"....picked up by me."
Don't know how that figures into any question at all. If they were fired by you in your rifle now it matters.
So I guess the answer to South Prairie jim's question "Range Brass?" is YES
Primers not seating flush
- Thread starter Lefty Trigger
- Start date
"....picked up by me."
Don't know how that figures into any question at all. If they were fired by you in your rifle now it matters.
So I guess the answer to South Prairie jim's question "Range Brass?" is YES
Because Jepp2 and a few others figured it out, pockets needed uniforming. I went out and bought a set of uniforming tools made by Lyman, pushed out all the new primers and started working on them. Really amazed at how much some of them needed cut out. Seemed to be cutting the corners the most kinda like they have rounded corners instead of square edge. After I got them all cut I put the primers back in and checked every one, right to the exact size needed so that was clearly the problem. I also made sure to check the "stop" bolt on my APS press. Thanks for all the help and suggestions to get me squared away.
Yes it was range brass, what I mean by "picked up by me" is I watched the guy open the new boxes, load his mags, fire it all off like a nut and I picked it all up after he left. If I didn't know it was new ammo to start with I would not save it for reloads. Since I bought the uniforming tools I have been checking ALL my brass both large and small primers and I'm surprised that everything I have has some that need cutting. So far the Remington (both 223 and 308) have been the best. I do not own any expensive brass yet, mostly all Federal, Winchester, Remington.
I usually just use a primer pocket uniformer to get my primer pockets to the correct depth each time I load, but on the other hand, I have friends, namely one in particular, that won't run a primer pocket unifomer into any of his brass under any circumstances, based on the thought process that there's "no blanking way" that he is going to get that anal about such nit picky details about his brass (one primer pocket depth being similar to all of the rest). I suspect that he's just smashing all of the primers to just under flush. Maybe I'm the fool here, I don't know.
Danny
That was my thinking too till I ran across this problem. I have the tools now and will make it a regular part of prepping the brass from now on.
You will find crimped .223 primers in AR15 forums and people asking why the new primers don't fit in the primer pockets.
Meaning they also didn't know that .223 cases can have crimped primers.
The next question they ask is why their Federal cases have over sized primer pockets after a few reloads.
(soft brass and thin flash hole webs)
Federal “American Eagle” AE223 55gr .223 Remington with crimped primer
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not long ago, in response to my question of fed ae vs lc brass quality, riflewoman and others pointed out this headstamp/crimp indicates that the brass is actually made on a scamp machine at lake city. the machine code is the pattern of dots on the headstamp.
i haven't sectioned one, but would suspect the web 'should' be in this the same as lc. if i have enough coffee this morning, i might check that.
EDIT:
ooops... i meant fed xm vs lc
XM brass is not mil-spec brass.
dellet
Gold $$ Contributor
If you spend the time to uniform the primer pockets, it’s worth a bit extra to also do the flash hole. I did not see that mentioned before and I don’t think the Lyman kit has anything to do that.
Most flash holes are punched and often leave a piece that obstructs the flame path or directs it to the side of the powder column instead of up the middle.
This is a K&M brand, there are plenty of others and styles.
Most flash holes are punched and often leave a piece that obstructs the flame path or directs it to the side of the powder column instead of up the middle.
This is a K&M brand, there are plenty of others and styles.
I know that there's some .223 brass that's crimped , I said I have never seen Remington .223 brass with crimped in primers... Remington being the key.... Thanks for your nice post though...You will find crimped .223 primers in AR15 forums and people asking why the new primers don't fit in the primer pockets.
Meaning they also didn't know that .223 cases can have crimped primers.
The next question they ask is why their Federal cases have over sized primer pockets after a few reloads.
(soft brass and thin flash hole webs)
Federal “American Eagle” AE223 55gr .223 Remington with crimped primer
I've been harvesting the AE223GTV (varmint tipped) brass for years, shot from my chamber. I've sectioned it after reading posts similar to the one Uncle ED posted, and found it had the THICKER web. I also uniform the pockets, and discard off center flash holes, some were horrible in past batches of AE223, half a hole off center. Then de-burr the inside of the flash hole.
Contrary to popular beliefs about FC brass, the 223 brass is very hard, and stands up to repeated loadings. I have FC brass (4 dot) that have well over a dozen loadings and pockets are still tight.
