New member, new build. Need some advice

[shootinlefty]

I'm a young pup, only 21. I've been hunting and shooting at our farm in Maryland since I could walk. Just recently got the idea to build a long range rifle from scratch. Not looking to compete, but would like to put my knowledge of external ballistics to the test and have a nice rifle for hunting. I shoot targets from bipods mostly. I like the 7.62x51 caliber due to low recoil, consistent trajectory performance, and relatively low cost to reload. I understand basics (heavy barrel, trigger focus when shooting, everything is expensive haha) but would really appreciate some advice from more experienced guys on shooting and the different actions, parts, contacts, etc. Thank you

 

[Erik Cortina]

What will you hunt with it and how far?

 

[OldManTA]

I'm an old guy left hander. By 7.62X51 I presume you mean 308 Winchester. A pretty much standard approach is a Remington 700 or clone action, Krieger/Hart std. Palma in 11 twist that finishes out at 30 inches, a Jewel target trigger and a Picatinny rail scope mount. That's really the simple part. For a stock there are many possibilities from a Boyd semi-inletted to a Competiton Shooting Stuff tube gun chassis or something along the line of a Masterclass Prone stock. I prefer the tube stock for adjustability, availability and cost and it comes with a rail. You can have the barrel chambered for a standard SAAMI chamber or one of the many variants used in long range competition. That will depend to some degree on the bullet weight range you want to shoot. The best source for tooling is Pacific Tool & Gauge. Now that is one way and there are certainly others. Since I have no idea what your budget might be there are some bells and whistles I didn't include.
I have been a HP competitor since 1970 and currently hold Master classifications in across the course and mid range prone. That and $.52 will get you a senior coffee at McDonalds where I live. If you think the above makes sense and you need some more information I'll be glad to try to answer your questions.
Tom Alves

 

[shootinlefty]

Well, I will be hunting medium sized game, basically just whitetail, but possibly coyotes. Range will stretch out close to ~900 yds in the fields at the farm. Yes, I am talking about the .308 Win. I have read that it replicates it's shots as good as any and it is very consistent. I assume the same goes for any round of that same caliber, sectional density, and/or ballistic coefficient (.300 WSM, etc). I was actually looking into building off of the Remington 700 base just because it is the most common. Only issue is understanding exactly what the manufacturers mean by their vocabulary (contour, unturned, SAAMI chamber, etc.) I'm picking up as I go. I will look into all of the resources and contacts you mentioned so far. I would like to build something that looks pretty much like the CheyTac m-200, but not in the .408 caliber.. Just the aesthetic idea of it, but finding parts is a bear. I work all day and go to college all night so this will be a fairly slow build. Price doesn't matter, may just need to take a little longer saving for the bells and whistles.

 

[Erik Cortina]

Whitetail are not hard to kill. What about a 6.5?
6.5x47 Lapua, 6.5 Creedmore, or .260?

 

[jr600yd]

+1 for the 260. You can get Lapua brass or neck down good quality 308 brass. 6.5 bullets have higher BC's than the 30's and felt recoil is about 20% less than the 308. I've shot a lot of 260 from 100 to 1K yds and it will put a smile on your face.

 

[shootinlefty]

Well, when my dad and I first got into reloading and long distance shooting, I was not aware that the heavier the bullet, the higher the BC. #1 because dad has no idea how to run a computer and #2 because neither of us had heard of BC until I really go into long distance shooting. We were busting 1 gallon milk jugs at 500 yds with the .243 using 70gr HPBT's and as much powder as you could load. Very fast, very flat shooting, almost out of control at 500 yds for that light of a bullet though. I've read and reread all of Bryan Litz's books, and although I'm not an experienced long range shooter, I would not say I'm lousy based on closer range precision groups (200-400 yds). The reason I was interested in .308 or .300, is because we already have the dies, bullets, and casings for reloading these cartridges. Not to mention finding parts and everything else for a .308 is much simpler because it is such a popular caliber. I have taken your advice thus far and looked up ballistics for the .260. Just a necked down .308 resulting in better BC at long range and higher kinetic energy. That being said, do you think it would be pointless to jump up to a .300, .338, etc due to price per round, and recoil?

 

[Erik Cortina]

A really big gun is not fun to shoot. .308" is as big as I would go, and even that is a little big for my taste. I shoot a 6.5x47 Lapua and I think it's perfect for whitetail and hogs here in Texas.

 

[shootinlefty]

Yeah, if I'm looking to get the crap kicked out of me, I'd just go shoot clays for a weekend. I never minded shooting the .308 I have because it's a Remington R25 and weighs a butt ton so there's really no felt recoil at all. But, I would much rather build a bolt action for distance shooting. How hard is it to find brass for the 6.5x47 Lapua? On a matter of cost and availability, how hard is it to find everything to build something like that? Do you have any links or recommended places to buy parts etc?

