remington extractor conundrum

[lurcher]

I fired a peice of poorly sized brass in my rem mod 7 7mm saum and bent the extractor trying to remove the sticky case. I sent the bolt off to a local gunsmith to have the extractor replaced. Upon recieving the bolt back the extractor looked like a poor fit in the bolt head, not sitting perfectly flush within the steel ring. The extractor is riveted and I was able to easily place a pick under it and pivot it on the rivet. The extractor is held at one end by the rivet and at the other end by a lip on the edge of the bolt face. However the extractor only extends a mm or so into the region of the boltface circumference that has the lip hence my ability to easily pivot it. I am thinking that the gunsmith may have installed a riveted old style (pre clip style) 0.473 boltface extractor on my 0.532 bolt face and so it is too short and does not extend far enough under the lip. Is this possible? I can extract but not eject, with cases just falling into the magazine well after removal from the chamber. Sorry for the crappy smart phone photo

 

[Dans40X]

All .532" mag face OEM Rem bolts take the riveted extractor from 1962 to present.
If the 'plumber used a case rim to hold the rivet in place while it was bucked 'tis the reason that you are able to wiggle/move the extractor in the bolt nose.

When properly installed,you can not move/wiggle the extractor in the bolt nose even prior to rivet installation.

A proper offset anvil works wonders to hold/buck the rivet head while peening the rivet stem followed by blending the excess rivet stem flush w/ bolt diameter w/ a needle file.
Never re-use/re-shape the extractor.
Extractor R&R task takes approximately 2minutes.

 

[rayjay]

It looks to me like you broke off the front face of the bolt when you were extracting the stuck case. If this is the case you will either need to have the existing bolt machined for a Sako or M16 extractor or you will need a new factory bolt.

 

[Ggmac]

Get a real smith . That bolt should not be back in service in its current condition .
The bolt nose is missing and from the pic it seems the 3rd ring of steel , bolt nose , has expanded and appears oblong . It could be the pic . But the bolt is missing bits , never a good thing .

 

[lurcher]

Get a real smith . That bolt should not be back in service in its current condition .
The bolt nose is missing and from the pic it seems the 3rd ring of steel , bolt nose , has expanded and appears oblong . It could be the pic . But the bolt is missing bits , never a good thing .

Get a real smith . That bolt should not be back in service in its current condition .
The bolt nose is missing and from the pic it seems the 3rd ring of steel , bolt nose , has expanded and appears oblong . It could be the pic . But the bolt is missing bits , never a good thing .

I don't think the bolt face is missing anything (poor quality photo on my part sorry). It doesn't look like it from the photo but the bolt face is tidy and smooth, no burrs or rough edges to suggest any problems such as part of the lip torn off. For a magnum bolt face the lip only extends around part of the circumference of the bolt. See for instance this photo mag rem bolt face (left).

 

[X Ring Accuracy]

True, your present smith didn't rivet it properly. Best choice is to find another and move on. Riveted extractors are gunsmithing 101 IMO. Chalk it up to lesson learned. Its $10 in parts MAX including shipping and 15 min of time with a coffee break.

 

[DHD]

I'll say to listen to these guys who have experience with this issue. That stated, I've had 3 of the SAUM's (don't have any now thank goodness) and none of them would eject worth a damn. Now, I don't like cases to be thrown into the next County (I typically shorten ejector springs a coil), but I do like them to at least make it out of the port. With the SAUM trio I had, I had to work the bolt like a Marine (not an insult Marines, but ya'll are hell on a bolt stop and you know it) to get them out of the port. And no, I didn't shortened any of their ejector springs.

If it extracts, it extracts. If it doesn't eject, welcome to my old SAUM world. I don't know how much experience you have with the gun, so if your rifle never had this issue, then you have a good one.

 

[Ggmac]

I don't think you got what I'm seeing , can you send another pic of the orig bolt nose ?
And what the heck is on your bolt handle ? Welding slag ?

