Pre-64 M70 Questions

[chomondely3]

I have a Pre-64 M70 (30-06) manufactured around 1947 with a heavy barrel, (unknown maker) of dubious quality. I am still getting copper out so I do not know if it still shoots. The action is set up for iron sights with 3/8 dovetail blocks on the action and barrel for a Unertyl scope. The action is bedded in a heavy wood stock really set up for 600/1000 yd prone target shooting in the early 1960’s. The glass bedding is cracking.

Assuming that the barrel is bad, I am looking at a Krieger barrel, perhaps a Remington Varmint contour. I am thinking about a making a hunting rifle to shoot out of a blind, up to 400 yds, Texas whitetails. I have a light weight rifle for walking around so a little weight is fine for this build .



Questions:

Options for a stock?

Many of the stock manufactures note that their stocks fit only post- 64 M70 actions. I would like to continue using the 1-piece floor plate.

What is the difference? One site suggested that that the factory barrel has a band about 5 inches from the breech. If I am using an aftermarket barrel, does pre-post 64 make a difference?



Cartridge recommendations for a M70 Long Action to be used for hunting/target shooting out to 600 yds?

I hand load so wildcats are OK. Accuracy is very important to me although I wonder if a deer cares if the bullet placement is 1 inch off. I am interested in decent barrel life, a bit longer than my 6.5x284. I am thinking of a 280AI.



Thanks in advance for your thoughts.

 

[expiper]

yes ,,some M-70's had a "swell" in the bbl. where the rear sight was located,,,if yours is a target wt. bbl. it will not have one,,,you will need to be shure the stock mfg. knows your bbl is custom and does not have this feature,,,,the 280/280 AI are great choices ,,,,Roger

 

[jds holler]

If the stock is an after-market that you don't care for, I'd probably modify it to fit my use. (If inletting/bedding is decent)
If it happens to be a Winchester variation offered back in the day, for God sake take care of it for resale to someone who might treasure it.

My cartridge choice would prolly be 6mm Rem AI. jd

 

[msinc]

I would like to continue using the 1-piece floor plate.

As opposed to what??? Not sure what you mean here....I have never seen a pre-64 70 that didn't have a separate trigger guard and floor plate with three action screws.
The rear sight swell is a non issue {other than in the looks dept.} if the stock has it and the barrel don't you can leave it or fill it in with glass bedding. It is pretty small to the point that if you do decide to go with a sporter barrel no one would likely ever notice it if filled with a close color dyed bedding compound.
Are you sure your present barrel doesn't just need a good cleaning to get ALL the copper out??? This can make a big, unbelievable difference. It is pretty tough or at least you really got to work at it to shoot the throat out of a 30-06. Big question here is "was it ever accurate enough for you to start with????"
As far as using Winchester post 64 Model 70 LA stocks on a pre-64 action and barrel, that is doable to. I have done it many times and there is very little relief fitting that needs to be done. Notice I said "Winchester post 64 LA"...not New Haven short actions, FN or the various later model copies.
Caliber wise, the 280AI is definitely one of my favorites. 30-06AI would be another to consider, especially since you already have some brass. You cannot go wrong with any modern name brand custom barrels. For the money, I think you will find a Douglas barrel very hard to beat. I have never been disappointed with one. If you feel like you need to spend more money, FWIW I just recently put together a Remington with a Muller Works barrel and it shoots literally in the same hole.
One thing I have always heard and read regarding the pre-64 70...they say you are not supposed to tighten the center action screw. That is the one in front of the trigger guard. This is said to be an accuracy issue and that the rifle will shoot better if you leave this screw loose or at least looser than the other two. I have tried it both ways and either I cant shoot or it really don't matter. Maybe a better way of saying it is "I couldn't get it to matter for me". Best of luck.

 

[savagedasher]

If it is original
I would sell the copper mine and probably would pay for a new gun
Many of the original guns bring big money

 

[riflewoman]

I have a Pre-64 M70 (30-06) manufactured around 1947 with a heavy barrel, (unknown maker) of dubious quality. I am still getting copper out so I do not know if it still shoots. The action is set up for iron sights with 3/8 dovetail blocks on the action and barrel for a Unertyl scope. The action is bedded in a heavy wood stock really set up for 600/1000 yd prone target shooting in the early 1960’s. The glass bedding is cracking.

Assuming that the barrel is bad, I am looking at a Krieger barrel, perhaps a Remington Varmint contour. I am thinking about a making a hunting rifle to shoot out of a blind, up to 400 yds, Texas whitetails. I have a light weight rifle for walking around so a little weight is fine for this build .



Questions:

Options for a stock?

Many of the stock manufactures note that their stocks fit only post- 64 M70 actions. I would like to continue using the 1-piece floor plate.

What is the difference? One site suggested that that the factory barrel has a band about 5 inches from the breech. If I am using an aftermarket barrel, does pre-post 64 make a difference?



Cartridge recommendations for a M70 Long Action to be used for hunting/target shooting out to 600 yds?

I hand load so wildcats are OK. Accuracy is very important to me although I wonder if a deer cares if the bullet placement is 1 inch off. I am interested in decent barrel life, a bit longer than my 6.5x284. I am thinking of a 280AI.



Thanks in advance for your thoughts.

First, I would use a standard Light Varmint contour rathe than the Remington. Reason...tradition mostly.

It will be more work for the smith, but just get a custom inletted stock without the guard screws drilled or bottom metal inletted. The difference is in action screw center to center, the rear tang and the bottom metal. It is more than the barrel tension screw.

For cartridge I would reccomend 270, 280, or 30-06. Improved or standard.

