Reloading die question?

[muleman69]

Something I have never seen or heard of? Friend brought over his forester f/l dies yesterday and wanted to no why they won't resize neck ,he has been using them all along with good neck tension and now they won't squeeze neck down. Brass is hornady and lapua reloaded on theses dies three times. Brass has not been turned but has been annealed. Neck wall thickness is about .013-.014 thick. Took expander ball out ran a couple cases with die adjusted touching shell holder and bullet still pushes in hand tight. He even called Forester and they were stumped. These are not bushing dies. Cal..260 rem. They are going back to Forester today for an evaluation

 

[243winxb]

reloaded on theses dies three times.

Neck wall thickness can be thinned by over working the brass using standard fl dies.

In my case, 243 win , loaded rounds neck diameter was right at the .276" maximum, when new.. Accuracy was better then normal. At each loading the diameter got smaller and accuracy dropped off. At a certain point, neck diameter stabilized. Bullet hold/neck tension retained a good grip on the bullet, unlike your problem.

I do not anneal. Your example did. Was annealing over done? Making brass extra soft?


Partial full length resizing- online i have seen a new reloader trying it and the neck never got sized at all.
Buf you said the shell holder was in full contact with the bottom of the fl die. Strange.

 

[Dusty Stevens]

This is a good example of needing a bushing die. The fixed diameter of a die only works for most cases most of the time which require hunting accuracy.

 

[ireload2]

Sounds like the die is ok but he ruined the brass when he annealed it.
Another possibility is the expander ball is too large.
If the brass is not ruined you can always polish .001 to .002 off of the expander.

The common factory FL die sizes case necks about .006 to .007 more than necessary.

 

[243winxb]

Was the neck custom honed by Forester?

Crimp- Is the crimper making contact, when seating bullet? If over done, bullets may become loose.

 

[muleman69]

Neck wall thickness can be thinned by over working the brass using standard fl dies.

In my case, 243 win , loaded rounds neck diameter was right at the .276" maximum, when new.. Accuracy was better then normal. At each loading the diameter got smaller and accuracy dropped off. At a certain point, neck diameter stabilized. Bullet hold/neck tension retained a good grip on the bullet, unlike your problem.

I do not anneal. Your example did. Was annealing over done? Making brass extra soft?


Partial full length resizing- online i have seen a new reloader trying it and the neck never got sized at all.
Buf you said the shell holder was in full contact with the bottom of the fl die. Strange.

We also tried some of the same brass that had not been annealed yet?

 

[muleman69]

This is a good example of needing a bushing die. The fixed diameter of a die only works for most cases most of the time which require hunting accuracy.

I have never heard this before, why would fixed die stop resizing neck?

 

[muleman69]

Sounds like the die is ok but he ruined the brass when he annealed it.
Another possibility is the expander ball is too large.
If the brass is not ruined you can always polish .001 to .002 off of the expander.

The common factory FL die sizes case necks about .006 to .007 more than necessary.

We ended up trying brass both annealed and not. Also tried sizing with and with out expander? Made several die adjustments with no results?

 

[muleman69]

Was the neck custom honed by Forester?

Crimp- Is the crimper making contact, when seating bullet? If over done, bullets may become loose.

Not custom honed ,no crimp issues

 

[Dusty Stevens]

I have never heard this before, why would fixed die stop resizing neck?

Brass not staying sized down after too much annealing. You could use a smaller bushing in a bushing die and be usable after a couple more firings

 

[muleman69]

Brass not staying sized down after too much annealing. You could use a smaller bushing in a bushing die and be usable after a couple more firings

I'm still not following, we tried same brass unannealed as well with same results.

 

[Dusty Stevens]

Guess that lot of brass has a thinner neck. See if you can measure that thickness and compare to another batch. If you take the expander off thats all the tension youre ever going to get

 

[rsbhunter]

Were the dies bought new or used? Were there any measurements made on the brass before sizing and after WHEN the dies did resize ? What was the neck tension before? This is something i have never heard of til this....curious as to the outcome.....rsbhunter

 

[muleman69]

Were the dies bought new or used? Were there any measurements made on the brass before sizing and after WHEN the dies did resize ? What was the neck tension before? This is something i have never heard of til this....curious as to the outcome.....rsbhunter

The dies are a friends,not sure if he bought new or used? I have no measurements prior to this problem as he is just getting started . I do no he loaded lots of rounds with the dies and the same brass that shot very well. It will be interesting to see what forester has to say as I'm just as curious.

 

[muleman69]

Guess that lot of brass has a thinner neck. See if you can measure that thickness and compare to another batch. If you take the expander off thats all the tension youre ever going to get

The brass all measured .013 to .014 thousand. The Hornady was some store bought loaded ammo and the Lapua was brand new . I will measure some of mine and compare

 

[rsbhunter]

I can't blame the brass, but wondering if the friend had the Forster dies neck honed to a certain od,a custom service they offer, as I did mine. Depending on the brass, I use Lapua and Peterson, I get some that have less neck tension than the other brand.....I now use an RCBS body and Lee collect sizer for the Peterson and the Forster FL for Lapua....most "stock" dies (and confirmed by Forster) size the neck about .006-.008 .... which is alot......rsbhunter

 

[JRR]

I bet you are using the inside contoured seating die instead of the sizing die.

 

[Dusty Stevens]

I bet you are using the inside contoured seating die instead of the sizing die.

Seating dies dont have expander balls on them

 

[muleman69]

I can't blame the brass, but wondering if the friend had the Forester dies neck honed to a certain od,a custom service they offer, as I did mine. Depending on the brass, I use Lapua and Peterson, I get some that have less neck tension than the other brand.....I now use an RCBS body and Lee collect sizer for the Peterson and the Forster FL for Lapua....most "stock" dies (and confirmed by Forster) size the neck about .006-.008 .... which is alot......rsbhunter

Buddy text me and said he borrowed another die and it worked well. Forester is going back as we speak. Another question? Do you run brass on your Lee collet die after you body size just to improve concentricity?

 

[rsbhunter]

I just checked my Forster die, they engrave the neck ID on top of the die if it has been honed, mine shows "290" ....if it shows a number, have him save the shipping, there is nothing Forster will be able to do for him....buy a new one (recommend Forster) and have it custom honed IF all of his brass necks are the same thickness...rsbhunter