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PT&G "Extreme" 700 Blueprint Package Work Quality?

Matt in Virginia

Gentlemen,
I am curious what your experience has been on ordering PT&G's Remington 700 "Extreme" Blueprint ed Receivers with their 1 piece bolt? I am referring to what was received as far as square, straight, true. Were the threads single point cut or was a tap used, etc? In short where does there work fall on the quality scale?

If I had the time I would send the actions to Greg Tannel, however, I dunno as I have a year to wait...

Regards, Matt.
 
Use Chad Dixon of Long Rifles. He has CNC equipment dedicated to truing R700 actions, does flawless work, and turns it around in weeks or less. Your other option is to buy trued R700 actions from Northwest Action Works, http://www.nwactionworks.com/action-truing The samples I've seen have been good. Or you can go to Alex Wheeler and have him time the bolt in addition to truing the action.

Or you could just buy a custom like the Stiller because the time and effort put into truing an action, bushing the firing pin, timing the bolt....well heck, you've already paid for the custom.

I like the new R700s out of the box. They are made with CNC machinery and really don't need to be trued. The firing pin does need to be bushed, but Tannel can do that very quickly at a reasonable price...because he has a CNC dedicated to that.
 
Hi Scott,
Familiar with the other options... I've heard of the new 700s being gtg out of the box. Where are you buying yours? Midwest Gun Works?

Regards, Matt.
 
The PTG package I got from them was NOT blueprinted... The action tenon was not opened up and new threads were not cut. Maybe they ran a tap through the factory threads but that only cleans up poss warped threads; doesn't ensure the threads are concentric... The bolt was a 2 piece bolt and the weld looked like poop! I rewelded and timed the handle. The "tured" bolts were only off by .002" - I had three others measure with 5 indicators and all showed both lugs off by .002". Guess that's why the package deals are so cheap! I ended up blueprinting the PTG package action/bolts and will never buy thier package action/bolts.

That said - I have have had great success with the PTG one piece bolts when you custom order them. I think PTG is sleeze bagging out on the "package" blueprinted Rem 700 - but maybe I was the lucky winner who got the (4) Mon or Fri cut action/bolts.

If your shopping for a "blueprinted" action and bolt - ask the smith EXACTLY what thier process to blueprint is. To some lapping the lugs and squaring the face is blueprinting. That is FAR from what most would consider blueprinting!
 
perhaps you would explain the statement "both lugs were off by .002
off in relation to what??
also if the smith determines that the threads are concentric and in the same plane as the bolt raceway, you would want him to make the threads nonstandard by machining them oversize
making them not to "blueprint" dimension
 
Fwiw...if the new remingtons are gtg, it's due in part to PTG. Kiff recently contracted with them to correct the poor quality issues of the past. I've never had a quality problem with PTG but no one is perfect.
 
Most of the time...re cutting of receiver threads is an overrated operation. The barrel squares up on the action face and only the first few threads load. The threads have to be way way out before they cause accuracy issues, IME. An oversize action isn't a huge deal but it is a significant inconvenience if you'd like to buy a takeoff...and the smith absolutely should be informed that he's fitting a barrel to an action that has been opened up. Many will assume standard size.
 
The difference of the .002" was from the actions face to the front of the bolt lug... the measurement from the face to the left was say 715 and the measurement to the front got the right lug was like 717. The bolt or the face of the action was NOT true... after correctly blueprint the right and left lug should have the same measurements.

Considering all metal warps during heat treat any unblueptinted action by definition is not true. Isn't that why Stiller does a "final" cut AFTER heat tresting? Isn't that why Defiance; Surgeon and Bat heat treat then cut.

If I was having a custom built rifle - yes I would pay the 150-200 more to ensure EVERYTHING is squared and trued - again ask exactly what the smith is doing during the blueprinting process...

As I stated I have not had a problem with any PTG reamers or bolts I have custom ordered. I just got the lucky unblueptinted 4 actions they had I guess...
 
BarrelBrothers said:
The difference of the .002" was from the actions face to the front of the bolt lug... the measurement from the face to the left was say 715 and the measurement to the front got the right lug was like 717. The bolt or the face of the action was NOT true... after correctly blueprint the right and left lug should have the same measurements.

