OCW vs. QuickLoad.

[BenPerfected]

Porter, take a look at "the Purdy Prescription". takes into account the volume of the "echo chamber" of the tuner and how it does affect harmonics. Has been proven up amongst rimfire BR shooters. Seymour

The Purdy Prescription is widely used (almost exclusively) in RF BR. This method is focused around adjusting the effective OAL length of the barrel using the Harrell tuner. Also the Harrell tuner weights about 7oz and and you can vary the weight and length by adding additional spacers/weights. I am new to CF, but have seen significant improvements in accuracy using a CF tuner where the length is adjustable. Is it the weight or the length?....IMO, yes.

 

[savagedasher]

Porter, take a look at "the Purdy Prescription". takes into account the volume of the "echo chamber" of the tuner and how it does affect harmonics. Has been proven up amongst rimfire BR shooters. Seymour

The Purdy Prescription is widely used (almost exclusively) in RF BR. This method is focused around adjusting the effective OAL length of the barrel using the Harrell tuner. Also the Harrell tuner weights about 7oz and and you can vary the weight and length by adding additional spacers/weights. I am new to CF, but have seen significant improvements in accuracy using a CF tuner where the length is adjustable. Is it the weight or the length?....IMO, yes.

Tuners that work will give as much as 40 % movement in group size. Rim fire you can't tune the ammo so tuners and weight makes a difference..
CF is a different ball game. The same 40% movement in group size is there with tuners. A perfect tuned load a tuner can only make 40% negative results.
I never have found a perfect load .Because of changing conditions and shooter error. The 40% reference is only a number I have found to be a average with most tuners. Short range shooters use tuners to make their near perfect load last 40 % longer.
Long range shooters that know about tuners use it as a tool to adjust vertical & horizontal movement from changing conditions.
Tuners must have ease of adjustment and repeat ability to be used for a advantage.
RAS Tuners does both. Larry

 

[cpl666k9]

I am new to using Quickload and still learning. Can someone point out where Z1 and PM readings are? I think I found the Z1 but want to confirm. Tony

 

[savagedasher]

I am new to using Quickload and still learning. Can someone point out where Z1 and PM readings are? I think I found the Z1 but want to confirm. Tony

the ZI And PM are on the long graph that shows powder burn and barrel length Larry

 

[jlow]

I am new to using Quickload and still learning. Can someone point out where Z1 and PM readings are? I think I found the Z1 but want to confirm. Tony

the ZI And PM are on the long graph that shows powder burn and barrel length Larry

It's easy to find those terms since the manual is in PDF format - do a search which is a function build into the software. The down side is they do not do a reasonable job of explaining the terms. BTW PM is actually Pmax.

 

[BenPerfected]

Porter, take a look at "the Purdy Prescription". takes into account the volume of the "echo chamber" of the tuner and how it does affect harmonics. Has been proven up amongst rimfire BR shooters. Seymour

The Purdy Prescription is widely used (almost exclusively) in RF BR. This method is focused around adjusting the effective OAL length of the barrel using the Harrell tuner. Also the Harrell tuner weights about 7oz and and you can vary the weight and length by adding additional spacers/weights. I am new to CF, but have seen significant improvements in accuracy using a CF tuner where the length is adjustable. Is it the weight or the length?....IMO, yes.

Tuners that work will give as much as 40 % movement in group size. Rim fire you can't tune the ammo so tuners and weight makes a difference..
CF is a different ball game. The same 40% movement in group size is there with tuners. A perfect tuned load a tuner can only make 40% negative results.
I never have found a perfect load .Because of changing conditions and shooter error. The 40% reference is only a number I have found to be a average with most tuners. Short range shooters use tuners to make their near perfect load last 40 % longer.
Long range shooters that know about tuners use it as a tool to adjust vertical & horizontal movement from changing conditions.
Tuners must have ease of adjustment and repeat ability to be used for a advantage.
RAS Tuners does both. Larry

Hi Larry,
I think the RAS tuner is mostly about weight but the weight is adjustable. The RAS tuner does add to the effective OAL but the tuner length isn't easily adjustable as designed. My next round of tuning will be to set the RAS tuner at the optimum weight setting (already established on one barrel) and then use SS shims between the barrel shoulder and the RAS tuner to experiment with small length increases.
Ben

 

[fredo]

Aside from the linear relationship between Z1/Pmax, favorable results can also be correlated relatively easily by referencing the % values in "Filling/L.R.", "Ballistic Efficiency" and "Amount of Propellant Burnt".

IE, I look for a powder with ~100% case fill & close to 100% burn, then compare the % values for BE with other powders worthy of consideration.

