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Quickload H2O Capacity

Hi everyone,

I've been a long time lurker and I'm hoping the community might be able to help me out.
I purchased quickload to assist with developing loads and now I'm stuck overthinking the water case capacity input. When I input this weight, do I include the case capacity WITH the primer or should I subtract the weight of the primer to get the true weight of the empty brass? Any input would be appreciated!
 
Insert a primer and weigh the case. I like to tare(zero) the scale while the case is on the pan. Remove the case, fill with water and re-weigh. Record this weight. On QL, if you move your cursor over the case volume icon I believe it describes the fill level, concave/convex/level at the top of the case neck. Sorry I don’t remember what it is of the top of my head.

Ryan
 
I weigh a case with primer in it. write that down. then reweigh case filled with water and subtract to get the weight of the water. I normally do 10-20 cases at random and average.
I am sure others will chime in
Hope that helps
 
Hi everyone,

I've been a long time lurker and I'm hoping the community might be able to help me out.
I purchased quickload to assist with developing loads and now I'm stuck overthinking the water case capacity input. When I input this weight, do I include the case capacity WITH the primer or should I subtract the weight of the primer to get the true weight of the empty brass? Any input would be appreciated!

When measuring the H20 in the cases, I have a spent primer in the pocket upside down so that the primer is not holding any H2O. Then before I weight the water I zero my scale with the case and primer so that the reading is only for the H2O weight.

Just an FYI, you'll want to have a piece of paper towel handy so that when you fill the case with H20 and the water tension creates a little hump above the mouth, you can take the edge or corner of the paper towel and carefully wick that hump down so that is flat with the edge of the mouth. That way you get a pretty good measurement.
 
When measuring the H20 in the cases, I have a spent primer in the pocket upside down so that the primer is not holding any H2O. Then before I weight the water I zero my scale with the case and primer so that the reading is only for the H2O weight

Good call, forgot to mention turning the primer upside down.

Ryan
 
Hi everyone,

I've been a long time lurker and I'm hoping the community might be able to help me out.
I purchased quickload to assist with developing loads and now I'm stuck overthinking the water case capacity input. When I input this weight, do I include the case capacity WITH the primer or should I subtract the weight of the primer to get the true weight of the empty brass? Any input would be appreciated!

1. Read the instructions that come with the software.
2. If you weigh the empty case with a primer then you have to weigh the water filled case with the primer in, otherwise you will have too much water weight. (Case + Primer + water) - (Case + Primer) = weight of the water
3. The case should be fired and not yet resized.
 
so in spite ql using a fired, unsized case, I only use sized case volume.
it takes energy to blow that case back out to chamber size and is should be considered in load development.
up 2 u
 
so in spite ql using a fired, unsized case, I only use sized case volume.
it takes energy to blow that case back out to chamber size and is should be considered in load development.
up 2 u

I weigh for both fired and FL sized cases (including have the cases trimmed to my regular length) AND I weigh for fired cases that are neck sized only (+ the bump). In other words, I want us know and use the volumes for the preped cases that I use since sometimes I FL size my cases and most other times I don't.
 
so in spite ql using a fired, unsized case, I only use sized case volume.
it takes energy to blow that case back out to chamber size and is should be considered in load development.
up 2 u
Its really not up 2 u

The internal ballistics experts that wrote this software want to know the size of your chamber. They specifically ask for a fired, unsized case as the closest approximation possible.

You think a sized case is necessary to reflect the energy "consumed" by expanding the case? Could you show the formulas for that? Especially considering you no longer know how far the case will expand.
 
Hi everyone,

I've been a long time lurker and I'm hoping the community might be able to help me out.
I purchased quickload to assist with developing loads and now I'm stuck overthinking the water case capacity input. When I input this weight, do I include the case capacity WITH the primer or should I subtract the weight of the primer to get the true weight of the empty brass? Any input would be appreciated!

The idea is to obtain the water weight equal to the filled internal volume of a case that has been fired and expanded to fit the chamber. That water weight can then be directly converted to volume because for all practical purposes, one milliliter of water = one cubic centimeter of water = one gram water weight. Whether you write down the empty/full case weights and subtract, or use the tare (zero) feature and let the balance do the work for you doesn't really matter, as long as you end up with the exact water weight/volume of the fired case.

The reason QuickLoad software suggests using a case that has been fired but not re-sized is that it best represents the total pressure cell volume for the chemical reaction that takes place when a round is fired. The amount of energy required to expand the case and move the shoulder forward in virgin brass is not zero, but it is not a very large fraction of the total energy, either. In my hands, a load in fire-formed brass typically requires about 0.1 to 0.2 gr less powder to achieve the same velocity as with virgin brass.

We typically move the shoulder of fire-formed brass back only .001" to .002" and squeeze the sides down just enough that the re-sized case can be chambered without difficulty. The elasticity of brass allows it to contract very slightly (i.e. spring-back) so that it can be extracted from the chamber easily. Nonetheless, fire-formed brass is expanded relative to re-sized brass, and its volume is therefore even closer to the true pressure cell volume. It may not be "perfect", but it would take well under 0.1 gr powder in most cases to produce the energy required to expand fully fire-formed brass that tiny little bit more. In other words, the effect of the volume difference between fire-formed brass and fully expanded brass (i.e. in the chamber during firing) on QuickLoad outputs is negligible.

We measure velocity and groups as useful readouts during load development, which are events that occur long after the brass has expanded to perfectly fit the chamber, then contracted. As long as the contracted (i.e. fire-formed) brass is consistent, it is the most accurate representation for the pressure cell volume that we can readily measure. In my hands, the external dimensions of fire-formed cases are extremely uniform and the [average] fire-formed case water volume works very well as an input for QuickLoad. Of course, QuickLoad users are free to use whatever volume input they wish. However, as I described above, there is a very good reason the manufacturers of QuickLoad recommend using the water volume of fire-formed brass, rather than virgin or re-sized brass.
 
quickload is a tool,, learn to use the tool for yourself.
I have
it works well as a tool
it is just a GUIDE
Its really not up 2 u

The internal ballistics experts that wrote this software want to know the size of your chamber. They specifically ask for a fired, unsized case as the closest approximation possible.

You think a sized case is necessary to reflect the energy "consumed" by expanding the case? Could you show the formulas for that? Especially considering you no longer know how far the case will expand.
 
I take a fired case, with the primer still in it, and set it on the Platen of my Dillon electronic scale. I zero the scale with the case on it. Then I add water with a hypodermic syringe, until it is full. Your water weight will be displayed. I found this a better than trying to fill it and put it on the scale. Moving the water filled brass around allows spillage.
 

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