 

[X Ring Accuracy]

Gmac, I think you are seeing bad photography and the slag is the primary extraction ramp with its uneven surface? Just guessing here

 

[Ggmac]

I was thinking it was the pic ,but maybe an attempt to cure little to no primary extraction ? I've seen stranger . Especially when a smith could not install a rem extractor .
We all cut our teeth on Remington's , some old enough to have done it on real muzzle stuffers , well maybe Mauser, and springfiels . I'm no longer shocked to see someone who calls themselves a smith , use unsafe practices to make a buck . When I started , we had a few pistols , Smiths , Colts , the gov45 , the high power and rifles were Remington's , winchesters , Mauser ,Springfields , and maybe Savage . Now , I can't even count the pistols ,let alone the modern rifles .
How could a gunsmith possibly be schooled in all ? I know , they Google it !
To quote (as I remember it anyway ) yesterday I couldn't spell gunsmith , now I are one . Yes , gunsmith kinks , volume 1 .
Thanks for letting an old guy rant , I feel better .

 

[lurcher]

I was thinking it was the pic ,but maybe an attempt to cure little to no primary extraction ? I've seen stranger . Especially when a smith could not install a rem extractor .
We all cut our teeth on Remington's , some old enough to have done it on real muzzle stuffers , well maybe Mauser, and springfiels . I'm no longer shocked to see someone who calls themselves a smith , use unsafe practices to make a buck . When I started , we had a few pistols , Smiths , Colts , the gov45 , the high power and rifles were Remington's , winchesters , Mauser ,Springfields , and maybe Savage . Now , I can't even count the pistols ,let alone the modern rifles .
How could a gunsmith possibly be schooled in all ? I know , they Google it !
To quote (as I remember it anyway ) yesterday I couldn't spell gunsmith , now I are one . Yes , gunsmith kinks , volume 1 .
Thanks for letting an old guy rant , I feel better .

 

[lurcher]

here are some better pics opinions please

 

[Ggmac]

when you insert a case , does the case rim hit the internal rivet head ?
It early and I've not had coffee yet ! More when I can find my glasses . Much nicer pics .

OK , coffee is in hand , on your second pic you can see a very small crack on the small bevel that should be most if not all the way around the bolt nose .
I don't have any short mag bolt in the shop so I'm going off my memory . More later.

 

[Danny1788]

It looks like your bolt is missing metal, that should be under the lip of the bolt nose. The bolt nose should be a complete circle and the clip sits in a groove and is held in place with a rivet. Yours looks like it broke the top of the groove off.

 

[Danny1788]

 

[akajun]

you need a new bolt or have it bushed and sleeved and a m16 extractor installed. The highlighted area that 300whbymag listed is chipped and missing.
The Gunsmith may have done you a favor by poorly riveting the extractor, cause now you caught the problem. But that is something he should have caught.

 

[kendog]

The bolt on a Remington 700 is supposed to fail like yours shows in the event of over pressure. The nose is supposed to swell up and seal the breech. Saves the rest of the gun. Yours looks like it was just enough to strain it but not completely swell up. If it is a long action you can find mag face bolts on ebay quite cheap, not so sure about short mags bolts. Chances are real good that it will head space unless some other "fixing" has been done to your particular rifle.
Measure the head diameter of your fired cases and also some new brass and post what you come up with. Measure just in front of the extractor groove.

 

[Ggmac]

I'm not sure how it works down there but I would have the bolt magnufluxed ( checked for cracks ) at lugs and measure headspace to make sure the receiver is not damaged before spending money on repair .
Nice goin 300 Weatherby , I'm tech challenged , too old to learn . I wish I could outline and post pics .
Gary

 

[carlsbad]

I don't like the look of that bolt posted by 300wbymag above. there should be a lip above the extractor and there shouldn't be grind marks on the face.

I would buy a new bolt body...of course now you're into a headspace issue. A good smith might be able to adjust the headspace without much trouble, especially if it is a bit tight.

I'm not sure there is enough metal left there to properly install an M16 or sako extractor. I'd have to look at it. Personally I like the Sako over the M16 because the M16 requires the nose cone of the barrel to be opened up much oversize. I like keeping it tighter.

PM if you'd like to send me the bolt for evaluation.

--Jerry

 

[lurcher]

my lip extends pretty much half way around the bolt head. Can someone tell me how far around the circumference the lip should extend? If its more than half i am looking at a m16 or a sako style extractor. I hate to open another can of worms but which is the better option? The rifle is a wild cat for the story see here and here I have been very careful with load development but I have had problems with sticky cases related to forming that have been resolved. If i lost material off the bolt I think it happened in the recent episode where i insufficiently sized some fired cases and broke the extractor prior to that it extracted fine. I have heard that a sako extractor undercuts one lug on a 700, does it significantly reduce the strength of the action or introduce other issues? I will do some homework on it