 

[chomondely3]

Thanks for the thoughts and suggestions. It does in fact have a separate trigger guard. Still more copper to get out. I'm not sure how accurate the barrel was in the first place. The crown looks good. My smith has the rifle now. The safety would not engage and I am reluctant to chamber a live round with out knowing if the safety is functioning properly. I suspect that accuracy is degraded if the weapon fires while closing the bolt. I plan on keeping the action at a minimum, my father shot this rifle across the course in the late 60's.

 

[effendude]

If you have any safety concerns regarding the rifle, have a QUALIFIED gunsmith check it before chambering a round. By simply working the bolt, you can watch the firing ping shroud for movement. It shouldn't move when closing the bolt, remaining about 1/4" beyond the bolt body. Again, if you have any doubts, have a gunsmith check it out.

BTW, I just picked up a pre-64 M-70 from one of my smiths, rechambered in 6.5-284 with a #3 Bartlein, in a new McMillan hunting stock with 2 piece bottom metal. Stocks are around. All pre-64 actions are the same length, with same mounting holes. One piece metal came out later. All post-64 actions have a "G" prefix on serial number. I'd like a 30-06, 300 H&H and a 35 Whelan to round out my pre-64 gang.

Good luck,
Scott

 

[SBS]

Some thoughts on your project. Since weight is not critical (stand hunting), why not cut down the target stock somewhat and rebed it? Most X/C rifles of that era used stocks that could easily be pared down for a good hunting stock. McMillan makes several stocks for the pre-64 inlet and there are custom ones that come up often on auctions and gun shows as people pull them off and hunt down originals to return them to factory specs. Having been used as X/C rifle, it saw plenty of rapid fire strings and more than likely the barrel needs replaced. For caliber, I would suggest a 6.5-06. While easily the velocity of a 6.5-284, barrel life is not a factor for hunting purposes. Only need to neck up .25-06 brass, no need to fireform -- which you must do for the AI rounds (not an Ackley detractor, I own several). Another consideration about AI rounds is that the pre-64 (like 03 Springfields, Mausers and others) have machined feed rails which are for specific cartridge shapes and require work to properly feed the AI rounds. Many cartridges will work for your purposes, but 6.5-06 is one of the better ones -- no fireforming and will feed through your action as is. The best factory round is probably the .270 Win.

 

[Brians356]

I would go with 270 Win. It's never really been bested for how you plan to hunt. And it's a natural fit, as probably more pre-'64 M70s have been sold in 270 Win than any other cartridge not named 30-06 Springfield.
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[Brians356]

If it is original
I would sell the copper mine and probably would pay for a new gun
Many of the original guns bring big money

Post-war unaltered M70 Standard 30-06 in even uncommon 98% condition only rates about $1200, a Featherweight only $800. But the rifle in question here has been altered.
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[savagedasher]

Post-war unaltered M70 Standard 30-06 in even uncommon 98% condition only rates about $1200, a Featherweight only $800. But the rifle in question here has been altered.
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Got any for sale at that price and shape

 

[Brians356]

Got any for sale at that price and shape

Ok, what one's worth is what someone's willing to pay for it. My point was that post-war Standard models in common chamberings are not worth the "big bucks", in the context of collectible rifles. Any Super Grade, or a rare chambering, different story. The 30-06s are the least valuable all.
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[2506]

For a hunting/target 600 yard rifle I also would go 6.5-06 with a heavy sportier or light varmint 26" barrel with 8" twist. It would get just as good or better barrel life as the 280AI because you would have to burn up barrel life just fire forming for the 280AI. Like previously said neck up 25-06 cases with one run through a 6.5-06 FL size die and load and go hunting. My hunting buddy had one and that is all he had to do. He used H4831 with 140 gr Sierra Game Kings and made some really long shots across soy bean fields with that rifle. It is hard to beat any 6.5 cal. these days with all the great bullets they make now.

 

[savagedasher]

Ok, what one's worth is what someone's willing to pay for it. My point was that post-war Standard models in common chamberings are not worth the "big bucks", in the context of collectible rifles. Any Super Grade, or a rare chambering, different story. The 30-06s are the least valuable all.
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When’s your put 98 %on it

 

[riflewoman]

It doesn’t take much to reduce it from 98%. The gun in question has been used for Match Rifle NMC shooting. It wouldn’t be 98%. Most of the collectors grade guns are in collections by now. The rest are floating around as basic used rifles.

The whole collector market is relatively quiet unless it is rare or in Pristine condition. Lugers, Mausers, Winchesters all have a following but few seem to be actively collecting them. A matching WW1 Erfurt Luger sits begging in the case at a local shop at 1200. It would rate at 85-90%. I can remember in the 1980s it wouldn’t last long at that price. 95% of the gun market are no longer interested.

 

[savagedasher]

Last week a fellow racer brought a 52 Winchester to me
It was a heavy barrel gun finish was 98%
Had him take it to a dealer friend
The stock was changed if original
The price could of $2000 plus
Ended up around $500

 

[msinc]

Two weeks ago I got $1600.00 for a 1957 year in 270Win. I should have asked for more...the buyer was very happy to get it. it was not unfired, but it was unaltered.
I have four pre-64 70's in Ackley chamberings, probably barreled at least a dozen or so others...I have not altered any of the feed rails on any of them and they feed just fine. Maybe I am just lucky, but I honestly have not had to do it, in fact, this thread is the first I have heard of such thing. This includes one Springfield 1903 as well.

 

[Brians356]

When’s your put 98 %on it

Huh? Translate please.
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[savagedasher]

When someone says a gun is 98% he has something