Need sights soldered to rifle.

[DHall_37]

Howdy, I have recently purchased a custom Carcano rebarreled to 7.62x39. The original owner tried to epoxy the sights on with out much luck. Could any of y’all help me out or tell me where to send it too? I’m not sure if my local guy will try such a project, but I’ll ask on Tuesday.

I also have a torch, flux and silver solder, just never used it and I don’t want to have the sights off center. Any advice is much appreciated.

PS: Thanks everyone for recommending me a smith for my custom Mauser project as well.

 

[pintopete]

BROWNELLS HI-FORCE 44™ SOLDER | Brownells

Brownells Hi-Force 44 Solder is an alloy solder containing 4% silver and 96% tin. Excellent for steel, stainless steel, nickel, brass and copper. Completely non-toxic. Flows free and smooth at about 475° F., greatly reducing heating time. No need ...

www.brownells.com

I’ve never soldered them on, but this is the solder that others recommend.

 

[Gargoyle]

Post some pics of the sights.

 

[DHall_37]

Post some pics of the sights.

I haven’t received the rifle yet, here is a picture the seller sent me.

 

[DHall_37]

BROWNELLS HI-FORCE 44™ SOLDER | Brownells

Brownells Hi-Force 44 Solder is an alloy solder containing 4% silver and 96% tin. Excellent for steel, stainless steel, nickel, brass and copper. Completely non-toxic. Flows free and smooth at about 475° F., greatly reducing heating time. No need ...

www.brownells.com

I’ve never soldered them on, but this is the solder that others recommend.

Thanks, I’ll save that link.

 

[Gargoyle]

I don't understand why you wouldn't want a shallow terminating tap into the barrel with 8-40 screws.

 

[DHall_37]

I don't understand why you wouldn't want a shallow terminating tap into the barrel with 8-40 screws.

I’ve also thought that too, I just don’t have a press or anything for that operation.

 

[tobnpr]

Best to use a jig like the one from Forster to do it absent a mill where you can find 12:00 accurately.
You can also rent a Williams drilling jig from 4D Rentals (Williams has discontinued this item far as I know) and use that:

Williams Scope Mount Drilling Fixture - 4D Reamer Rentals

Easily Drill and Tap your action for scope mounts. fits receivers from .630” to 1.440”

4drentals.com

Sights will need to be fitted to the barrel contour, wrap sandcloth around the barrel where they will be mounted (rough side up ) then slide the mount back and forth over it so that it conforms to the contour.
Use a fine thread from center of rear tang, through center of the rear sight to locate the front sight.

There's DIY videos online, pretty sure Midway and Brownells have them.

 

[DHall_37]

Best to use a jig like the one from Forster to do it absent a mill where you can find 12:00 accurately.
You can also rent a Williams drilling jig from 4D Rentals (Williams has discontinued this item far as I know) and use that:

Williams Scope Mount Drilling Fixture - 4D Reamer Rentals

Easily Drill and Tap your action for scope mounts. fits receivers from .630” to 1.440”

4drentals.com

Sights will need to be fitted to the barrel contour, wrap sandcloth around the barrel where they will be mounted (rough side up ) then slide the mount back and forth over it so that it conforms to the contour.
Use a fine thread from center of rear tang, through center of the rear sight to locate the front sight.

There's DIY videos online, pretty sure Midway and Brownells have them.

I just practiced soldering on some old bolts, it seems pretty straight forward. I definitely need to practice more though.

 

[shortgrass]

I don't understand why you wouldn't want a shallow terminating tap into the barrel with 8-40 screws.

Some barrels are just too small in diameter to drill and tap. Most that are screw-on use 6-48s, not 8-40s. Soldering makes for a 'clean' installation, no visible screw heads, and , it's secure. Many solder-on front sight bases have a locator hole in the center of the dovetail, where it won't be seen when the site is installed. Center of the barrel is located and very shallow 'locating' hole is drilled. The sight base is 'fluxed and then tinned'. It's difficult to 'tin' the barrel, so I have been fluxing it, lay a few pieces of the ribbon on it. The sight base is placed on the barrel using the 'locating hole' to center, and securing it into position with a spring loaded jig that applies downward pressure. Wipe away any flux that won't be under the base, and put the heat to it until you see the solder flow. Any solder that might flow from under the sight base can quickly be wiped away with a damp rag while it's still hot. Let it all cool naturally. I have been using the ribbon type Hi-Force 44 and regular 'plumbers' solder works real well. I've never had much luck with Brownells "Comet" flux. Harris makes some good flux for soldering, too. The heating/flowing solder should happen quickly so the heat doesn't have time to 'travel". A wet rag can be wrapped around the barrel behind where the sight will be placed. It doesn't take oxy/acetylene heat to melt the Hi-Force 44, but that is what I use because it works quickly, using an 0 sized tip.

