New Berger .224 Bullet
- Thread starter xswanted
- Start date
It appears that Midway has jumped the gun a bit. We were instructed not to discuss a possible new bullet until Wednesday. Wednesday morning you'll get the straight dope on it and a chance to order the first ones out (while they're still warm!).
Steve & Shirley
McGee Competition Stocks
Authorized Berger, Lapua, SK, and Vv dealer
Steve & Shirley
McGee Competition Stocks
Authorized Berger, Lapua, SK, and Vv dealer
garandman
Bolt Gun Bodacious
RampedRaptor
Gold $$ Contributor
We= dealers
Who = Berger
#Extrapolation
Who = Berger
#Extrapolation
We are very pleased to announce the introduction of a new Berger .223 85.5 Long Range Hybrid bullet! The designers have been working quite some time and have done extensive testing and are very pleased with the results! Emil Praslick, former head of the Army AMU was involved and was very happy with the 1000 yard results!
Bullet Caliber 22 Caliber
Diameter .224 Inches
Grain Weight 85.5 Grains
Bullet Style Hollow Point Boat Tail
G1 Ballistic Coefficient .524
G7 Ballistic Coefficient .268
Sectional Density .243
Recommended Twist Rate 1 in 8" or Faster
Since we are one of the largest dealers, we are getting the first batch by the first of next week, so you may place your orders now! Our price is $155 for a brick of 500. Shipping is $10 for 1 brick or $20 for 2, 3, or 4 bricks.
Steve & Shirley
steve@mcgeestocks.com
785 472 4266
316 706 6225
Bullet Caliber 22 Caliber
Diameter .224 Inches
Grain Weight 85.5 Grains
Bullet Style Hollow Point Boat Tail
G1 Ballistic Coefficient .524
G7 Ballistic Coefficient .268
Sectional Density .243
Recommended Twist Rate 1 in 8" or Faster
Since we are one of the largest dealers, we are getting the first batch by the first of next week, so you may place your orders now! Our price is $155 for a brick of 500. Shipping is $10 for 1 brick or $20 for 2, 3, or 4 bricks.
Steve & Shirley
steve@mcgeestocks.com
785 472 4266
316 706 6225
Jdne5b
Gold $$ Contributor
Email sent, thanks!
Good news. I'm looking forward to seeing them on the east side of the Atlantic and trying them. Berger's Emil has said recently that a slew of new designs are on the way, the 0.264" 156gn EOL Hunter being the first. Whilst the factory move to Arizona was underway, then the new facility was settling in, all while Berger struggled to meet demand for existing models, the company sensibly didn't introduce any new products. Berger now sees itself as fully back on track so we can expect additions.
Bryan Litz hinted some years ago that there wouldn't be a 90gn Hybrid as he had doubts about existing Berger 90gn / 0.224" bullet OALs and (my assumption, not what he said) resulting stability. He said then (at least five years ago, whenever it was the great bullet shortage had yet to hit) he was looking at a hybrid in the calibre but if it appeared it'd most likely weigh 84-85gn, so 85.5gn fits into the thinking.
Bryan Litz hinted some years ago that there wouldn't be a 90gn Hybrid as he had doubts about existing Berger 90gn / 0.224" bullet OALs and (my assumption, not what he said) resulting stability. He said then (at least five years ago, whenever it was the great bullet shortage had yet to hit) he was looking at a hybrid in the calibre but if it appeared it'd most likely weigh 84-85gn, so 85.5gn fits into the thinking.
Just received Berger's press release email. Here are the relevant words on twist:
The new 85.5’s provide a “real” 1,000-yard long-range 22 caliber option. A claim often made by others, where we’ll provide supporting data to prove its viability. Designed for cartridges such as 224 Valkyrie, 22-250 Remington, 22 Creedmoor and others, optimal performance is achieved in 1:7” twist rifles, however, these may stabilize and provide exceptional results in 1:8” rifles with a slightly reduced ballistic coefficient.
The new 85.5’s provide a “real” 1,000-yard long-range 22 caliber option. A claim often made by others, where we’ll provide supporting data to prove its viability. Designed for cartridges such as 224 Valkyrie, 22-250 Remington, 22 Creedmoor and others, optimal performance is achieved in 1:7” twist rifles, however, these may stabilize and provide exceptional results in 1:8” rifles with a slightly reduced ballistic coefficient.
