Resizing and crimping

[Bc'z]

Polymer tipped bullets tend to be longer than a non tipped hollow point of same weight and caliber, I figured this out years ago loading for a AR-223.

 

[Rocketvapor]

We are getting to the point that everyone is trying to make their own point.
AND
Posting erroneous info in some cases.
Not a big help.

Maximum (accepted) .223/5.56 cartridge length for mag loading is 2.260".
Some factory ammo might be loaded just a little shorter than that.

Some like mags that allow a little more length.
Bullets like the 55 grain FMJ or 75 HPBT CAN be loaded to MAG LENGTH.
the 69 TMK is factory loaded to mag length,
The Factory does it.

The 75 grain Hornady or Sierra 77grain TIPPED bullets CAN NOT.
Shop for loaded ammo, that should tell you what will fit.
Here's an example of a Long Heavy bullet loaded long, per My Sierra manual.

 

[Bc'z]

There's no way he's seating too long, it's too deep. The suggested COL for that bullet is 2.390.

And will not fit in the magazine

 

[6Creed73]

And will not fit in the magazine

Yep, I run into that more with 5.56/223 than any other round. I got a single feed magazine sled to feed the long ones.

 

[Rocketvapor]

People that shoot NRA Highpower or F-T/R single load LONG for slow fire.

 

[Hidesato]

Nobody crimps unless it's required for a semi-auto??? Sounds like your seating the bullets to long, how else would they get pushed in. My Sierra manual give 2.260" COAL for all bullet wts. Sounds like 2.250" should be OK. I would try one at 2.240" to easily see if it solves the problem. What's the COL with the bullet pushed in? Standard FL dies should give good neck tension. A few measurements with a cheap digital caliper would give you some good info, case neck diameter before sizing, after sizing, with bullet in the neck. Match bullets don't have a crimping grove. You are not supposed to crimp them. Are you sure it's a crimping die.

Just looked at some of the comments and pics. Need to reread them. A lot of info.
The freebore on your rifle was probably made for 52-55 Gr bullets, not a long 75 gr bullet. I adjust my dies with a bump guage the instructions can be a long way from the ideal adjustment. Why did you choose 75 gr bullets?

The error is on me. I was looking for 75 gr BRHP and incorrectly ordered the ELD-M. The Hornady reloading manual clearly called out a COL of 2.39 so it’s also my error in not reading. That said, 55 gr is too low a weight for what I’m looking for, ideally I’d run between a 62 and a 77.
Thank ls for all the feedback, I will crawl back under my desk and learn to read a bit.

 

[Rocketvapor]

@Hidesato
No need to hide. Sorry if this turned into a sheetfest
That's how we all learn. The Hornady 75gr BTHP is a pretty good bullet for an AR.

 

[6Creed73]

The error is on me. I was looking for 75 gr BRHP and incorrectly ordered the ELD-M. The Hornady reloading manual clearly called out a COL of 2.39 so it’s also my error in not reading. That said, 55 gr is too low a weight for what I’m looking for, ideally I’d run between a 62 and a 77.
Thank ls for all the feedback, I will crawl back under my desk and learn to read a bit.

Like @Rocketvapor mentioned, there are plenty of bullets in the 62-77gr range that can be loaded to fit a magazine.

This is how we all learn. I once tried to fit the Berger 85.5 in a magazine, lol.

 

[Rocketvapor]

Wife liked the 69 grain TMK over the 77 grain MK (both factory loads) in her .223.
The Hornady 75gr Hollow Boat Pointy Tip also did pretty good.

We both are shooting 22 Noslers loaded with heavy bullets, really long, from a sled.
85.5, 88, 90 grain @ 600 yards.

 

[akajun]

So don’t beat yourself up
The reason I knew what you were doing is because I did it
I bought out a store and a box of 75gr eldm was in the package with 75 gr bthp
Was loading my short line stuff
First two bullets Cause I wasn’t paying attention went deep in the case

FYI I’ve been shooting and reloading for over 30 years and am a high master and distinguished rifleman
The best lessons are learned the hard way

 

[Hidesato]

Thanks for the encouragement. I ordered SIERRA 22 CAL(.224) 77 GR which look to fit the mag for an AR so hopefully I have some better luck. I have a lot of once fired brass so I’ll definitely check the sizing to be sure I have the dies set properly.

