Observations on the AMP

[Richard Coody]

Well I had a geraud for years that did me a fine job. But in the back of my mind I always wondered if.i was doing it.right.

I am a.small batch reloader. 50 cases is about all I will do at at a time. I would say that I can do those 50 cases in the time it takes to set up my geraud and test with Templax

Couldn't be simpler to operate.

Damn aztec melts a piece of brass. No problem getting it mixed up in the lineup.

The AMP seems to get the brass much hotter than I ever did with the geraud.

The annealing line looks just like new lapua brass right out of the box

No guessing now if I am doing it right

Is it really necessary? Who knows but it is another fun step in the reloading process. One.of.the.reasons I like annealing is I keep my brass in 50 piece.lots. Now.sometimes.when I am doing load development with a new bullet or powder I may only load 25 or 30 pieces. Hard to keep that 50 by times fired. Well when you anneal you bring them all back to the.same place. Times fired loses its importance

 

[David Christian]

True, post annealing consistency, primer pockets giving out is the real longevity factor for me.

 

[B2Lee]

I have many thoughts on the AMP...but I'll reframe from writing a book and just give a few:

1. I've found through the years when flame annealing, I can tell on the full length sizing process that the neck tension is going to be different from one piece to the next. Even when I have the timing dialed...every now and then I can feel variation in the anneal. ESPECIALLY if I set up the flame annealer and do half...and then come back a few days later and do the other half....or I adjust from one cartridge to the next. With the AMP I get exact same annealing whether it is all at one time...or one piece a day for a year. I can tell from piece to piece in the sizing, mandreling and bullet seating that the AMP is by far....the most consistent method I've ever used.

2. With the appropriate bushing...I'm annealing exactly where I need to be....and no more....no less of the brass than is necessary. Whether I set it up once...or 500 seperate times....it is exactly where it needs to be.

3. More heat to the brass in a much shorter time....resulting in a better break down of the crystalline structure. Setting an exact return to a chosen Vickers number with no guessing based off 'tempilaq' color changes. Sure, the coating got to 750F for a set amount of time...but was it long enough to fully anneal the brass to the desired Vickers hardness?

I'll stop there...I got a bunch of reasons for the AMP Annealer. The price does suck...it is out of reach of most reloaders...but the thing rocks and is invaluable in my reloading process. If you have the means....then get one....if you don't have the means....get a friend that has one.

 

[Rset]

I don't have an AMP and so can't say if the process yields better results or not. I flame anneal, and I get very consistent measurements from my re-sizing, and do not have any issues.
Is an AMP better? I can not possibly say.
Do you need more than 20 loads on the same the same brass with the same consistency? I can't say that either as over the 40+ years that I have reloaded, I have never worried about that.
Is an AMP worth the money when you consider on target results?. I have yet to see anyone prove it with real numbers. But, then again, I do not follow eveyoyne's results, and am highly suspect of most claims

 

[JimSC]

When I see threads like this I always wonder why most standing records were shot long before the first AMP was ever sold.

Group Records

internationalbenchrest.com

Personally I believe consistency counts more than a "perfect" anneal. Where you get into trouble is mixing cases that have varied numbers of firings on them which would cause a variation in the yield point of the metal. Just my opinion of course.

 

[ngb1787]

No doubt amp is a nice unit, however i put a volt meter ($5) and gas pressure regulator with gauge ($25) on giraud and now get a perfect consistent annealing job every time with giraud for 1/3 of the price of an amp. Both units amp and giraud are quality units.

 

[Richard Coody]

I don't have an AMP and so can't say if the process yields better results or not. I flame anneal, and I get very consistent measurements from my re-sizing, and do not have any issues.
Is an AMP better? I can not possibly say.
Do you need more than 20 loads on the same the same brass with the same consistency? I can't say that either as over the 40+ years that I have reloaded, I have never worried about that.
Is an AMP worth the money when you consider on target results?. I have yet to see anyone prove it with real numbers. But, then again, I do not follow eveyoyne's results, and am highly suspect of most claims

Is annealing worth it for brass life? I have never had problems with split necks. Primer pockets always go first for me. Annealing won't help that. I use to be one to push the max. Primer pockets go quickly doing that. I have found that if you back off to that next accuracy node brass will last.

