POLL..Who Uses S/S Pins for Case Cleaning

[waldo1979]

Nowadays, for my .308 F/TR loads (vast majority of what I shoot in matches) I tumble for about an hour. Is it perfectly clean? Nope. Is it clean enough? Yep. No grit, no dust to get drug thru the sizing die, etc. Is the chamfer on the case mouth pristine any more? Nope. Does it matter? Dunno, because after F/L sizing I run the cases thru a Giraud case trimmer that touches them up, so its a non-issue for me '

-What brand of tumbler are you using?
-What mixture are you using (water,brass,pins and solvent)?
-what is your neck tension (are you using a bushing die)?

 

[memilanuk]

-What brand of tumbler are you using?

Already said, Thumler's Tumbler. Model B

-What mixture are you using (water,brass,pins and solvent)?

5 lbs media, 100 pcs .308 Win brass (~2.5 lbs), healthy squirt of Dawn Ultra and a tablespoon or so of Lemi-Shine, and fill the rest of the way up with H2O

-what is your neck tension (are you using a bushing die)?

~0.002". Using a bushing die + Lyman 'M' die for an expander mandrel (.306).

 

[majohnson]

Wet tumbling using the little tumbler from Harbor Freight, about a 1/3 of the pins in the package, along with roughly 20 pieces of brass at a time has yielded very good results. Using hot water soap and Lemi Shine, I run my cases for maybe an hour prior to sizing and remove the spent primer. Once they are sized and the primer is removed, I will rerun again for maybe an hour. The cases come out bright and shinny inside and out. I have neve seen any deformed necks, peening of the case mouth.

On neck tension I been using .003. I also measure the inside of the case and compare it with the bullet dimensions. What I have seen is even though the outside might indicate .003 tension, the inside might be underside a lot more. Which is why there is so much difference sometime in the amount of pressure required to seat the bullet. Like most guy I don't use the expanders, since they are prone to causing runout issue with the neck.

 

[waldo1979]

~0.002". Using a bushing die + Lyman 'M' die for an expander mandrel (.306).

I have an Extreme Tumbler from STM. I wonder if it rotates too fast. I've read that Thumbler Model B's have either a 32rpm or 20 rpm speed depending on the motor.

 

[waldo1979]

According to this video it's 47RPM:

Maybe that's why i'm having issues.

 

[Mozella]

........ snip............ and shorter cleaning time (again reduce number of collision) is what we use to avoid peening.

In an attempt to reduce my cleaning time and help remove the lanolin based lube I use, I've been happy with this method: Put a kettle of water on the stove to boil. Put the brass in a small bucket and give them a squirt or two of strong degreasing liquid like Simple Green. Massage the cases for 20 seconds by hand and let them soak until the rinse water is boiling. Add a squirt of Dawn and pour in the kettle of boiling water. Swirl and let them soak until the water is no longer hot. Rinse the cases and start the normal SS wet tumbling sequence. This has significantly reduced the tumbling time to get the cases nice and clean. The total time is about the same, but with about half the required time in the tumbler.

 

[1066]

I use an old rock tumbler with three rubber drums, about 50 cases to a drum. Drop of Lemishine and dish soap but I don't seem to do them as long as most, maybe 40-45 minutes.

Very pleased with the results. I anneal after cleaning if necessary and just brush the inside of the neck with graphite (or HBN) before seating bullet.

Here's my machine at work:

 

[jlow]

In an attempt to reduce my cleaning time and help remove the lanolin based lube I use, I've been happy with this method: Put a kettle of water on the stove to boil. Put the brass in a small bucket and give them a squirt or two of strong degreasing liquid like Simple Green. Massage the cases for 20 seconds by hand and let them soak until the rinse water is boiling. Add a squirt of Dawn and pour in the kettle of boiling water. Swirl and let them soak until the water is no longer hot. Rinse the cases and start the normal SS wet tumbling sequence. This has significantly reduced the tumbling time to get the cases nice and clean. The total time is about the same, but with about half the required time in the tumbler.

I use Imperial and it is pretty easy to remove. A simple 5 min tumble with hot water/Dawn/Lemishine and it is all gone.

 

[Just Dave]

Everybody tumbles in pins for WAY longer than whats required,, Your trying to remove residue, not etch to bare metal again..
I use the Extreme 17 with about 6# of pin-media , a squirt of concentrated car wash ( watch ingredients ) and a dash of lemi shine, About 20 minutes after I start it. I stop, dump the entire solution, and rinse with warm water.
Fill it up again with clean warm water, same solution only less soap. and run for another 20 minutes, rinse with warm water and dry..
.
DONE..
.
If it was range brass pick-ups, I might dump and rinse a second time ,
Your pins and drum should be cleaned periodically, I use a squirt of dawn, and a dash of Ajax.. You would be surprised how much gunk comes out of a tumbler of "clean" pins..
1- hour spent cleaning the media, about every 3rd to 5th batch of brass cleaned, depending on how much lanolin contamination I get.

 

[amlevin]

I notice a lot of Thumbler Model B's are used. I recently purchased a Frankford Arsenal Rotary Tumbler as my previous "Sidewinder" was just to small for my needs.