In my experience with QL, the powder/charge the nets the highest BE % within a tolerable pressure threshold usually wants to shoot & requires little tweaking...

 

[savagedasher]

Porter, take a look at "the Purdy Prescription". takes into account the volume of the "echo chamber" of the tuner and how it does affect harmonics. Has been proven up amongst rimfire BR shooters. Seymour

The Purdy Prescription is widely used (almost exclusively) in RF BR. This method is focused around adjusting the effective OAL length of the barrel using the Harrell tuner. Also the Harrell tuner weights about 7oz and and you can vary the weight and length by adding additional spacers/weights. I am new to CF, but have seen significant improvements in accuracy using a CF tuner where the length is adjustable. Is it the weight or the length?....IMO, yes.

Tuners that work will give as much as 40 % movement in group size. Rim fire you can't tune the ammo so tuners and weight makes a difference..
CF is a different ball game. The same 40% movement in group size is there with tuners. A perfect tuned load a tuner can only make 40% negative results.
I never have found a perfect load .Because of changing conditions and shooter error. The 40% reference is only a number I have found to be a average with most tuners. Short range shooters use tuners to make their near perfect load last 40 % longer.
Long range shooters that know about tuners use it as a tool to adjust vertical & horizontal movement from changing conditions.
Tuners must have ease of adjustment and repeat ability to be used for a advantage.
RAS Tuners does both. Larry

Hi Larry,
I think the RAS tuner is mostly about weight but the weight is adjustable. The RAS tuner does add to the effective OAL but the tuner length isn't easily adjustable as designed. My next round of tuning will be to set the RAS tuner at the optimum weight setting (already established on one barrel) and then use SS shims between the barrel shoulder and the RAS tuner to experiment with small length increases.
Ben

Hi Ben The smallest shim we have tried is one quarter a thousand but to get them they had to be thicker but in one Quarter thousand difference . Any combo we tried up to .500 thousands didn't work as good as tuner tight on the barrel and adjusting the tuner.
Why would you want to have a tuner on a gun that you couldn't change for tuning in ever changing conditions?
Tuners give a person a adjusting tool that can be used while shooting for different shooting conditions.. Used properly gives a shooter a advantage. I have learned which way to move it and how much for different conditions. All tuners change the impact of the bullet from vertical & horizontal. Which corner of the tune your are tune of makes a difference in the direction you move it. My preference is vertical up horizontal right. That tune works best for me in our ever changing head & tail winds. Larry

 

[1shot]

A question I posed to a fellow shooter is: Is a tuner legal in NRA sanctioned matches? His friend uses them in NRA F-class competition and bloop tubes are in HP and LR, but muzzle brakes and suppressors are not, so where is the line sand is drawn? Inquiring minds want to know.
Lloyd

 

[Joe R]

I believe it depends on the class that one competes in. I can't speak for other disciplines but in F-class tuners are permitted (I'm using one now), muzzle brakes and suppressors are not. That simple.

Kindest regards,

Joe

 

[1shot]

I'm sorry Joe, I should have elaborated further. I shoot LR prone and high power.
Regards,
Lloyd

 

[rudysts]

Ten years I have ben using OL The only changes I do is H2O capacity cartridge length and barrel length. That gives me fill amount ,speed and pressure and amount burned in the barrel. What I look for in a powder is one that the Z1 and Pm the lines are together on the peak of the pressure curve. I never have found a powder that PM and the Z1 were one line on the pressure curve that didn't shoot. I find where the bullet gets it 95% speed in inches. has big effect on how long the chamber last. Barrel time is fun to play with but means nothing on how a gun will shoot.
If you use nothing but the standard 6 MM dasher settings
Enter 105Hybrids Case length set to 2.440 30.0'' barrel Case capacity 41.8 H4350 powder 36.6 gr .
You will see the Z1 and the PM are just one line on the middle of the power curve The bullet gets 95% of speed 17" down the barrel. 108.1 Fill capacity 98.4% burn With 60887 Psi And 3087 FPS
My guns shoot 3070 to 3080 I haven't lost primer pockets so the pressure must be close. My seating depth hasn't change .006 in 1200 rounds. The fire cracking is mild.
When I used Varget and Rl 15 my primers were junk after 5 reloading .015 to.020 Seating depth change the chamber look like a alligator back. OL is just a tool to help to find the powder with different bullets and case capacity Works very well when regulating bullet speed on double guns. Larry

Larry thank you for sharing this info I tried it and I am a believer. I also checked loads on other rifles and the ones that shoot really well the Z1 and Pm lined up on top of each other.

Thanks again