Need some help on .223 chambers...

[Fingi]

So my gun is at the smith but im second guessing my decision on going with a wylde chamber.

Gun is a 26 heavy varmint 7.7 twist paper puncher that wont see handloads for at least 3-4 years.

Initially I thought it was a good idea to have the gun chambered in .223 wylde since it was a sort of jack of all trades. Now, after much reading, i don't think its wise to have that big of a compromise.

LRI is doing the smith work on the bolt and they list a couple of .223 chambers... Link below

https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/1...AMBER_REAMER_INVENTORY.xls?661472180256288147

One im looking at is .223 rem match. Again, all i will shoot is commercial match ammo or regular .223 ammo, no 5.56. Handloading is out too so sadly no .223 AI for me but i need some guidance on this.

Should i stay the course with the wylde or a rem match is a better idea. Remember, for the next 3 years, commercial ammo only.

After that... Its on to handloading.

 

[Boyd L.]

So my gun is at the smith but im second guessing my decision on going with a wylde chamber.

Gun is a 26 heavy varmint 7.7 twist paper puncher that wont see handloads for at least 3-4 years.

Initially I thought it was a good idea to have the gun chambered in .223 wylde since it was a sort of jack of all trades. Now, after much reading, i don't think its wise to have that big of a compromise.

LRI is doing the smith work on the bolt and they list a couple of .223 chambers... Link below

https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/1...AMBER_REAMER_INVENTORY.xls?661472180256288147

One im looking at is .223 rem match. Again, all i will shoot is commercial match ammo or regular .223 ammo, no 5.56. Handloading is out too so sadly no .223 AI for me but i need some guidance on this.

Should i stay the course with the wylde or a rem match is a better idea. Remember, for the next 3 years, commercial ammo only.

After that... Its on to handloading.

With the restrictions you specify, I would go with the reamer design that is primarily for magazine length ammo that I felt best about (only you know that). If the .223 Match chamber is your huckleberry, that is the one I'd use IF you're certain your factory ammo restricted.

 

[USMCDOC]

I have always used the Wylde Chamber in my bolt guns.. been fabulous!

 

[Fingi]

With the restrictions you specify, I would go with the reamer design that is primarily for magazine length ammo that I felt best about (only you know that). If the .223 Match chamber is your huckleberry, that is the one I'd use IF you're certain your factory ammo restricted.

Yeah, commercial ammo only. Mostly 69gr smks and 77s Black hills is what i can get locally.

 

[Fingi]

BTW im assuming the rem match reamer specs i posted from the chart will allow for good fit of heavier commercial ammo up to magazine length limit.

Am i right?

 

[Twitchy]

BTW im assuming the rem match reamer specs i posted from the chart will allow for good fit of heavier commercial ammo up to magazine length limit.

Am i right?

If it's anything like my 223 Match Chamber, it will allow for seating 80g SMKs out to 2.5xx. Pretty long if you're only shooting mag length projos.

 

[Fingi]

Not sure about the TLO part...

Says -2.7860 for the rem match vs -2.3040 for the wylde???

 

[Texas Solo]

For factory ammo, I would stay away from the Wylde. I have one on my Shilem SM 1/7 barrel and don't like it....and I'm hand loading. I'm not concerned about mag length ammo for F/TR, so I load to the lands. Even with an 80gr bullet, I have very little bullet in the case neck. Not good for accuracy. Also, with factory ammo, your bullet jump will be huge.
I'm having my chamber re cut to 223Rem with a "slightly" longer throat to accept 80gr bullets.

 

[Fingi]

So the .223 rem match on the chart below will be ideal with the longer 77s i can seat on the AICS mag?

https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/1...AMBER_REAMER_INVENTORY.xls?661472180256288147

 

[mac86951]

My wylde chamber does just fine with mag length ammo, and leaves me the opportunity to use 5.56 ammo as it's cheap. Also gives me the freebore for 80s for long range.

Is it BR groups at 100-200y with factory? Nope, but sub MOA isn't BR quality, nor is anyone competing with factory 223 ammo that I know of.

YMMV

-Mac

 

[CharlieNC]

I would ask LRI for a recommendation and their rationale, as they do this for a living and have an excellent reputation.

 

[Boyd L.]

I would ask LRI for a recommendation and their rationale, as they do this for a living and have an excellent reputation.

Best advice so far. You're writing them a check. You're entitled to their impressions.