The Frankford unit will handle up to 30# in total of Brass, Pins, and Water. I had a lot of pins left from my initial 5# purchase several years ago so I just added them to the pins that came with the Frankford. I'm going to say I have around 8+ pounds of pins in the drum and use 1.5 gallons of water (12#). The remaining 10# of capacity allows me to process easily 400 pieces of .308 and twice that number of .223. The extra pins have made "neck peening" a non-issue.

 

[jlow]

amlevin - with my Thumbler tumbler which normally holds 5# of pins, I currently use 10# and I can still get into trouble with peening if I tumble 100 pieces of 223 brass for too long.. i.e. significantly longer than 1 hour. Maybe it is because I anneal, I don't know, but when I keep the brass number and time reasonable, I am fine.

 

[alf]

Guys......

This thread is to find those who shoot Registered Benchrest and clean their brass with S/S media, and why or why not that they do or do not.

There's a pile of shooters here that compete that are staying mum on the subject for one reason or another......

 

[ASbobcat]

This works

1. Anneal brass 1st
2. Slide 1/2 inch pieces of Tygon or rubber tubing over case necks to avoid case neck peening
3. Tumble brass in Thumblers Tumbler for 2 hours with 5# SS pins, just enough cold H20 to cover brass and pins, 50-100 pieces 6XC brass, 1 tsp Dawn, 1 tsp Lemi Shine
4. Dump brass, H2O and pins into media separator
5. Remove Tygon or rubber tubing from case necks
6. Rinse brass in filtered or softened H20
7. Place cases on drying rack to air dry or into dehydrator
8. Spray outer cases and inside necks with One Shot spray lube
9. Full length size with Redding Type "S" die with neck bushing
10. Expand necks with Sinclair generation II expander mandrel
11. Trim and chamfer case necks with Giraud trimmer
12. Re uniform and clean primer pockets
13. Wrap 0000 steel wool around a bronze wire brush and spin inside case necks with a drill, electric screwdriver, etc.. Will leave inside case necks super smooth every time
14. Rinse cases in 99% isopropyl alcohol to remove One Shot lube and use nylon brush on inside of case neck
15. Rinse in STM brass tarnish inhibitor - http://www.stainlesstumblingmedia.com/brass-tarnish-inhibitor.html
16. Place cases on drying rack to air dry or place in dehydrator.

That's it. SD always in mid single digits

That's it? That's all?

 

[ASbobcat]

QUOTE "SS pins do no have sufficient mass to damage, work harden or peen your case mouths. "

I agree. The pins have little mass plus the impact velocity is close to zero. I am sure many will disagree. Even if the edge of the neck was cold worked from the pins it would be well under 1 thous in depth and not affect neck tension. Funny how the sides and shoulders don't show a texture change from pin impact? The brass is soft enough to ding each other? In any case it's nothing to worry about. If you don't like the marks on the neck opening just trim to length after tumbling. The pins I bought didn't have sharp edges. No breakin tumble was needed.

All of this WELL DOCUMENTED information from you metallurgists and physicists would be funny
if it weren't dangerous :-(

My SS tumbler has been collecting dust since I blew an extractor into the next county as the result of peened case necks. No more "labor saving devices" for me.

 

[Joe R]

Interested in who here uses stainless steel pins for case cleaning on their match brass.

I'm only interested in people that shoot Benchrest competition, point blank PPC, VFS, Hunter BR, or 600/1000 yard BR, where the ultimate in accuracy is the goal.

Not the guy that has a rifle, or knows a guy, that shoots in the "ones all day" or "one ragged hole all day long", or PRS guys, etc.....personal experience only.

Why or why not?

This is the reply I posted on another thread here just a minute ago:

There is no consensus on this issue, so as far as accuracy is concerned there is no benefit other than the placebo effect. However, my reason for tumbling/washing with stainless steel pins isn't to get shiny brass, its to get clean brass. Clean brass will keep the inside of your dies clean and polished.

You know the black stuff that you clean out of your dies is lube mixed with residual carbon powder. Carbon is one of the hardest substances on the planet, with enough time and pressure it becomes diamonds. IMO the very fine grit left on the brass by corn cob will scratch the surface of your dies over time. So there is that benefit to be gained by clean brass. I rarely clean my dies and when I do all I get out of them is Imperial sizing wax.

The other benefit of using ss pins and water is that my primer pockets are also sparkling clean so it eliminates the step of cleaning primer pockets. Not to mention that primer pocket cleaning brushes and tools change you primer pockets a little each time.

I have been using the FART (Franklin Arsenal Rotary Tumbler) for over a year shooting 200 grain Bergers at 2700 fps and my brass has never failed to grab the chamber. On one occasion I even blew a primer out because I was at inching towards the edge of the abyss.

But don't take my word for it, ask Jade Delcambre (username here: Down South) what he uses to clean his brass. If you don't know Jade, you can find his name on the top of the F-TR 2015 NRA National Records for 20 shots at 1,000 yards (200-13X).

Kindest regards,

Joe

 

[dcali]

I use ultrasound. 20 minutes of ultrasound followed by 20 in the oven at 225 gets them pretty darned clean. Stainless seems like a lot of expense and hassle for no good reason, especially if tumbling dings the necks.

 

[Joe R]

I forgot. Here's a video that I made for guys that I shoot with.

Joe

 

[Sniper338]

Yep i use ss pins and simple green

 

[Milo 2.0]

 

[jrb572]

Cheap food dehydrators work well for drying brass quickly