The reason I like annealing is your shoulder bump is more consistent and so is you seating depth. Neck tension can be controlled easier. The brass doesn't slowly work harden forcing you to chase that shoulder bump and use a tighter sizing bushing to maintain neck tension.

I too reloaded for 40 years successfully to me before I joined this forum and bolted down the rabbit hole.

I like gadgets anyway.

 

[Webster]

When I see threads like this I always wonder why most standing records were shot long before the first AMP was ever sold.

Group Records

internationalbenchrest.com

Personally I believe consistency counts more than a "perfect" anneal. Where you get into trouble is mixing cases that have varied numbers of firings on them which would cause a variation in the yield point of the metal. Just my opinion of course.

Looks like no records were ever set before annealing or shoulder bump gauges were sold. I flame anneal for 5 seconds which should give me very little anneal just stress relieve. Should be very consistant if hardly any annealing takes place. I see no reason to think the necks are continually getting harder. Very little force to size the neck area. Firing the same 200 Lapua cases since 2009. About 3 split necks in that time. I anneal about every 3 firigs. Anneal all cases when I get a split neck. I am perfectley happy with case life and groups on the target.

With deer hunting rifles we now have guys checking primer pockets with pin gauges, bullet run out, case wt. and volume, neck tension and ect. and buying $1000 electronic scales.

By the way I bought my 6BR and 6BRX for Varmint hunting because of this website and I think they are very accurate for a GH gun.

 

[JimSC]

. I flame anneal for 5 seconds which should give me very little anneal just stress relieve. Should be very consistant if hardly any annealing takes place. I see no reason to think the necks are continually getting harder. Very little force to size the neck area. Firing the same 200 Lapua cases since 2009. About 3 split necks in that time. I anneal about every 3 firigs. Anneal all cases when I get a split neck. I am perfectley happy with case life and groups on the target.

Same here, my annealing is far from a perfect anneal but it accomplishes what I want it to do.

When I moved all my .260 Rem cases got all mixed up. Some had 10 firings some 6 some 15 etc. I had stopped annealing for a while there and noticed about 1 in 10 of my rounds would be an uncalled flyer either about 1 MOA high or low.

So I did a analysis of what I had stopped doing on my reload process and dusted off the Annealeeze and did a little experiment. Like you I flame annealed for appx 5 - 6 seconds. My only measurement was looking for the oxide ring to get about 1/4 to 3/8 below the shoulder. Not exactly a precision method but it worked. Thos uncalled flyers went away.

 

[Rodney]

I’ve annealed with a flame and induction. The major difference is setup time for me. Plus I anneal in my house so not having an open flame is comforting but I do believe you can do excellent annealing with either method. I’ve had my but handed to me numerous times at matches by guys that don’t ever anneal and by guys that flame anneal. It’s just one piece of a many piece puzzle. You can have the most accurate rifle at the match but if you don’t read the wind correctly, you will not win the match. I’m fortunate enough to own an amp annealer and wouldn’t trade it for anything. Like the one poster said “if you can’t afford an amp, get a friend that does”. I anneal for my shooting buddies all the time. The amp has made it so easy and I write down there settings for the next time. The least I can do for all the help they have done for me in getting me into the shooting sports.

 

[Richard Coody]

I am really kind of sorry I started this thread. It was really just my observations on a new piece of equipment. I did not mean to bring out all this controversy.

There are no rules in reloading. People have success with all sorts of methods. It is all about what works for you.

Learning about new things is part of the journey and what keeps it interesting

 

[mr45man]

Dont be sorry, flame annealing is guess work. I have a state of the art flame.
I will never use it again. Set up time, repeatable, small batches, plug it in and start annealing. AMP is like the electric scale.