rem 7saum or 284win
- Thread starter therifler
- Start date
XTR
F-TR obssessed shooting junkie
The AI would be nice in a hunting rifle. In hind sight I may have gone that route. I was thinking like a high volume competition reloader and not wanting to have to fire form. With the AI you could get a little more velocity, but not a lot.
All that said, the 308 case has very little taper, you only get about 4% more capacity when you do the AI thing. When you consider that a 30-06 only gets about 100 to 150FPS more than a 308 with a lot more capacity, you have to wonder just how much more you can get out of an ever so slightly larger case. Ive heard 100 FPS claims, but as with all WWW claims of velocity I take it with a grain of salt (or more
)
Personally I think the 7-08 is about the best you can do in a hunting rifle before you go to a Mag of some color. It pushes 140 class bullets with very good velocity. You get moderate recoil and great performance in a short action 308 case based platform. If you need or want to push 175 class stuff then you probably need a bigger case.
You can confidently shoot anything lighter than elk with a 140. (and if you do your job with bullet placement you can take elk)
All that said, the 308 case has very little taper, you only get about 4% more capacity when you do the AI thing. When you consider that a 30-06 only gets about 100 to 150FPS more than a 308 with a lot more capacity, you have to wonder just how much more you can get out of an ever so slightly larger case. Ive heard 100 FPS claims, but as with all WWW claims of velocity I take it with a grain of salt (or more
)Personally I think the 7-08 is about the best you can do in a hunting rifle before you go to a Mag of some color. It pushes 140 class bullets with very good velocity. You get moderate recoil and great performance in a short action 308 case based platform. If you need or want to push 175 class stuff then you probably need a bigger case.
You can confidently shoot anything lighter than elk with a 140. (and if you do your job with bullet placement you can take elk)
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MAGNETISCH
BR2's!
If these were my two choices, it would be the .284. Simply because of brass availability. I'd also go with a heavier bullet.
You can do anything with the 7 saum that you can do with the 284 win. Factory loaded 7 saum will be inferior to the 284 win. Hand loads for the saum will be almost identical. Both are excellent for elk and with proper bullets can be used at very extended ranges provided the shooter is capable of those shots. Can't go wrong with either cartridge.
therifler
Silver $$ Contributor
guys thanks for the advise it will be the .284 on a win. action . mike www.therifler.com
If your first post is correct and all you'll need is a gun for out to 400 yds max, why not the 7-08 ? Much easier to load and find components for and easily fits the bill for range and utility on the game you want to shoot. Bullets from 140 - 180 and mild recoil with most of them. Just a thought.
Is there any reason that a 7 Rem Mag would not be as accurate as a 280AI? This is from a guy who has owned 3 280 Ai's. If you headspace off the shoulder does the belt really matter? On paper it seems more versatile than any of the above mentioned rounds, at least for hunting. It can be loaded mildly with a 140 and duplicate any of the other above rounds. You could also probably get over 2950 with a heavy VLD. I have never owned a belted mag.
284 is a super sensible cartridge. I considered it when bought a NULA from Melvin Forbes. Brass availability was a concern at that time. Never thought about necking up Lapua 6.5x284. Went 260 on that rifle and should have done 7-08 or 284. I have yet to shoot anything that would not have been perfect for my first centerfire, which was a 700 in 270 Win. That was a few dollars ago in custom rifles and reloading stuff. Could have gone on nice African hunt with some change left to out west with my 270. Critters would have not been the wiser.
Killing deer out to 400 doesn't take much. Out of those suggestions I would go 284 winchester. Lapua brass is easy to find. However if it was me I would just use a 6.5x47 for deer at those ranges. There isn't as much recoil. A properly built one will shoot in the .1s. The brass will last 30+ firings and a 140 hybrid has more than enough energy to kill a deer out to 800 yds. Ive shot a dozen deer w the 140 out to a hair over 300 yds. All dropped dead except for one that got hit a hair behind the shoulder blade. She went 30 yds. Exit holes with that bullet were silver dollar size.
