Problems bumping shoulders

[dragman]

Thanks everyone I got it to bumb back just had to really get my press to cam over on the die. Luckily this is the only die set that I have that I have to do this on. Might have to take a few thou off the die for next time. Thanks everyone!

When it's that close I always trim the die a little to be able to set them where I want.

 

[Liven The Dream]

I have had this happen with my 6.5x55 in a Match Chamber .
I have to move the shoulder . I have a RCBS Match FL Die, it will not do the job consistently .
I have a Redding FL Bushing Die , and Bang , done with no trouble.
Not all things are equal ???

 

[fguffey]

Its not uncommon for someone to have trouble bumping if the chamber has Been set up with a tight go gauge . Larry

tight go gauge

Or a short chamber? And then there is that part about bumping the shoulder; 'how do you do it?', I can't. I have bump presses and I have presses that do not bump. My bump presses are called 'cam over presses'. My presses that do not cam over are non cam over presses. And then there are threads on my dies and presses. When the case has more resistance to sizing than my press can overcome I have to increase the presses ability to overcome resistance to sizing. I know, most reloaders get a larger press; before lowering the ram I determine if the case won or the press won meaning it is not necessary to stick the case into the chamber to determine if the bolt is going to close.

F. Guffey

 

[fguffey]

When it's that close I always trim the die a little to be able to set them where I want.

If I was going to trim? the die I would first determine 'by how much'.

F. Guffey

 

[John Russell]

When it's that close I always trim the die a little to be able to set them where I want.

It is easier (and cheaper, and safer) to lap a few thou from a shell holder using a sheet of oiled #600 silicone carbide paper on a flat surface. Takes 5 or 10 minutes.

 

[Terry O]

There is a secondary advantage to removing material from the die rather than the shell holder. Most FL dies have an over generous radius to aid in guiding the case into the die. But the down side to that is more of the case head is not being sized. Removing material from the die base will allow more of the case head to be resized.

 

[BenPerfected]

Ben,

Which two fingers?

Now that I think about it, it is my thumb and two fingers.

 

[John Russell]

There is a secondary advantage to removing material from the die rather than the shell holder. Most FL dies have an over generous radius to aid in guiding the case into the die. But the down side to that is more of the case head is not being sized. Removing material from the die base will allow more of the case head to be resized.

Just how much are you going to remove - 3 to 5 thou will not affect the sizing of the case head.... remove enough to affect sizing of the case head, and you have very serious headspace problems.

And no matter whether you remove the metal from the die, or the shell holder, the case goes in the die the same amount that you removed, so it makes no difference to sizing the case head.

 

[Cool Tool]

You should never have to touch the die if any thing take a few thousands off shell holder achieve shoulder bump that's why I like bushing dies you can control neck tension an shoulder bump

 

[dedogs]

remove enough to affect sizing of the case head, and you have very serious headspace problems.

And then you will be living in fguffey's world.

 

[John Russell]

And then you will be living in fguffey's world.

FGuffey has no headspace - he said so

 

[M-61]

FGuffey has no headspace - he said so

KILLER FIRING PINS

 

[John Russell]

KILLER FIRING PINS

That will do it every time - I wish I had KILLER firing pins

 

[fguffey]

Hornady Unique Case Lube

This case lube might help solve your sizing issues. Previously a friend suggested I switch from the Hornady 1-Shot lube to the Hornady Unique Case Lub. It comes in a tub and just apply it with two fingers. For me, it was is a quanitmun leap forward in smoothly resizing my brass.
Ben

And for years I have said I use a lube with no name.

F. Guffey

 

[M-61]

And for years I have said I use a lube with no name.

F. Guffey

That answers the question with crystal clarity. Between the killer firing pins, no head-space, and tension gauges, and now a name-less lube, there should no other reason to read any further posts.

 

[fguffey]

There is a secondary advantage to removing material from the die rather than the shell holder. Most FL dies have an over generous radius to aid in guiding the case into the die. But the down side to that is more of the case head is not being sized. Removing material from the die base will allow more of the case head to be resized.

True but there is the deck height of the shell holder. The deck height of my shell holders is .125". And then there is case head protrusion from the chamber and then there is unsupported case head. Rather than grind the top of the shell holder and or bottom of the die I use feeler gages. The feeler gage allows me to raise the case off of the deck of the she holder; raising the shell holder off of the deck of the shell holder increases the ability of the press to overcome the cases ability to resist sizing; and it increases the press and dies ability to shorten the case from the shoulder of the case to the case head.

F. Guffey

 

[dmoran]

True but there is the deck height of the shell holder. The deck height of my shell holders is .125". And then there is case head protrusion from the chamber and then there is unsupported case head. Rather than grind the top of the shell holder and or bottom of the die I use feeler gages. The feeler gage allows me to raise the case off of the deck of the she holder; raising the shell holder off of the deck of the shell holder increases the ability of the press to overcome the cases ability to resist sizing; and it increases the press and dies ability to shorten the case from the shoulder of the case to the case head.

F. Guffey

I have tried your "feeler gauge" method to rise a case off the shell-holder deck height, and while it does work I found there to be several displeasing limitations:
- found it to be very limited in the amount of feeler gauge thickness that can fit under the cases
- found feeler gauges to be cumbersome to keep in place and/or to re-insert
- found out that feeler gauges can get bent/crushed/damaged very easily from the repeated operation
- found that some feeler gauges are a poor fit under the case all together, that can induce run-out
For me, I find a surface ground shell holder has far less limitations and are far less cumbersome to use, that can get more case into the die then can by feeler gauge.

My 2-Cents
Donovan

 

[dkhunt14]

It could also be the shell holder itself. I have measured shell holders from the same company and have seen as much as .005 or more on deck height measurement. I like to take a little off them if I have to and keep it with that die. Matt

 

[fguffey]

It could also upstairs be the shell holder itself. I have measured shell holders from the same company and have seen as much as .005 or more on deck height measurement. I like to take a little off them if I have to and keep it with that die. Matt

I had the opportunity to exchange all of my shell holder from one manufacturer for new shell holders. I though that was a generous offer but I explained to them if I wanted a shell holders with extra deck height I had to pay more for them and no one makes shell holders for short chambers. I have shell holders with short deck heights, all of them were made before 1960. When I measure the deck height of a shell holder I expect the deck height to be .125". I have heard reloaders claim shell holders and dies had to be matched to brand names; and I have always said, "FANTASTIC!".

Again: I purchases a #6 set of Redding competition shell holders, three of them were off by .001" each. Not a problem for me me, adjusting the die to, off/above or below contact with the shell holder is something I was doing before the Competition shell holder was made.

F. Guffey