Remarkable little scale
- Thread starter BoydAllen
- Start date
Mark W
Gold $$ Contributor
You guys talked me into it. By the by, they’re only $19 now.
Me too...lol. I just emailed the link to my wife and asked her to get one ordered.
I did everything I could think of and didn't find a reason for this. I even put a couple hard plastic pads in the ends of the pivot slot limiting it to about 1/16" of side travel. Still, if the pivot was towards the back, it read different than if it were the other way, even though nothing touched anywhere. The sharp edge was straight and level. The magnets act as a brake so I tried removing them. It made no difference except it took a long time to settle down. I gave up and it's still boxed up and on a shelf probably never to be used again. It was sensitive enough to usually show one kernel of Varget but the weight all depended on the horizontal position of the pivot bar. But if it wasn't in the exact same position, then it weighed different. After I set the pan on I'd lightly blow across it and allow the bar to reset without touching it. I thought I was loading precision ammo but when I broke down several and weighed the powder on the FX, they varied sometimes over 3/10 grain.
Bill Norris
Back in the Day
You guys talked me into it. By the by, they’re only $19 now.
Ordered me one a bit ago too. For $ 19.00 can't go too wrong anyway.
joshb
Gold $$ Contributor
I’m a dyed in the wool curmudgeonly anti electronic dinosaur. I “swore” I’d never give up my SParker tuned 10-10. This is a big leap for me!
I’ll use it to check weights for a while.
Rocketvapor
Gold $$ Contributor
I like little cheap digital scales.
I think the one being talked about here is a little delicate, so treat it kindly.
Remember 20 grams full scale it not a lot. Over range it and the strain gauges can become unbonded.
If the glue yields the strain gauge can drift like crazy.
Watch for powder grains getting in the gap or the small pan dragging at the sides.
For the BEST results use the scale to compare to known check weights. Check weights NEAR your target.
Check OFTEN.
Buy some check weights. Non Magnetic stainless steel are more durable over brass.
Treat them kindly also. Even if not 'right on the money' you are relying on long term 'Sameness'. The SAME today as several years down the road.
When you get a new scale test it with known weights. Calibrate it, but them check near your target. Over and over, days and days. If it doesn't perform, contact Amazon
ebay, and complain. Often you will get a replacement or a credit.
I think the one being talked about here is a little delicate, so treat it kindly.
Remember 20 grams full scale it not a lot. Over range it and the strain gauges can become unbonded.
If the glue yields the strain gauge can drift like crazy.
Watch for powder grains getting in the gap or the small pan dragging at the sides.
For the BEST results use the scale to compare to known check weights. Check weights NEAR your target.
Check OFTEN.
Buy some check weights. Non Magnetic stainless steel are more durable over brass.
Treat them kindly also. Even if not 'right on the money' you are relying on long term 'Sameness'. The SAME today as several years down the road.
When you get a new scale test it with known weights. Calibrate it, but them check near your target. Over and over, days and days. If it doesn't perform, contact Amazon
ebay, and complain. Often you will get a replacement or a credit.
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I’m running two bald eagles from Grizzly side by side now. I balance the same pan to both scales so each powder charge gets checked on both. If one’s tare weight is a little off without the pan the other one is usually correct. Once you figure out these little strain gauge scales quirks, you can make them work accurately.
46and2
Silver $$ Contributor
Do you have a link to the one you bought?
It's at the bottom of the first post.
coldboreshot
Silver $$ Contributor
Rocketvapor
Gold $$ Contributor
Is a couple of kernels good enough?
It's part of an overall evaluation of your reloading process.
Many load workups recommend trying 0.2 grain steps to find your final load.
0.2 grains of a 25 grain .223 charge is different than 0.2 grains of a 80 grain 300WM,
or a 6 grain pistol charge.
If the BEST you can do is +/- 0.1 grain, what does that do to your velocity?
Heaven forbid you use a scale that only displays even numbers
Maybe nothing, or close to it, but it pays to know.
Think of percentages of your reloading process instead of absolute values.
MATH? Don't go throwing MATH into reloading
Do you NEED a couple tenths of a grain or a couple tenths of a percent?
Are you just checking for safe values or trying for precision?
At least map out your precision requirements and see where it passes or fails.
Here's a quick video I've posted before showing a $45 dollar scale and how to use a
Check Weight. How long does it take to check a check weight every few charges.
It's part of an overall evaluation of your reloading process.
Many load workups recommend trying 0.2 grain steps to find your final load.
0.2 grains of a 25 grain .223 charge is different than 0.2 grains of a 80 grain 300WM,
or a 6 grain pistol charge.
If the BEST you can do is +/- 0.1 grain, what does that do to your velocity?
Heaven forbid you use a scale that only displays even numbers
Maybe nothing, or close to it, but it pays to know.
Think of percentages of your reloading process instead of absolute values.
MATH? Don't go throwing MATH into reloading
Do you NEED a couple tenths of a grain or a couple tenths of a percent?
Are you just checking for safe values or trying for precision?
At least map out your precision requirements and see where it passes or fails.
Here's a quick video I've posted before showing a $45 dollar scale and how to use a
Check Weight. How long does it take to check a check weight every few charges.
TAJ45
Silver $$ Contributor
Interesting.
However, I doubt if I would make much of a "click or tink" setting the container back on the platen. Just me.
AND, while saying this, I thought of a way to reduce potential shock by using a pc or two of the porous window AC filter material as a cushion on the platen. Just an observation.
However, I doubt if I would make much of a "click or tink" setting the container back on the platen. Just me.