 

[Erik Cortina]

Yeah, if I'm looking to get the crap kicked out of me, I'd just go shoot clays for a weekend. I never minded shooting the .308 I have because it's a Remington R25 and weighs a butt ton so there's really no felt recoil at all. But, I would much rather build a bolt action for distance shooting. How hard is it to find brass for the 6.5x47 Lapua? On a matter of cost and availability, how hard is it to find everything to build something like that? Do you have any links or recommended places to buy parts etc?

The parts would be the same for 6.5x47 or for .308.

Actions: For a hunting rifle I like the Atlas actions. I built a detachable magazine .300 WSM for a friend and it's awesome.
http://www.kelbly.com/actions.html

Brass is plentiful.
http://www.grafs.com/retail/catalog/category/categoryId/3603?

Barrel: I'm partial to Brux. I'm also a Brux dealer.
http://bruxbarrels.com/

 

[shootinlefty]

Yessir, I see you're a well-liked dealer based on reviews on your profile and with the advice and resources you've given me so far. I looked at BAT actions and Kelby once before.. Will the actions have to stay that shiny chrome looking color, or can that be cerakoted to a more matte look? Also, what is your opinion on Accuracy International stocks? Will most barrel contours, actions, etc work on those stocks, or are they or mainly for a model 700 or clone?

 

[Erik Cortina]

Yes, they are mainly for 700 clones. You can coat an action, no problem.

The Atlas I used was a matte color, so it was not an issue for hunting.

 

[shootinlefty]

Okay, when it comes to deciding which action to use, what are some benefits and drawbacks to the long action vs short action? Also, what are the advantages and disadvantages of using a 90deg bolt throw vs 60deg bolt throw and where would you use the 90deg throw?

 

[Jay Christopherson]

On LA vs. SA: In my experience, for a hunting rifle, long action is the way to go. The reason being is that you have so many more options with regards to cartridge, OAL, etc... at some point down the line, you might want to try a different caliber or cartridge and a LA will give you options. I went the SA route on one rifle because I thought it would be handier, but really, it's just more limiting.

On bolt throw: Really what you are asking is the difference between a 3-lug and 2-lug action/bolt. I think. I don't know of any two lug actions that feature a 60º throw - I don't think that would work... There's some other actions like the Browning BBR and maybe the Weatherby MarkV that use a 60º throw and their own custom lug configuration. I personally own one of each (inherited) and they are both butter... it's really a matter of personal preference. People will tell you that the bolt lift on a 2-lug (90º) is lighter than the lift on a 3-lug (60º). Personally, I can't tell the difference. If the action has been done right, they're both smooth. If you are looking at a custom action, I wouldn't even worry about it, except where you might prefer a shorter lift. You might also hear that a 60º throw, being shorter, results in faster cycle times. I wouldn't know - I subscribe to the theory of "slow is smooth and smooth is fast" so throwing a bolt as fast as possible on a hunting rifle isn't a primary consideration for me.

The Atlas is a nice action - there're also other really nice actions in the same Remington footprint (which is what I prefer in a hunting rifle) by Defiance, Pierce, Borden... just to name a few.

EDIT: this all pertains to a hunting rifle setup btw...

 

[Erik Cortina]

Jay, the Atlas is a Remington footprint. I also have a Borden and it's very smooth.

I on the other hand prefer short actions. They are handier and with the WSM line I don't ever see myself needing a long action.

90° two lug actions are the most common.

 

[shootinlefty]

Well, I'm not looking to set any speed record for putting another round down range, so long action will probably be the route I take. This won't be a rifle I will carry through the woods for hunting. This will be solely a long range field rifle, so I'm going to save a few extra pennies for a NF mildot scope. Mildot reticle so I can range targets if I don't have a rangefinder. Out at the farm, we don't have any set ranges.. Just hayfields

 

[shootinlefty]

Is it possible to buy an action frame without the bolt? I like the look of the "tactical bolt" with the huge knob. Can you customize that option when buying an action?

 

[Erik Cortina]

Is it possible to buy an action frame without the bolt? I like the look of the "tactical bolt" with the huge knob. Can you customize that option when buying an action?

You can add the "tactical" know to any bolt.

Kelbly started making their Atlas action with a tactical bolt.

 

[Erik Cortina]

Well, I'm not looking to set any speed record for putting another round down range, so long action will probably be the route I take. This won't be a rifle I will carry through the woods for hunting. This will be solely a long range field rifle, so I'm going to save a few extra pennies for a NF mildot scope. Mildot reticle so I can range targets if I don't have a rangefinder. Out at the farm, we don't have any set ranges.. Just hayfields

Just buy a rangefinder, it is much easier and more accurate.

If you must range with reticle, they make easier ones to use than the Mil-dot.

 

[Jay Christopherson]

Jay, the Atlas is a Remington footprint. I also have a Borden and it's very smooth.

I on the other hand prefer short actions. They are handier and with the WSM line I don't ever see myself needing a long action.

90° two lug actions are the most common.

Yep, I know, I just edited my statement a bit to clarify what I meant. After all, the first line in the description of the Atlas contains the words "Remington Semi-clone action"...