and I would buy a battery pack to use in remote locations. When the battery pack arrived I charged it and plugged it in to make sure everything would work. It did, I then decided to test it against the new and fancy FX to make sure it was still close. Well, guess what? It (the chargemaster) was spot on!! I sat down and scratched my head. Had another cup of tea and pondered what I was seeing. You guessed it, I then unplugged the battery and plugged the darn thing into the 110 outlet, low and behold, it was back to its old habits.
I tested this several times both indoors and out, it was always the same story.
MY chargemaster scale/dispenser is much more accurate on a battery pack than it is on A/C current.
Just something to confuse you even more.
CW
Yes it works much better on direct current then alternating current I believe mine works well for me due to the line conditioner built into the back up power supply
Not " looking " to spend money, and I might not gain any advantage at all for the range's I shoot. I realize there are Alpha shooters, and the also rans.....im usually an also ran.....and not an excuse, but I love shooting these matches win or lose..if the prep, time or expense ever overrides the fun factor, I'll quit shooting matches. I have Savage 12 Target rifles..a wood stock and a H.S. precision , one with a Krieger 1-7 twist 28" barrel , and my first one with a 26" PVA 1-7 twist. Both guns will shoot 3/4" at 321 yards if I hold my tongue right....most of the misses are me and the wind(me). I will probably use the setup and method for another match or 2 , and see if the lucky streak continues.....then decide on changing...thank you for all the input, i'll keep reading as long as there are posts....rsbhunter
Milligan and 338-dude....Thank you....I had read about the battery pack and line conditioner but put it off. Until now !!! With both of you saying the same thing, im ordering a battery pack, cable and line conditioner. Is the line conditioner the ferrous clamp on style? I believe that this might be the solution to my quandary.... Thanks for all the advice, and I will report my results asap....rsbhunter. P.S. one of the reasons I started trickling my loads was that watching Erick Cortina video's ( thank you Eric) he stated that sometimes when you can only reach a certain score level, we have a tendency to accept that it is our skill level that limits us, when SOMETIMES it's the equipment that is limiting us...figured I'd test his theory....rsbhunter
I have a FX120i that I bought back with the $150.00, it hasn't been used yet. A couple of months ago I bought a Frankford Arsenal Intellidropper because I liked the reviews on the consistency and ease. In a month to 2 my reloading building will be completed and these scales will be put to use.
I've lost confidence in my O'haus balance beam. It tends to drift a little if it's used for a 300-400 rounds at a time. I know I can over come this if I check it more often, but I'd rather move on like the rest of the shooters have, to an extent.
I've lost confidence in my O'haus balance beam. It tends to drift a little if it's used for a 300-400 rounds at a time. I know I can over come this if I check it more often, but I'd rather move on like the rest of the shooters have, to an extent.
Yes, for years when I was younger and poor(er) I loaded all my rounds on a cheap balance beam...trickling from a SPOON!!! Honestly, if I was shooting for prizes or money, I would beg buy or borrow the top of the line equipment. Heck, A Bat model B action is right at $1800.00 +....I honestly don't have that much in my whole rifle, not including scope. But, as stated, I shoot more for fun. But it is the searching and discovery that makes it Interesting. Winning is great, but I checked, it doesn't make me taller or better looking....but in case I am wrong, I'll keep trying to win...The smell of gun powder makes me happy....rsbhunter
powderbrake
Gold $$ Contributor
If you get an Fx120i, you can measure to one piece of Varget (.02 grains) with ease, and confidence.
You can trickle onto the Fx120i and see the addition of each piece. Many scales, like my Chargemaster, don't immediately respond to each piece of powder.
DO NOT throw an initial charge from a Chargemaster, it is WAY too slow. Just get a scoop and dump in an unweighed lump, and trickle to final weight. Adjust the scoop size to close to the final weight.
There will be lots of V3 versions of Autothrow and Autotrickler available on the market as he is now delivering his V4. The V3 is just as accurate as a V4 (per Adam) and is plenty fast.
With my V3 on my Fx120i, I drop 30 grains of Varget to within .02gr (the resolution of the scale) in 10 seconds.
You can trickle onto the Fx120i and see the addition of each piece. Many scales, like my Chargemaster, don't immediately respond to each piece of powder.
DO NOT throw an initial charge from a Chargemaster, it is WAY too slow. Just get a scoop and dump in an unweighed lump, and trickle to final weight. Adjust the scoop size to close to the final weight.
There will be lots of V3 versions of Autothrow and Autotrickler available on the market as he is now delivering his V4. The V3 is just as accurate as a V4 (per Adam) and is plenty fast.
With my V3 on my Fx120i, I drop 30 grains of Varget to within .02gr (the resolution of the scale) in 10 seconds.
Mulligan
Silver $$ Contributor
I also found the chargemaster scale to be more accurate when not dispensing powder. In other words, if you set the chargemaster to throw 35.0 gr of whatever powder, let it stop dispensing and reweigh, and it settles on 35.0 gr. Do this for 10 or so charges making sure it settles back on 35.0 gr after dispensing.
Now, cycle the charger master off and turn it on again.
Using it only as a scale, reweigh all the charges. It might surprise you…..
I believe the programming allows for some “cushion” when dispensing.
But, I’ve been wrong before.
CW
Liven The Dream
Gold $$ Contributor
I finally gave in. FX-120i . Boy was I slow to drink the water.
I have had many beam scales Tuned etc. and lesser Electric Scales. Got the job done almost perfect.
The FX-120i is a dream .
As stated in above posts. Get a V-3 if you can or go V-4 .
Note on buying a V-3 Make sure you get a Picture of what you are to get ?
V-3 can be a play on words = V-3 Maybe just the Trickler or Auto Throw and Trickler .
( I know I got less on my first Buy ).
I know have a Complete V-3 it is a good investment.
Buy once and save.
Good Luck
I have had many beam scales Tuned etc. and lesser Electric Scales. Got the job done almost perfect.
The FX-120i is a dream .
As stated in above posts. Get a V-3 if you can or go V-4 .
Note on buying a V-3 Make sure you get a Picture of what you are to get ?
V-3 can be a play on words = V-3 Maybe just the Trickler or Auto Throw and Trickler .
( I know I got less on my first Buy ).
I know have a Complete V-3 it is a good investment.
Buy once and save.
Good Luck
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