Runout...can it be a measured on paper at 500-1000 yds?

[Richard Coody]

all this talk of statistical analysis. sure there are tons of variables involved in every rifle shot. Best we can do is only change one thing at a time and see what the results of that change is. then use our brain to evaluate those results. i have always done pretty well with this without a computer program.

we all know why 3, 5, 10 and 20 shot groups with the same rifle and ammo are different but that doesn't keep us from useful information with a 5 shot group.

i know what the results of runout on paper are for me. don't need a statistical analysis to prove it.

if you have the time and inclination load up 25 perfect rounds and 25 with over .003 of runout and shoot 5 five shot groups of each and compare the average group size. That way you will know that for that rifle/shooter it either makes a difference or not.

i would say for 90% of shooters, maybe even more, they don't shoot well enough to tell the difference.

 

[mikecr]

You could not really reach a broad conclusion about many things reloading/shooting, without observing results from a lot of careful testing.
But you can narrow conclusions, qualify them, with careful limited testing. Each of this a piece of a puzzle.

 

[chkunz]

all this talk of statistical analysis. sure there are tons of variables involved in every rifle shot. Best we can do is only change one thing at a time and see what the results of that change is. then use our brain to evaluate those results. i have always done pretty well with this without a computer program.

we all know why 3, 5, 10 and 20 shot groups with the same rifle and ammo are different but that doesn't keep us from useful information with a 5 shot group.

i know what the results of runout on paper are for me. don't need a statistical analysis to prove it.

if you have the time and inclination load up 25 perfect rounds and 25 with over .003 of runout and shoot 5 five shot groups of each and compare the average group size. That way you will know that for that rifle/shooter it either makes a difference or not.

i would say for 90% of shooters, maybe even more, they don't shoot well enough to tell the difference.

Richard, In the 1980s there was a lot of talk about runout and a lot of devices came on the market to measure it but I did not see anyone present data and analysis, just opinions. I was shooting NRA XTC Master Class scores with the M14 by the early 1990s. In 1993 I shot twenty 600 yard stages with one string with straight ammo and one string with crooked ammo, and I alternated first and second strings from match to match. At the end of the year I did the statistical analysis on the data and that gave me information to base my decision on whether to be concerned about runout in my match ammo for my application. If I had been shooting Marksman Class scores with the M14 or High Master scores with the M14 or bench rest or F Class I may have reached a different conclusion than for the M14 with Master Class scores.