primer cratering and boltface pitted

[Eric Leonard]

I am no gunsmith but it looks to me that someone has already attempted to bush the boltface and did a poor job,,there is a recess around the firing pin hole that matches the primer,,
I would send that bolt to Gre-Tan rifles and get the bolt bushed and the pin turned to start with,,then I would back down to about 73 grs and work up a load that the short loaded VLDs could stand without blowing the rifle up

 

[Comrade Terry]

In the first picture, the case on the left looks like it has an ejector mark.

 

[Webster]

Brass is virgin, used steel wool on a bronze brush in a drill to clean necks before loading. No water in primer pockets at all.

If you don't recognize the obvious signs of high pressure you should not be reloading ammo.

 

[hogpatrol]

Scratch/score/scrape mark on the FRONT of the lug???? Wear mark or peened over bolt in the second and fourth photos?? Didn't those primers back out? Something fishy going on here and I don't believe we're getting the entire story. What action, barrel, smith, any work done at all to the rifle, etc.?? Looking more to me like a classic rookie SNAFU, i.e. misunderstanding reloading manuals loads with regards to bullet weight and a questionable rifle.

 

[powderbrake]

I had the same problems on a 22-250, cracks/pinholes at the corner radius of the primers. Sent this and other pics to Winchester, and they replaced my primed brass, all my primers and paid to have Gre Tan bush and fix the bolt. I suggest you do the same with your primer manufacturer.

 

[hogpatrol]

Having used tens of thousands of primers in multiple calibers for over 50 years, I'm not buying these primer issues. Hard loads and big primer pockets? Yes. Improperly seated primers? Yes, As far as them paying for damage, that's a WHOLE LOT cheaper than getting the legal department involved and the customer just goes away happy. YMMV

 

[JLT]

I am no gunsmith but it looks to me that someone has already attempted to bush the boltface and did a poor job,,there is a recess around the firing pin hole that matches the primer,,
I would send that bolt to Gre-Tan rifles and get the bolt bushed and the pin turned to start with,,then I would back down to about 73 grs and work up a load that the short loaded VLDs could stand without blowing the rifle up

I agree with this. The rings on the fired primers are from the sub-optimal bushing job.

 

[Joe Salt]

Looks to me like you have been firing hot loads for a while from the looks of that bolt face! When you work up a load always start at the lowest load and work up load at a 1/2 grain at a time and pay attention to the primer. If it starts to crater back of a full grain. And when you put primers back in the cases, if they go in easy, through them out. That may be another reason for the leakage.

Joe Salt

 

[TackDriv3r]

Scratch/score/scrape mark on the FRONT of the lug???? Wear mark or peened over bolt in the second and fourth photos?? Didn't those primers back out? Something fishy going on here and I don't believe we're getting the entire story. What action, barrel, smith, any work done at all to the rifle, etc.?? Looking more to me like a classic rookie SNAFU, i.e. misunderstanding reloading manuals loads with regards to bullet weight and a questionable rifle.

Huh, not so fast there ole guy. What story do you want? I have been reloading for 25 years, I always work up my loads, never had this happen to me and that will happen to anyone, bad primer or bad case could be the culprit too. I work up my loads to find the maximum pressure that the rifle can handle and I had no pressure signs, no heavy bolt or swipes on the case head. Calling me a rookie and say I misunderstand this type of stuff is overboard. I have been shooting one hole groups out of almost all my rifles with Bergers, ELD, Ballistic Tips, etc. and I know reloading and you can take a look at those brass I fired out of this new build and none shows high pressure or flattened primers. A primer can be defective and leak, or a bad brass and maybe if you spend more time and do some research on the internet, look at some pictures and maybe you can get an idea. This leaky primer does not mean I screwed up, it could be defective. I'll repeat, all the loads / cases were fine, no ejector marks, or flat primers, or leaking primers, or heavy bolt lift. The damage to the bolt face was done by the leaky primer or it could have had a pressure spike. The other two rounds I fired fired just fine and used the same powder charge as the one I took a picture of. Look at the brass I fired recently and maybe you will say I screwed up too. LMAO

 

[TackDriv3r]

Looks to me like you have been firing hot loads for a while from the looks of that bolt face! When you work up a load always start at the lowest load and work up load at a 1/2 grain at a time and pay attention to the primer. If it starts to crater back of a full grain. And when you put primers back in the cases, if they go in easy, through them out. That may be another reason for the leakage.

Joe Salt

I always work up and I worked up in .4 increments on the big magnums. Depends on the size of the case, if you using a 6 BR, work up in .2 grains. This is a new barrel job that I was shooting. I have not been shooting more than 52 rounds.

 

[TackDriv3r]

If you don't recognize the obvious signs of high pressure you should not be reloading ammo.

Check the brass yourself.

 

[LHSmith]

Looking at the bolt face, there appears to be an outward burr right where the primer edge contacts. Now look at the case on the right in the first pic- @ 7:00 on the outer edge of the primer there is an indent. IMO that bolt saw a lot of abuse- I doubt all that damage was from one round. BTW the bolt should be stripped and cleaned and wouldn't hurt to flush out the trigger.