 

[DHall_37]

Some barrels are just too small in diameter to drill and tap. Most that are screw-on use 6-48s, not 8-40s. Soldering makes for a 'clean' installation, no visible screw heads, and , it's secure. Many solder-on front sight bases have a locator hole in the center of the dovetail, where it won't be seen when the site is installed. Center of the barrel is located and very shallow 'locating' hole is drilled. The sight base is 'fluxed and then tinned'. It's difficult to 'tin' the barrel, so I have been fluxing it, lay a few pieces of the ribbon on it. The sight base is placed on the barrel using the 'locating hole' to center, and securing it into position with a spring loaded jig that applies downward pressure. Wipe away any flux that won't be under the base, and put the heat to it until you see the solder flow. Any solder that might flow from under the sight base can quickly be wiped away with a damp rag while it's still hot. Let it all cool naturally. I have been using the ribbon type Hi-Force 44 and regular 'plumbers' solder works real well. I've never had much luck with Brownells "Comet" flux. Harris makes some good flux for soldering, too. The heating/flowing solder should happen quickly so the heat doesn't have time to 'travel". A wet rag can be wrapped around the barrel behind where the sight will be placed. It doesn't take oxy/acetylene heat to melt the Hi-Force 44, but that is what I use because it works quickly, using an 0 sized tip.

I saw a Midway video that is pretty much exactly like how you described. So soldering will be enough? It doesn’t need screws too?

 

[Minshooter]

Drill and tap, or soldering is definitely the way to go for max strength.
True silver soldering takes a lot more heat and finesse. HF44 works pretty well, with less heat.
But, for a little casual shooting with my own guns,
I've installed similar sights (And scope rails -on .22 rimfire only) with loctite Black Max 380 adhesive.
It is really strong, and is also used to fasten ribs on shotguns.
The tiny 3g tube will easily do those two sights.
Not usually found at the home stores, but you can find it easily at Midway, Brownells, etc., or with a search.
If you decide to solder, wipe pencil graphite along the sides of the sights, and have the assembly upside down. That way, any flux or solder will run down off the sight, which is a lot easier to clean up than the rifle.

 

[DHall_37]

Drill and tap, or soldering is definitely the way to go for max strength.
True silver soldering takes a lot more heat and finesse. HF44 works pretty well, with less heat.
But, for a little casual shooting with my own guns,
I've installed similar sights (And scope rails -on .22 rimfire only) with loctite Black Max 380 adhesive.
It is really strong, and is also used to fasten ribs on shotguns.
The tiny 3g tube will easily do those two sights.
Not usually found at the home stores, but you can find it easily at Midway, Brownells, etc., or with a search.
If you decide to solder, wipe pencil graphite along the sides of the sights, and have the assembly upside down. That way, any flux or solder will run down off the sight, which is a lot easier to clean up than the rifle.

Thanks. I’m pretty sure epoxy won’t work on 7.62x39, atleast it didn’t for the first owner.

 

[shortgrass]

I saw a Midway video that is pretty much exactly like how you described. So soldering will be enough? It doesn’t need screws too?

Solder will hold barrel bands for slings, it'll hold sights on, too. Soft solder holds the ribs, and as such, the barrels together on SxS shotguns and double rifles. Clean the areas to be soldered with acetone before flux and tinning. If the barrel surface is really smooth I may ruff it up just a little with a finger nail file. Solder joints are adhesion. Hi-Force 44 is more than soft solder. Most silver solders takes too much heat. I solder on more barrel bands than sights, and I don't do that all that often, so I haven't looked for another silver bearing solder that doesn't use more heat than I feel is "good" for barrel steel. If there's enough "meat" in the barrel, I'll use a 6-48 screw in place of the locator hole. But there has to be enough barrel wall to do that. The method I described in my 1st post is almost exactly as I was taught in GS school 30yrs+ ago. I didn't just pull it out of my butt by watching UT videos.

 

[tobnpr]

Flux will ruin bluing.
Make sure to mask the barrel well outside the lines before applying flux.
I use Stay-Clean liquid flux with the Hi-Force solder.

 

[Minshooter]

Thanks. I’m pretty sure epoxy won’t work on 7.62x39, atleast it didn’t for the first owner.

You should absolutely solder, if possible. As in all methods, surface prep makes all the difference in hold.
The BM380 isn't an epoxy, and is very strong, but I should have clarified suggesting it -only as an alternative,
if you didn't want to try soldering.

 

[tobnpr]

Honestly, IMO there are epoxies which would be satisfactory for this application.
The caveat is heat, and the rear sight is in the hottest zone near/over the throat.

I tend to think that soldering is just one of those "things" that was the only means of attachment back in the day- and we tend to stick with that despite availability of modern adhesives lest we be accused of being a "hack"

 

[WSnyder]

The BM380 isn't an epoxy, and is very strong

I'll second the Black Max. Very strong and useful in a lot of situations. I too would soft solder first but wouldn't be opposed to using Black Max if I couldn't solder.

 

[DHall_37]

I'll second the Black Max. Very strong and useful in a lot of situations. I too would soft solder first but wouldn't be opposed to using Black Max if I couldn't solder.

Alrighty, I think I’ll see the gun smith tomorrow and ask if he can solder them. If not I might have to go with Black Max, I’d rather not though.

 

[shortgrass]

If there's enough wall thickness in that barrel I'd use a Marbles screw-on front ramp and forget about soldering. I mean, after all, it's a Carcano.