A couple guys on this post mentioned the 7-08 improved. That is a great choice also. I have a customer, spclark on this forum, who just tied a 1000 yd national high power iron sight record with one. Hes pushing the 180s at 2800 fps. His wildcat has almost zero neck. Thats the 4th national record so far this year by customers.
A couple guys on this post mentioned the 7-08 improved. That is a great choice also. I have a customer, spclark on this forum, who just tied a 1000 yd national high power iron sight record with one. Hes pushing the 180s at 2800 fps. His wildcat has almost zero neck. Thats the 4th national record so far this year by customers.
I am going to hunt whitetail almost exclusively this year with a 6.5x47. I may use a 280Ai for really large fields. Hoping for the best with the 130 Berger Hunting VLD. Never shot a critter with the 47L or a Berger bullet. Killed lots of whitetail with Accubonds. Most have run unless both shoulders broken. Switched to the Ballistic Tip 140's last year and got better terminal performance on deer. Have used TTSX's as well with success. Looking forward to trying the Berger 168's and 130's.
Out of interest is it still possible to buy remington 7saum brass in the USA? we cannot get it out here (New Zealand) any more. The cheapest option for us is to neck down norma 300 saum and neck turn. More work and the brass is softer so loads have to be reduced to avoid pressure issues. 7saum nosler brass is only available in lots of 25 and is a ridiculous price if the rumours are true that Norma makes this brass for Nosler then Nosler is creaming it. No surprises there as at least out here all nosler stuff is expensive compared to hornady, yet as far as projectiles go I don't know if the cost difference is justified (e.g nosler ballistic tips vs SST's SST's way cheaper) that's my rant for the day.......
AND you don't need custom dies if you already have 'em for 7-08. Uses standard 308 brass (I'm using Lapua's superb Palma brass) fire-formed to blow the shoulder forward 3.5mm.
The reamer I had made from the designer's original drawing (Robert Chombart, same fellow designed the CG INCH action along with RPA'S Quadlock and original Quadlite, Swing & Millennium, CG Xtreme trigger) has virtually zero throat so the throater I ordered at the same time can be used to custom-ream the throat to suit particular bullets. I wasn't sure I could push Berger's 180 Hybrid to "effective" velocities when I started out so I began with their 168 VLD.
Once that proved worthwhile another turn or two with the reamer put the Hybrids 0.020" off the lands & enough H4350 to get to 2,800 fps without pressure. (I'm waiting for the RL-16 I ordered to see if I can improve on that!)
First 1,000 yd match opportunity late in June saw the 200-15X score I turned in that Ryan mentioned.
I handed off another barrel to him this weekend, this time a 1:8.5 twist, thinking that maybe with a little more spin I don't need as much velocity? We'll see....
Nothing wrong with the 7rsaum, but my mindset is more 284 or 284 improve variation.
use 6.5-284 Lapua brass and you are set. Easier to find these days, better than SAUM Just neck it up and you are set.
Want a mule deer or elk rifle? .30/284; bigger? .338 or .358 on up to 9.3 or .375...
go with a .30 or larger and get that long bore life. How much better is the .284 than the 6.5/284 in bore longevity?
Not much difference. Want the velocity and mile distance capability? Go with 6.5/284 and use premium bullet and slay whatever game you set sights on.
Great cartridge with the 35deg shoulder... Use a long action and then you got better seating flexibility for heavy high-BC bullets.
Want a mule deer or elk rifle? .30/284; bigger? .338 or .358 on up to 9.3 or .375...
go with a .30 or larger and get that long bore life. How much better is the .284 than the 6.5/284 in bore longevity?
Not much difference. Want the velocity and mile distance capability? Go with 6.5/284 and use premium bullet and slay whatever game you set sights on.
Great cartridge with the 35deg shoulder... Use a long action and then you got better seating flexibility for heavy high-BC bullets.
use 59grns(freebore .220) or so N165 with 180 vld or hybrid. It will give you 2950fps with stellar accuracy. Barrel life will be extended greatly with N-165. If that does not work try H1000 around 60grs. This is in my barrel so work up. The two powders i mentioned here will extend barrel life by at least 500-600 rounds. I did my first couple with H4831sc and barrels went south at 1400 rounds.
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