 

[TackDriv3r]

That is a primer fault, it has a pinhole in the radius edge.
The primer has still got rounded edges. It is NOT caused by excessive pressures in 99% of the time.
This has been an issue with Federal and Winchester primers in the past few years.

Contact the primer manufacturer by email with the lot# and photos of the cases and bolt face, they will repair the damage under warranty. If you are within the listed data in the manual, they will honour the repair.

Cheers.

It's what I figured, the primers aren't even flattened yet, its still rounded on the edges. I get called a rookie by these haters and say its by my own hand that caused this issue, I guess they cannot tell the difference between a rounded edge primer and a flattened primer. I worked up low last week, started low last week from 73 grains up to 75 ish, and continued from 75 to 77 this week until this,,,,

 

[TackDriv3r]

Looking at the bolt face, there appears to be an outward burr right where the primer edge contacts. Now look at the case on the right in the first pic- @ 7:00 on the outer edge of the primer there is an indent. IMO that bolt saw a lot of abuse- I doubt all that damage was from one round. BTW the bolt should be stripped and cleaned and wouldn't hurt to flush out the trigger.

Yes, I see those little rings on the fired primers. I bought the rifle recently and sent it off for a new barrel job, no idea how the first owner used it. I just like to buy Rem 700 rifles and send them off to be rebarreled and bedded jobs.

 

[243winxb]

Was all the brass in the photo loaded with the Berger bullet and 76.8 grains of H1000?

 

[dkhunt14]

Huh, not so fast there ole guy. What story do you want? I have been reloading for 25 years, I always work up my loads, never had this happen to me and that will happen to anyone, bad primer or bad case could be the culprit too. I work up my loads to find the maximum pressure that the rifle can handle and I had no pressure signs, no heavy bolt or swipes on the case head. Calling me a rookie and say I misunderstand this type of stuff is overboard. I have been shooting one hole groups out of almost all my rifles with Bergers, ELD, Ballistic Tips, etc. and I know reloading and you can take a look at those brass I fired out of this new build and none shows high pressure or flattened primers. A primer can be defective and leak, or a bad brass and maybe if you spend more time and do some research on the internet, look at some pictures and maybe you can get an idea. This leaky primer does not mean I screwed up, it could be defective. I'll repeat, all the loads / cases were fine, no ejector marks, or flat primers, or leaking primers, or heavy bolt lift. The damage to the bolt face was done by the leaky primer or it could have had a pressure spike. The other two rounds I fired fired just fine and used the same powder charge as the one I took a picture of. Look at the brass I fired recently and maybe you will say I screwed up too. LMAO

You used a Berger bullet with a Nosler manual. My Nosler manual doesn't list that powder for a 300 WIN. That isn't starting low and working up. Starting low is usually 10 percent. That corrulates to 6 grains. Your Berger load is almost 1.5 grains over max. Then if you didn't load to Bergers overall length you are shoving a long bullet into the case and using up capacity. The Berger VLD Is a very long bullet with a lot of bearing surface.

And yes it could be a bad primer but that bolt is really beat up and not by just a shot or two. Matt

 

[LHSmith]

Yes, I see those little rings on the fired primers. I bought the rifle recently and sent it off for a new barrel job, no idea how the first owner used it. I just like to buy Rem 700 rifles and send them off to be rebarreled and bedded jobs.

Not talking about those rings, there is a definite notch on the edge of the primer. Same place as the blown primer. IMO the bolt face has an external burr that caused the problem. If it were mine I'd get a new bolt.

 

[Ggmac]

One hole groups ! I'm impressed . Next time take a better look at the old REMINGTONs your buying , something is definately a miss with that bolt ! I'm not saying it was your problem but that bolt does have some I'll attempt at bushing it . Now , I'm only going off those pics , so don't blaze me . Just looking out for another old timers safety .
Please tell me , did you chamfer the primer pocket ? If not it's got a generous bevel going on .
I don't think the flame cutting will have any ill effects , but I would wash the bolt completely , this means a disassemble. Check for the bushing protruding on the interior . I would think that who ever bushed it originally had the bushing and bolt face on the same plane . Since it's no longer that way it may be pushed inside , which could be an accident waiting to happen .
Good luck and keep buying those remingtons and sending off for new barrels .

 

[LCazador]

Brass is virgin, used steel wool on a bronze brush in a drill to clean necks before loading. No water in primer pockets at all.

There's your problem. Foreign material in the case left by the steel wool bronze brush. This can create high pressure. Your other case shows sign of high pressure as well. Monitor your pressure by measuring the new brass head diameter with a micrometer and then comparing that to your fired cases. You should not have expansion of more than .0008", eight ten thousands.

 

[Ggmac]

Oh , forgot . In my opinion , I WOULD NOT WANT TO BE SHOOTING THOSE LOADS , NO MATTER HOW LONG YOUVE BEEN RELOADING !
I'm not crazy , I'm conservative!