Rear squeeze bag for precision shots

[jelenko]

If I'm looking for .3 to .5 MOA groups at 100 yards in reasonably calm wind, will using a rear squeeze bag be a limiting factor? Assuming the rifle, ammo and myself are all up to the task.

I'm planning to shoot from prone with a Protector front pedestal.

Thanks

 

[Allen Corneau]

I use a cheap Caldwell rear bag when I shoot off the bench and it seems to be just fine.

I don't do Benchrest or F-class, but if i did I would upgrade my rear bag situation. I just need to check zeros and do load development for my high power rifle, so a simple bag works for me.

 

[K22]

That's a demanding standard, i.e., .3 to .5 moa, at least to shoot at that level consistently.

Speaking personally, the only way I can shoot in that range is with my best varmint rifles, with finely tuned reloads, off the bench with a solid front and rear "owl ear" rest and adhering to all the key shooting fundamentals of breath control, trigger control and follow through. The owl ear rear rest helps mitigate twisting the rifle. Keeping the rifle level (avoiding cant) is important when shooting at that level. A scope level helps in that regard.

I am not a benchrest shooter, but when I do shoot off the bench which is rare these days, I make small elevation adjustments with hand pressure on the rear bag to position the rifle until I get the desire point of aim. But do not use the squeeze method. However, I know several bipod shooters that do and shoot very well. But you have to discipline yourself to maintain a consistent squeeze throughout the shot. It's kind of like "follow through" in making a shot. The squeeze method introduces another variable to be mastered.

The squeeze method has its place for practical shooting off a bipod. Mastering the technique through regularly practice is essential for consistent shooting. While I will defer to benchrest shooters, I believe a solid rear rest that minimizes both vertical and horizontal movement is the best technique for high precision bench shooting.

 

[ShtrRdy]

Its' possible. Here is a picture of 20 shots out of a bolt gun in 223 using a bipod and rear squeeze bag. 15 of the 20 shots are into less that 1/2".

(click on picture for larger image)

 

[FeMan]

Its very achievable if the rifle is capable. Just like anything though, you need to practice, find out what the rifle likes and develop consistency.

Here is a target from yesterdays load workup with the new 6GT shot at 100 from the bench with a bipod and rear squeeze bag. The best group was 0.09"

 

[Clancy]

Absolutely not a problem, but a little firmer bag that you don’t have to squeeze will work better.

 

[perazziguy]

Tony Boyer was/is a squeezer. He did pretty ok...

 

[Clancy]

Tony Boyer was/is a squeezer. He did pretty ok...

Totally different kind of bag. But yea.

@jelenko I don’t know your background or accomplishments or anything, so I don’t know what experience level I’m speaking to- forgive me for that.

.3-.5 with a good rifle just isn’t difficult, and I certainly wouldn’t worry about the bag with that kind of accuracy in mind. I’ve got a handful or rear bags between $20 and $350 and there’s just not $330 worth of difference in them. I try my best to match the buttstock up with a bag that has the appropriate ear spacing, but I end up doing a whole lot of load development off of a protektor rabbit ear rear bag or an Armageddon gear bag. Most of my stuff is small 6mm as I’m fist and foremost a deer/varmint hunter and I absolutely won’t keep a rifle intact that won’t agg in the .2s. Life is just too short to shoot patterns instead of groups. I’m just telling you that to further illustrate the fact that I’ve come to the conclusion that the rear bag just isn’t that important. Just don’t get it too firm.

 

[jelenko]

Thank you to everyone for your comments.
I full appreciate the dependency on my skills.

The reason for asking is I'm wanting to explore/build confidence in my handloads.
So far I've been testing from prone with a sling. I'm skilled enough at that to identify pretty good loads - enough that I reasonably regularly clean 1.7 MOA targets.

But, there are always off call shots - still in the 10 ring but 'off' by 1/2 to 3/4 MOA. I'm wanting to know enough about my handloads to know if those off call shots are me or the rifle/ammo.
Of course, this is a bit of chicken and egg - one being my skills the other being rifle/ammo.

The benches at the club I belong to are such that I have to stand to shoot off them. I've gotten really wide results - e.g., 5 shots into .27" at 100 yards to 1.2" => don't have confidence in shooting from them.

I'm thinking/hoping that shooting prone with a front rest and rear bag will be more consistent.

 

[Clancy]

A good bench is a must. Sometimes that bench needs to be the ground.

Don’t be afraid of a bipod either. Try both. I’ve heard all the horror stories about them, but I shoot just as well if not better off a bipod. That’s probably just because that’s what I’ve been using the most for 25 years.

 

[jelenko]

Totally different kind of bag. But yea.

@jelenko I don’t know your background or accomplishments or anything, so I don’t know what experience level I’m speaking to- forgive me for that.

.3-.5 with a good rifle just isn’t difficult, and I certainly wouldn’t worry about the bag with that kind of accuracy in mind. I’ve got a handful or rear bags between $20 and $350 and there’s just not $330 worth of difference in them. I try my best to match the buttstock up with a bag that has the appropriate ear spacing, but I end up doing a whole lot of load development off of a protektor rabbit ear rear bag or an Armageddon gear bag. Most of my stuff is small 6mm as I’m fist and foremost a deer/varmint hunter and I absolutely won’t keep a rifle intact that won’t agg in the .2s. Life is just too short to shoot patterns instead of groups. I’m just telling you that to further illustrate the fact that I’ve come to the conclusion that the rear bag just isn’t that important. Just don’t get it too firm.

Thanks!
I'm using a Protector front rest [an old one with one of those bags on a metal pedestal]. I've tried rabbit ear rear bag but the stock keeps sinking into the ears screwing up my elevation.
I've just bought two different Armageddon rear bags - their X bag and the small rectangular one which I've refilled with heavy sand.

As I mentioned in another post, I'm reasonably skilled in prone with a sling. I've done enough with this 'rested' stuff to understand there's a learning curve specific to it. I think it's going to take a number of rounds down range.

 

[FeMan]

I use various size Game Changers with glass bead fill for rear bags. I have the best luck when I am just using the rear bag to provide stability and using my shoulder and hand (touching the bag and rifle) for support. Too much bag contact makes it difficult to replicate shot to shot and I find my precision suffers. Getting to the top of the ears, squeezing them together with my support hand and steadying the rifle on that (not really even touching the bag) is the most consistent for me.

 

[jelenko]

Was able to get out yesterday and today.

Using the Protector front pedestal with an Armegeddon X rear bag,
It's all working for what I need. I'm able to differentiate between 1/2 MOA loads and 1 MOA ones.

First big surprise was a load I thought was pretty good is actually 1 MOA+. When I first starting testing it, the first 5 shot group was .27" at 100 yards! Every one after that was 1 MOA+. I kept thinking it had to be me/the setup.

What I found over the past couple days was another load that has consistently grouped 5 shots into .4 MOA to .6 MOA - which gave me confidence in the set up. The first load consistently grouped 1 MOA to 1.2 MOA with the same set up.

Again, thank you everyone!