FWIW: I shoot this out of a bolt gun, so I don't FL size. I neck size only and rarely have to trim. I also SS pin tumble and anneal it too, and it's capable of shooting groups below 1/4 inch. In fact I have saved paper targets with three and five shot groups measuring in the zeros with off the shelf AE223GTV ammo, not hand loads.
Interestingly, it is exactly the same weight and has exactly the same H2O capacity of my Winchester brass, new out of the package, not reclaimed. I suspect both are made at the LC plant.
Contrary to popular beliefs about FC brass, the 223 brass is very hard, and stands up to repeated loadings. I have FC brass (4 dot) that have well over a dozen loadings and pockets are still tight.
FWIW: I shoot this out of a bolt gun, so I don't FL size. I neck size only and rarely have to trim. I also SS pin tumble and anneal it too, and it's capable of shooting groups below 1/4 inch. In fact I have saved paper targets with three and five shot groups measuring in the zeros with off the shelf AE223GTV ammo, not hand loads.
Interestingly, it is exactly the same weight and has exactly the same H2O capacity of my Winchester brass, new out of the package, not reclaimed. I suspect both are made at the LC plant.
You do not need to section the .223/5.56 cases, just make a 2 inch rod and drill out the bottom to be cup shaped. This allows the inside end to fit over the flash hole and any burs and measure web thickness.
All the dimples on the base mean is which machine the cases were made on. I have read these type cases failed Lake City quality checks and Federal uses them for .223 ammo. The 2 inch rod will let you know how thick the flash hole web is. The thinner cases are not worth doing any case prep on because the primer pockets stretch out of shape after very few reloads.
I now buy bulk once fired Lake City 5.56 cases from military ranges that are mil-spec.
https://www.brassbombers.com/
The photos below came from ar15.com and the moderator dryflash3. There are many postings of his on checking methods and separating cases worth reloading. Unfortunately I prepped hundreds of Federal .223 cases before finding this information.
NOTE, I recommend uniforming the primer pockets on any Lake City cases. The LC primer pockets are not as deep as other brands of some commercial cases.
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CaptainMal
Silver $$ Contributor
As stated, get a K&M primer pocket uniforming tool - small.
End of the issue.
End of the issue.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^Yes
clever....
The moderator dryflash3 at ar15.com in the reloading sectionknows all the tricks to loading a AR15 and the 2 inch rod is his idea.
Another tool he uses is a Lee depriming tool to check for loose primer pockets if the primer goes in too easy.
Below if the primer moves with just finger pressure the case goes in the scrap brass bucket. This check is for over gassed AR15 rifles that can pop a loose primer out and it ends up in the trigger group and jam it up. Meaning some people would not be this picky with a bolt action.
Below my hand and Lee tool but dryflash3 idea, But I'm almost as smart, good looking and modest as dryflash.
Brians356
Silver $$ Contributor
I looked several times, could not see any crimps. I figured maybe three or four narrow stab crimps. Then I notice what looks like a 360-deg crimp. Really? Are my eyes deceiving me? Never seen a circumferential crimp I guess.
-
Some of the federal .223 marked brass is not as hard and has thinner flash hole webs.
The photo below also came from ar15.com. And is not "Contrary to popular beliefs".
And my 2 inch rod doesn't lie to me, nor do the photos I posted.
Again it is believed the cases at LC that do not pass quality check are used by Federal in their American Eagle ammo.
Below Lake City 2 inch rod measurement .185, and Federal at .163
ATK runs Lake City now and they own Federal and CCI and Lake City is using CCI #41 and #34 primers. And Winchester primers and powders are owned by General Dynamics weapons division and not by ATK.
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Time to break out your pin gauges and check the circular crimps. brians356 its time for you to join the cheap bastards club and buy some bulk once fired Lake City cases. They are a fraction of the cost of Lapua brass and if you loose a few at the range you won't cry. You just look on the ground and in the brass buckets for once fired LC cases with crimped primers.
Lake City cases are very high quality and have very uniform neck thicknesses. They also have harder brass than Lapua and with a little time and prep work you will have some very good cases.
And earn your cheap bastards merit badge.
Below a photo from our Accurate Shooter Daily Bulletin and the brand new cases do not have a circular crimp.
Circular LC crimp and no crimp on a Remington case.
And the ammunition loaded at Lake City can have a circular crimp or 4 stab crimps.
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