AND, while saying this, I thought of a way to reduce potential shock by using a pc or two of the porous window AC filter material as a cushion on the platen. Just an observation.
Rocketvapor
Gold $$ Contributor
Load does need to be vertical over the center of the platen.
The small load cell in the $19 is easy to get an off center load.
The whole thing about the cheap scales, other than being cheap and expendable
Is how they are used. Done right, they are well worth having.
If no other reason you trip and fall down the stairs with your 5-0-5.
The small load cell in the $19 is easy to get an off center load.
The whole thing about the cheap scales, other than being cheap and expendable
Is how they are used. Done right, they are well worth having.
If no other reason you trip and fall down the stairs with your 5-0-5.
Bill Norris
Back in the Day
I just received the Gem20 yesterday and carried out a comparison with my Mettler Toledo analytical balance. I weighed out Varget powder (43.5 gr = 2.8188 g) by trickling up in the Gem20 until it just reached, and remained steady at, 2.819 g. I then transferred the powder to another dish on the Mettler, which was zeroed to that dish. Here are the raw data (in grams):
Ned, this is great data and much appreciated. I ran your numbers to double-check and still get good results, but my SD (and even Avg) are slightly off from what you post here. Wondering if there might be a transcription error or something somewhere.
Thanks
Ned Ludd
Silver $$ Contributor
I'm not sure what you are asking. I just rechecked the average +/- SD in the 3rd data column of my table and it checks out. Are you saying that you're not getting the kind average and SD I posted using your scale?
Rocketvapor
Gold $$ Contributor
A trick to calibrate these little scales, after letting them stabilize, and keeping drafts away from the pan,
is to calibrate per manufacturer's procedure. Either the 10 gram, 20 gram, zero procedure of the 10 gram, zero recommended by some (They save sending you two 10 gram weights).
Put your pan on and check a 2 gram weight. The linearity of the scale may show an error at 2 grams.
Remember that's pan plus 2 grams.
Calibrating with 10.1 grams or so weight (add a small piece of paper) and zero for zero will fool the scale range a little.
Calibrating with a 10 grams weight and a small piece of paper for zero will also fool the scale range a little.
The object is to correct for linearity errors at the target range you want to use.
Once calibrated for a distorted full scale value, use it as you would normally.
Try it now at the value you want. (pan Plus powder)
Will not change SD, just nominal indication.
Very precise scales are often used to measure/calibrate stainless steel wights you buy.
Which are then used to calibrate the scales you buy.
A standard of known mass is placed on a digital scale (used to be dual pan balances) and the unknown mass is swapped. This is repeated until difference can be determined.
The digital has to be working properly but does not have to read dead on.
Just the SAME each time.
I used to calibrate the mass standards used to calibrate most of the analytic balances out there, from 1980 up to about 2010.
is to calibrate per manufacturer's procedure. Either the 10 gram, 20 gram, zero procedure of the 10 gram, zero recommended by some (They save sending you two 10 gram weights).
Put your pan on and check a 2 gram weight. The linearity of the scale may show an error at 2 grams.
Remember that's pan plus 2 grams.
Calibrating with 10.1 grams or so weight (add a small piece of paper) and zero for zero will fool the scale range a little.
Calibrating with a 10 grams weight and a small piece of paper for zero will also fool the scale range a little.
The object is to correct for linearity errors at the target range you want to use.
Once calibrated for a distorted full scale value, use it as you would normally.
Try it now at the value you want. (pan Plus powder)
Will not change SD, just nominal indication.
Very precise scales are often used to measure/calibrate stainless steel wights you buy.
Which are then used to calibrate the scales you buy.
A standard of known mass is placed on a digital scale (used to be dual pan balances) and the unknown mass is swapped. This is repeated until difference can be determined.
The digital has to be working properly but does not have to read dead on.
Just the SAME each time.
I used to calibrate the mass standards used to calibrate most of the analytic balances out there, from 1980 up to about 2010.
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Rocketvapor
Gold $$ Contributor
Want an exercise to practice your weighing skills ??
Get the kids involved.
Pick 10 brand new looking nickels with the same date. Sort of like an unmarked deck of cards.
Weigh them with your scale, recording values.
Take my word for it, they are NOT the same
Repeat until you are sure you have them in weight order and number them with a small pencil mark on the back.
I doubt you will notice the weight of the mark.
Now, shut everything down, being careful not to damage the nickels or get a lot of skin oil on them.
Come back and measure them again. Blind. Don't cheat and look at the back
Get the same order?
Now, if you just knew how much they actually weighed.
(I bet you could compare them to a reasonably accurate 5 gram standard, or in pairs compared to a good 10 gram standard)
Get the kids involved.
Pick 10 brand new looking nickels with the same date. Sort of like an unmarked deck of cards.
Weigh them with your scale, recording values.
Take my word for it, they are NOT the same
Repeat until you are sure you have them in weight order and number them with a small pencil mark on the back.
I doubt you will notice the weight of the mark.
Now, shut everything down, being careful not to damage the nickels or get a lot of skin oil on them.
Come back and measure them again. Blind. Don't cheat and look at the back
Get the same order?
Now, if you just knew how much they actually weighed.
(I bet you could compare them to a reasonably accurate 5 gram standard, or in pairs compared to a good 10 gram standard)
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Ned, sorry, the transcription error was on my end. To answer your question, I ran an average and SD on your 3rd column of data. After checking the numbers twice, I couldn't understand why mine didn't match yours. I guess I'm at the stage where I need to check things three times.
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