My 80.5's average 1.105" long. My 82 Bergers average 1.115" Betting these are quite a bit longer than the 82's, given the Hybrid shape. Hope Steve can measure some and give us some feedback.
Regardless it should be a happy 7 twist bullet in a 223 when pushed to 2750 or so. Good work Berger! These will sell like hotcakes.
Regardless it should be a happy 7 twist bullet in a 223 when pushed to 2750 or so. Good work Berger! These will sell like hotcakes.
MikeMcCasland
Team Texas F-T/R
Emailed ya this morning Steve. This announcement couldn't come at a better time.
Holy Crap!
Talk about the floodgates opening
! We're tickled to death that everyone's interested and that we're able to get them out soon. I'll post on here when they arrive and also let everyone know individually. This is what we heard back from Emil:
Some who have tested this bullet have had the best results using the ISSF chamber (.169” freebore) or at a slightly longer .196” freebore and 1:7” barrels. N140 seems a good candidate powder as well.
There is one gentleman, Garandman, who only wants 100, but we only sell by the 500, so if some of you want to split a brick with him, let him know on here!
Steve
Talk about the floodgates opening
! We're tickled to death that everyone's interested and that we're able to get them out soon. I'll post on here when they arrive and also let everyone know individually. This is what we heard back from Emil:Some who have tested this bullet have had the best results using the ISSF chamber (.169” freebore) or at a slightly longer .196” freebore and 1:7” barrels. N140 seems a good candidate powder as well.
There is one gentleman, Garandman, who only wants 100, but we only sell by the 500, so if some of you want to split a brick with him, let him know on here!
Steve
I know why I want to try them. I have had issues with bullets blowing up when using the 90’s in a 1/7 I’ll take the little lesser BC if I can save 10 points.
Why can't you use them in a service rifle? Just curious.
garandman
Bolt Gun Bodacious
Im guessing but... too long, prolly.
Ned Ludd
Silver $$ Contributor
From the information available so far, this bullet will likely fit into the same niche already occupied by 90 VLDs, 90 SMKs, and 88 ELDMs. Whether it offers any unique advantages over those other options will only be revealed as more people test and shoot them. Emil mentioned that some folks were using it with good results in chambers that have freebores from 0.169" (.223 Rem ISSF), to as long as 0.196". Based on that, my guess would be that it's probably noticeably longer than an 80.5 Fullbore bullet or 80 VLD, although a much longer bearing surface could achieve the same thing without adding a huge amount of total length. In the few examples where we have a direct comparison, hybrid bullets are normally a tick longer than a non-hybrid bullet of the same weight, and this bullet weighs ~ 5 gr more than the 80-somethings. Although Berger recommends a minimum of 8-twist, I wouldn't waste my time shooting these out of a twist rate that slow. Giving up even a small amount of BC unnecessarily with a .223 Rem shooting heavies totally defeats the purpose, IMO. I'd use a twist rate sufficient for the full intrinsic BC, which likely means a 7-twist unless you're willing to special order something in between 7- and 8-twist.
The BC of this bullet falls slightly behind the 90 VLD, but the difference is pretty marginal and overall performance between the two may be a wash as the lighter 85.5 gr bullet will likely tune in a bit faster. I would venture a guess that its success will depend largely on how well (and easily) it tunes in, and how the jackets hold up when they're pushed hard, as competition shooters like to do. The majority of people's unsatisfactory experiences with the 90 VLDs lie in difficulties getting them tuned in, or in jacket failures. If this bullet solves those two major issues, I'm sure it will be a winner.
The BC of this bullet falls slightly behind the 90 VLD, but the difference is pretty marginal and overall performance between the two may be a wash as the lighter 85.5 gr bullet will likely tune in a bit faster. I would venture a guess that its success will depend largely on how well (and easily) it tunes in, and how the jackets hold up when they're pushed hard, as competition shooters like to do. The majority of people's unsatisfactory experiences with the 90 VLDs lie in difficulties getting them tuned in, or in jacket failures. If this bullet solves those two major issues, I'm sure it will be a winner.
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