 

[Ned Ludd]

I have a GAP .223 bolt gun with a 26" barrel where the chamber was cut with the reamer in the print below. It has zero freebore (that's right, "zero"). This rifle has been an absolute laser with FGMM77s and I've shot many the 0.25 to 0.30 MOA 5-shot groups with the rifle and that ammo. I have developed a load for it with the 80.5 gr Fullbore that also shoots exceptionally well. As you might imagine, the 80.5 gr bullet is sunk farther down in the case than would be considered optimal, but it still works very well. My point is that with commercial ammo, you will only be able to test a variety of available loads until you hit on one that shoots well. That is the best you can do if you're not rolling your own, and there is always a certain amount of "luck" to finding just the right commercial ammo load. You will have to use that approach, regardless of which chamber you select. So I wouldn't agonize too much over the decision. There are an awful lot of folks that have been very satisfied shooting commercial loads out of a Wylde chamber. The freebore in a Wylde isn't so long as to force the majority of med/heavy bullets in factory loads to jump a country mile. If I had to make the choice myself of the three reamers listed, that is probably where I would go. Given my experience with the chamber cut by the reamer below, my 2nd choice would probably be the one with .040" freebore. Either one should get you where you want to be. The advantage of the .223 Match reamer listed would be largely lost if you aren't going to load your own for quite some time.

 

[ND shooter]

I have a GAP .223 bolt gun with a 26" barrel where the chamber was cut with the reamer in the print below. It has zero freebore (that's right, "zero"). This rifle has been an absolute laser with FGMM77s and I've shot many the 0.25 to 0.30 MOA 5-shot groups with the rifle and that ammo. I have developed a load for it with the 80.5 gr Fullbore that also shoots exceptionally well. As you might imagine, the 80.5 gr bullet is sunk farther down in the case than would be considered optimal, but it still works very well. My point is that with commercial ammo, you will only be able to test a variety of available loads until you hit on one that shoots well. That is the best you can do if you're not rolling your own, and there is always a certain amount of "luck" to finding just the right commercial ammo load. You will have to use that approach, regardless of which chamber you select. So I wouldn't agonize too much over the decision. There are an awful lot of folks that have been very satisfied shooting commercial loads out of a Wylde chamber. The freebore in a Wylde isn't so long as to force the majority of med/heavy bullets in factory loads to jump a country mile. If I had to make the choice myself of the three reamers listed, that is probably where I would go. Given my experience with the chamber cut by the reamer below, my 2nd choice would probably be the one with .040" freebore. Either one should get you where you want to be. The advantage of the .223 Match reamer listed would be largely lost if you aren't going to load your own for quite some time.

Sound advice IMO

 

[Fingi]

I have a GAP .223 bolt gun with a 26" barrel where the chamber was cut with the reamer in the print below. It has zero freebore (that's right, "zero"). This rifle has been an absolute laser with FGMM77s and I've shot many the 0.25 to 0.30 MOA 5-shot groups with the rifle and that ammo. I have developed a load for it with the 80.5 gr Fullbore that also shoots exceptionally well. As you might imagine, the 80.5 gr bullet is sunk farther down in the case than would be considered optimal, but it still works very well. My point is that with commercial ammo, you will only be able to test a variety of available loads until you hit on one that shoots well. That is the best you can do if you're not rolling your own, and there is always a certain amount of "luck" to finding just the right commercial ammo load. You will have to use that approach, regardless of which chamber you select. So I wouldn't agonize too much over the decision. There are an awful lot of folks that have been very satisfied shooting commercial loads out of a Wylde chamber. The freebore in a Wylde isn't so long as to force the majority of med/heavy bullets in factory loads to jump a country mile. If I had to make the choice myself of the three reamers listed, that is probably where I would go. Given my experience with the chamber cut by the reamer below, my 2nd choice would probably be the one with .040" freebore. Either one should get you where you want to be. The advantage of the .223 Match reamer listed would be largely lost if you aren't going to load your own for quite some time.

Still, if fireforming the match commercial loads i have available yield acceptable accuraccy out of the AI chamber, id be willing to give it a go while i begin my loading journey.

I can live with that decrease in accuraccy as long as its not much.

As far as barrel life...

Will i shorten the barrel life by much from basically shooting fireforming all the time for 3 ish years.

Point is mute if by the time i begin loading i have to rebarrel...

 

[Ned Ludd]

Chances are good that the best precision you can get with any commercial ammunition isn't even going to be in the same league as your handloads. There are a number of reasons for that...better bullet choice and every single parameter from powder to primers to seating depth is optimized for your exact setup. Commercial ammunition usually can't compete with that. By testing a sufficient number of commercial ammo preps, it is often possible to find one that shoots reasonably well out of a given rifle. Sometimes it's even possible to find one that shoots extremely well, but that's a little less common.