Considering all metal warps during heat treat any unblueptinted action by definition is not true. Isn't that why Stiller does a "final" cut AFTER heat tresting? Isn't that why Defiance; Surgeon and Bat heat treat then cut.

If I was having a custom built rifle - yes I would pay the 150-200 more to ensure EVERYTHING is squared and trued - again ask exactly what the smith is doing during the blueprinting process...

As I stated I have not had a problem with any PTG reamers or bolts I have custom ordered. I just got the lucky unblueptinted 4 actions they had I guess...
Click to expand...
Did you discuss it with PTG?
 
gunsandgunsmithing said:
Most of the time...re cutting of receiver threads is an overrated operation. The barrel squares up on the action face and only the first few threads load. The threads have to be way way out before they cause accuracy issues, IME. An oversize action isn't a huge deal but it is a significant inconvenience if you'd like to buy a takeoff...and the smith absolutely should be informed that he's fitting a barrel to an action that has been opened up. Many will assume standard size.
Click to expand...
A smith should always measure and not assume anything... it's the old measure 3 times and cut twice.

To blueprint or not to blueprint is a topic that will be discussed for many, many years... it really boils down to shooter expectations. But for piece of mind and a few bucks more I will take the blueprint action... most custom builds will be using a fresh barrel blank - so the oversized threads are a mood point.
 
BarrelBrothers said:
A smith should always measure and not assume anything... it's the old measure 3 times and cut twice.

To blueprint or not to blueprint is a topic that will be discussed for many, many years... it really boils down to shooter expectations. But for piece of mind and a few bucks more I will take the blueprint action... most custom builds will be using a fresh barrel blank - so the oversized threads are a mood point.
Click to expand...
...and if cost were not an issue, most will use a custom action. Most every time, re cutting the action threads does nothing more than make them shiny, and the smith more money. What proof do you have that a new model 700 action shot better because the threads were re cut?
 
gunsandgunsmithing said:
Did you discuss it with PTG?
Click to expand...
I did - they girls were not much help and considering I NEEDED the actions and bolts yesterday kind of thing - I just did the corrections myself... They did mention that I had bought from the clearance bin - so I was pretty SOL... it happens!

As I said - I usually have great success with the tooling and bolts from PTG but Dave is just buying Rem standard actions and using two piece bolts and calling them blueprinted. Not mad at them - but I wish there was an industry standardized term for "blueprinting". As you know not all smith do the same things to blueprint.
 
Gentlemen,
The word on the new 700s were GTG and the Single Shot 700s were two completely different topics/points/opinions/takes on the matter. If I failed to make that clear I apologize...

I'm listening as opposed to commenting here. Hoping to read enough "sign" by the conversation to make an educated guess. It has been made fair or unfair..

I just sold a BAT VR to a forum member this afternoon and will be replacing it with a Borden SSR...

Much appreciate everyone's input...

Regards, Matt.
 
mrjdasr said:
what function does the "front of the bolt lugs" play in the operation of firing a round
Click to expand...
It's containment of pressure in the event of a severe over pressure load. The Remington 3 rings of steel is just that...a containment system that is dependent upon proper clearances to meter and or contain as designed. Edit...I was speaking of the bolt nose specifically but that dimension is dependent on the front of the lugs.
 
The problem with blueprinting work is that if you have to pay someone to do it, you generally will not have the tools required to fully check the work out. If I had a lathe, and I wanted to really check out how straight the front and threads of an action were, I would cut a very close fitting tenon and shoulder on a piece of stock, and while it was still in the chuck, after greasing the threads, screw the action onto the tenon. I would notice how evenly the face of the action made contact with the shoulder, and I would insert a tight fitting mandrel into the rear of the receiver to the point where it contracted the front of the false tenon. Then I would turn the lathe over by hand and check the runout of the mandrel immediately behind the tang of the action. A friend's older short 700 action threads had to be opened up .025 to get them to clean up on axis with the raceway. When the action was turned onto the false tenon to the point where its face first touched the shoulder, there was still a considerable gap on the opposite side. My friend had spent quite a bit of time and money on the rifle before a friend checked it for him, and then trued it up. There was a noticeable increase in accuracy. Of course he had to chop off the old tenon rechamber the barrel.
 
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