 

[Bc'z]

Yep, I run into that more with 5.56/223 than any other round. I got a single feed magazine sled to feed the long ones.

I windowed the front of a magazine to gain 2.315 on a 6x45.
I imagine a person could do the same for 556/223.

 

[cdgaydos]

The error is on me. I was looking for 75 gr BRHP and incorrectly ordered the ELD-M. The Hornady reloading manual clearly called out a COL of 2.39 so it’s also my error in not reading. That said, 55 gr is too low a weight for what I’m looking for, ideally I’d run between a 62 and a 77.
Thank ls for all the feedback, I will crawl back under my desk and learn to read a bit.

Load the ELDMs to the proper length and single load them in your rifle… they shoot very well.

Also, no need to crimp… your picture looks as if you over crimped (none is necessary) with a bullet seated too deep in the case (the ogive is below the neck)… this collapses the top of the neck and forces the bottom of the neck wider - reducing neck tension.

Seat the ELDMs properly and try no crimp. Single load… not loaded into a magazine (they won’t fit).

Good luck!

 

[Sandstorm]

The problem i think is there is no bushing in his die and the bullet just drops in. So the neck is not sized at all …..is what i got from reading his initial posting. I could be all wrong but dont think so.
I dont think the initial problem was ever solved on why the bullets were dropping back into the case with no neck tension.?

 

[Rocketvapor]

Would be nice to know what set of dies he is using that comes with a collet die.
Using a collet die could be collet crimp or collet neck sizing.
My guess is a Lee 3 die set.
With most of the bearing surface below the neck a crimp wouldn't take much for the bullet to fall in.
Now to get the bullet out.

 

[6Creed73]

The problem i think is there is no bushing in his die and the bullet just drops in. So the neck is not sized at all …..is what i got from reading his initial posting. I could be all wrong but dont think so.
I dont think the initial problem was ever solved on why the bullets were dropping back into the case with no neck tension.?

Seating it too deep to the point the ogive is in the neck, then trying to crimp is most likely what pushed the bullet into the case.

 

[Hidesato]

Would be nice to know what set of dies he is using that comes with a collet die.
Using a collet die could be collet crimp or collet neck sizing.
My guess is a Lee 3 die set.
With most of the bearing surface below the neck a crimp wouldn't take much for the bullet to fall in.
Now to get the bullet out.
View attachment 1482828

223 Remington Dies

223 Remington Dies

leeprecision.com

This is the set so it looks like the collet neck sizing die. I think I’ll adjust the seating die to 2.39 and see if I have the same issue after measuring the neck.

 

[Doom]

A couple of notes since this can be confusing for a rookie:

I use the same dies.

Collet Dies-Use only on bolt action rifle on brass shot in that rifle.
Full Length Sizing die- Use in bolt action or semi-auto
Dead Length Sizing die- Does not taper crimp the mouth of the brass.
Factory crimp die- can be used, especially to provide a light crimp on none cannelure bullets.

Most people do not crimp for 223/556 Seimi-auto.

 

[Hidesato]

A couple of notes since this can be confusing for a rookie:

I use the same dies.

Collet Dies-Use only on bolt action rifle on brass shot in that rifle.
Full Length Sizing die- Use in bolt action or semi-auto
Dead Length Sizing die- Does not taper crimp the mouth of the brass.
Factory crimp die- can be used, especially to provide a light crimp on none cannelure bullets.

Most people do not crimp for 223/556 Seimi-auto.

This was really helpful as I wasn’t sure which was the correct one. I’ll definitely only look for 3 die sets from now on. Thank you

 

[SSL]

This was really helpful as I wasn’t sure which was the correct one. I’ll definitely only look for 3 die sets from now on. Thank you

The vast majority of manufacturers only offer two-die sets...sizing and seating. The seating dies from these manufacturers can be set to crimp, but crimping is totally unnecessary with most calibers. Collet sizing dies should be used only on brass fired in your rifle so the body of the case is formed to your chamber. The problem with that is that the case shoulder eventually has to be pushed back in order to chamber. This would require either a full body sizing die or a body only sizing die. Factory Crimp Dies are used to ensure functioning by not only crimping, but post-sizing the case to spec...another step not needed. Works great for straight wall handgun or rifle cartridges but pretty much useless for bottleneck cases.