Per your most recent post above - I'm not really sure what you're talking about. First - now you're talking about fire forming and an AI chamber...where did that come from? That's a totally different animal than what you asked about originally. Second - shooting commercial ammo out of a .223 Rem chamber is not really what I would call fireforming, it's just shooting, which is, after all, what you want to do with the rifle. Fireforming is the process of expanding brass by firing it to better match the characteristics of your chamber. It suggests you intend to use that particular brass again for reloads. If good precision is your intended goal for reloading, I would strongly recommend you consider buying virgin brass (all from the same lot) from a reputable manufacturer, when you get around to rolling your own. Using a hodgepodge of brass from different lots and/or manufacturers, which is what you will likely end up with from shooting commercial ammo, is not where you want to be for precision handloads. Further, there are definitely ways to prepare virgin brass so that you're not simply putting rounds through the barrel. I have shot loads in virgin brass in my .223s in local F-Class competitions on a number of occasions and done very well. I wouldn't call these "wasted" shots.

My suggestion would be to get the rifle, shoot it, and enjoy it. You can worry about reloading later, especially if you can define your exact needs a little better than they seem to be right now. Barrels are expendable items...eventually they have to be replaced. If you have the tools to swap out barrels, you can keep the worn-out barrel to fireform brass. However, I wouldn't worry about that too much in a .223. Just shoot it and enjoy yourself.

 

[Fingi]

Ok let me just make a pause and thank Gstaylorg because its not the first time ive posted a question here and each time the man goes out of his way to answer with facts.

Now back to the topic.

Not reloading yet and emphasizing the YET. The idea behind getting the .223AI is that if im not loosing much accuracy running commercial Match loads (given i find one the rifle likes) and i dont kill my barrel life in 3 years of shooting twice a month (which a doubt cuz of the caliber, the frequency and the way ill shoot this one) ill end up with brass ready to be prepped if im careful not to mix up all my brass.

I get that is not an ideal component of a match handload, using commercial load brass to learn the skill. But is still better than going out and getting a lot of expensive lapua brass to learn... Correct me if wrong.

Ive been suggested multiple times tge .223 AI for the already mentioned well known benefits of the improved load as far as speeds. Now I can go with a match .223 or regular .223 and call it a day since im not loading yet.

And im not set on the AI either...

But if what i lose in accuraccy with the AI I would lose anyway from not handloading on a match or regular .223, then having brass to prep in stocks for when i start to load its worth the try i would say.

I have to call LRI with my answer preferably by tomorrow.

Your thoughts.

 

[Sigfla]

Following. I just bought a Savage .204R and will eventually rebarrel to an 8 twist .223 for a switch barrel setup. I have just got all my handloading gear and will load primarily for my other .204's and .243 first but will likely also load heavier 75 grain Amax's in the .223 eventually for low volume Ohio groundhog shoots. I want a chamber that lets me shoot factory ammo so I can drop ship .223 when going on trips but I don't want to hinder my ability to handload the 75's. It has been suggested I go with the Wylde chamber as well.

 

[Ned Ludd]

FWIW - an AI chamber is only a small increase in velocity and performance with handloads. An increase to be sure, but certainly not what I would consider a quantum leap. My thought is that you are unlikely to see any advantage whatsoever shooting commercial loads out of an AI chamber. In fact, it may even be detrimental to precision using commercial loads. Because barrel replacement is an eventuality, combined with the fact that having that chamber won't be an advantage until you start to reload, why worry about it now? If you plan to begin reloading in a couple or three years, worry about it then. You could easily put 3000-5000 rounds through the barrel in that amount of time, then replace it with an AI chamber whenever you're actually ready to start reloading. I understand that barrels cost money. But in the grand scheme of things, barrel replacement is a very small expenditure when compared to the cost of the rifle/scope/etc., as well as 2-3 years' worth of commercial ammunition.

 

[Fingi]

FWIW - an AI chamber is only a small increase in velocity and performance with handloads. An increase to be sure, but certainly not what I would consider a quantum leap. My thought is that you are unlikely to see any advantage whatsoever shooting commercial loads out of an AI chamber. In fact, it may even be detrimental to precision using commercial loads. Because barrel replacement is an eventuality, combined with the fact that having that chamber won't be an advantage until you start to reload, why worry about it now? If you plan to begin reloading in a couple or three years, worry about it then. You could easily put 3000-5000 rounds through the barrel in that amount of time, then replace it with an AI chamber whenever you're actually ready to start reloading. I understand that barrels cost money. But in the grand scheme of things, barrel replacement is a very small expenditure when compared to the cost of the rifle/scope/etc., as well as 2-3 years' worth of commercial ammunition.

Makes sense to me. I just emailed them to drop the AI chamber and go ahead with a remington match finished to 26" Heavy varmint.

Now the hunt for quality ammo begins hehe