need to size neck, 20 caliber to .17

[nilebartram]

Thought I would try here for information. I am trying to find the best way to resize a 221 fireball cartridge to accept a .17 bullet. I have 300 Lapua and remington brass to resize. I just found out you can buy 17 fireball. Please help. nilebartram

 

[chuckshooter]

My buddy has made over 3000 17 fireball cases from full size 223. Many steps just to get the cases down to 221 fireball. The last steps are what you are interested in. He just uses standard bushing dies in two steps. The big thing is he had to trim the necks both inside and out. A rather large donut forms probably because he is coming from 223 down . You would need to check for that as well as neck wall thickness.
I have made several thousand vartarg cases from 223, 360 dw. And 221 fireball. It's a lot of work . But you are Starting with 221 cases. You only need to size the neck once or twice to get to 17cal.. depending on the brass you may need to aneill before forming. You might get away without it since you are only forming the necks. I love my vartarg's. Which are the same only 20 cal. Good luck

 

[L.Sherm]

I use double ended forming dies from Bullberry they work great for necking any brass down.

 

[nilebartram]

chuckshooter -How many steps does it take to form 221 case from 223? I knew I would find better info here with you small bore shooters nilebartram

 

[JSH]

Thought I would try here for information. I am trying to find the best way to resize a 221 fireball cartridge to accept a .17 bullet. I have 300 Lapua and remington brass to resize. I just found out you can buy 17 fireball. Please help. nilebartram

I took the decap/expander ball out, ran into a 221 die.
Same thing with the 17 die, take out the decap pin until later.
As mentioned a bushing die will let you do a bit more.

I have cut different brass down for a long time making what I needed. I get the satisfaction of doing it and telling folks you did it.
I just find my time more valuable today than years ago.

Be aware that case capacities can and will vary. I loaded some 17HH ammo this past summer. This was even all Hornady brass. I went from a full case to the bottom of the neck, to no way it was going to fit. 5-6 grain difference in brass. That is a huge difference when dealing with little cases.

 

[chuckshooter]

In my early days, I didn't need notes because I could remember everything. Now I can,t remember to take notes. I believe this is right.
#1 Redding form die 90101
#2 Redding form die 83101
#3 At the top of the stroke cut off excess brass with a small makita reciprocating saw with a very fine metal blade. You can file the top to clean it up or trim to length later.
(This is where others talk about the mini chop saw from harbor freight tool)
#4. 221 fireball die

When Making killer bee brass from 32-20 starline brass or 20 vartarg from 360 dan wesson brass I had to aneall first or bad things happened. Crinkling , buckling folding.
I believe with 223 , I annealed last. .different brass different approach. Case forming definitely will test your patience.
I don,t know anything about bullberry forming dies, maybe Sherm will share a little more.

 

[L.Sherm]

Tell Bullberry what your necking down and they cut them for the correct size.

 

[L.Sherm]

I got mine years ago to make 17 Badger brass from 30 Carbine before Calhoon came out with his 19 Badger now I just buy his brass

 

[nilebartram]

I forgot to ask. When you change the 221 fireball to accommodate a .17 bullet are you changing the shoulder angle, etc? Also, I talked to Troy at Bullberry and he informed me, if I use a 17 FL die i did not have to buy his forming die. He did not sell me something I did not need, great customer service. nilebartram

 

[chuckshooter]

Nile here's the picture of the different steps, 223, 1st forming die, 2nd forming die, cut off, next should 221 fire ball die or what I have is a vartarg die with 238 bushing, vartarg die with 227 bushing.

 

[P1ZombieKiller]

chuckshooter -How many steps does it take to form 221 case from 223? I knew I would find better info here with you small bore shooters nilebartram

You're getting the same info as your other thread.
I am interested in seeing/learning from your process... please take notes and post your findings (both good and bad) on how you did.

 

[nilebartram]

I am taking in information and there are different opinions on the other threads. It is interesting to hear every ones thoughts on this subject . Still learning. Like how they made 6BR brass from a 308 case in the old days.. These older gentlemen really knew there stuff.. A real good elderly buddy of mine has a rapid increase in dementia and now all this info that he had to share is gone. A real shame, kinda like losing a good book in a fire. Wish these younger people would appreciate what these old guy have to offer, if only they would ask. I feel for his wife. nilebartram

 

[Hotshot]

You shouldn't have any trouble selling the 221 brass. Sell it and buy 17fb. If you lose a couple bucks in the transaction it's still cheaper than buying a bunch of dies.

 

[L.Sherm]

You shouldn't have any trouble selling the 221 brass. Sell it and buy 17fb. If you lose a couple bucks in the transaction it's still cheaper than buying a bunch of dies.

Thats true but if you have alot of wildcat cartridges or plan on it they sure come in handy (Forming dies) ive necked down or made thousands ive lost track how many

 

[chuckshooter]

case forming and wildcatting isn't for everyone, A man should know his own limitations. I, personally, love this stuff, forums like this one with people like Sherm have help me soooo much. information sharing has come a long way.

 

[JSH]

Wait till the cold sets in and boredom arrives. Then start necking stuff down just to see if you can.

 

[nilebartram]

that what I say. Do some old school case forming. 221 fireball case are hard to find and getting expensive. nilebartram

 

[Bill K]

Thought I would try here for information. I am trying to find the best way to resize a 221 fireball cartridge to accept a .17 bullet. I have 300 Lapua and remington brass to resize. I just found out you can buy 17 fireball. Please help. nilebartram

If you have a 221 bushing die. Just get a .236 bushing, run the 221FB into it, then put in a .177 bushing and run it into it. Then it is ready to final size in your standard 17FB die.