MIL vs. MOA

[CharlieNC]

A bit of a tangent, but the typical graduations of moa being fractions, and mil being tenths, is another example of the illogical imperial system vs metric which offers simpler math and units of measure.

 

[stevenpoplin]

LOL yes moondog it's just you. were using angular measuring system in a linear way some what. A minute of angle is one sixtyth of a degree, and a half a minute is thirty seconds of a degree, in civil engineering terms. Soooo within the scope (pun intended) of what we'er measureing mils and tenths can be easier for the beginer to understand, but coarser than minutes and eighths. But thenths of a mil work out to be a finer measurement in a subtention of a scope than one half of a minute. Eighth of a minute subtesions would just be too small. So next time your spotting for the guy that shoots mils and refuses to call your shots in moa, start call in his shots in seconds, and get ready to run. Whatever you do have fun doing it, its not like the targets are going to shoot back

 

[stevenpoplin]

and another thing. If your going to use a mil/mil scope are you going to still use degrees to adjust your point of aim uphill or downhill, or are you going to use mils?

 

[Rob01]

I'd use a ACI or slope doper. They work well. Or if you have a mildot master they have the ability to adjust and give you the corrected range as well.

 

[stevenpoplin]

what about adjusting for corialis for ELR. degrees or radian?

 

[Rob01]

That is corrected in the ballistic program in the unit you are using so would be mils or moa. Just like wind.

 

[Gargoyle]

KISS. MRAD. 10s system.

Yards X .36 gives inches movement per .1mil click.

 

[Gargoyle]

what about adjusting for corialis for ELR. degrees or radian?

Let 4 DOF calculate it.

 

[highplainsdrifter]

I keep mulling this over and have started to watch some YouTube videos. I'm 76 and have always had MOA scopes. Having recently beaten the Coronavirus and an almost life-ending kidney infection, (I only have one kidney) I'm starting to feel froggy and thinking about getting a MIL scope. If you are shooting MOA how hard would you think it would be to go MIL?

Haven't heard "feelin' froggy" since the Airborne! I transitioned from MOA to MIL about 5 years ago. No problem with it. Simply another basis to begin your calculations. 1/10 mil at 100 y = .36" as opposed to 1/4 MOA at 100 y = .25 ". If I could do that then at age 67, you can handle it at 76! So, froggy, jump up!

 

[Bc'z]

Haven't heard "feelin' froggy" since the Airborne! I transitioned from MOA to MIL about 5 years ago. No problem with it. Simply another basis to begin your calculations. 1/10 mil at 100 y = .36" as opposed to 1/4 MOA at 100 y = .25 ". If I could do that then at age 67, you can handle it at 76! So, froggy, jump up!

So basically your telling me there's
360° to a circle?
Who'd a thunk it?

 

[Ray123]

I keep mulling this over and have started to watch some YouTube videos. I'm 76 and have always had MOA scopes. Having recently beaten the Coronavirus and an almost life-ending kidney infection, (I only have one kidney) I'm starting to feel froggy and thinking about getting a MIL scope. If you are shooting MOA how hard would you think it would be to go MIL?

I started many years ago with mil dot scope and MOA turrents, so ya had to convert mils to MOA, on the fly...everything in learning is doing, repetitive use. So I use both MOA and Mil scopes...they are lots easier today when the reticle matches the turrent graduations. I use both, but find the less cluttered mil lines leave more room to spot impacts as I don't use a spotter, and dial turrents. Mil scopes are what's on my serious rifles, but it's all up to you, both work, your choice, and what your comfortable with.

 

[Dgd6mm]

I keep mulling this over and have started to watch some YouTube videos. I'm 76 and have always had MOA scopes. Having recently beaten the Coronavirus and an almost life-ending kidney infection, (I only have one kidney) I'm starting to feel froggy and thinking about getting a MIL scope. If you are shooting MOA how hard would you think it would be to go MIL?

It will not be hard at all. Think of it as a bit of a challenge, I'm confident you'll master it. Check out the Arken EP5 5-25x56. You get a lot of good scope for the money and a company that stands behind their products.

 

[Clark]

I am 70 with one kidney, and own mil dot scopes, but never use them.
I am an MOA man.
I modified a Leupold Zero Point to use a white LED, a resistor, and an AAA battery.

 

[demarpaint1]

After doing a search I dug this thread up. I'm looking for a long range target scope to shoot off a bench or bi-pod out to 1K, possibly a mile. I'm thinking an MOA scope with 1/8 adjustments is still the way to go. Has anything changed about that school of thought in the past three years since this thread was posted? I'm seeing some say MIL is easier to use etc., but imo the adjustments are too coarse for what I want to do.

 

[Rob01]

After doing a search I dug this thread up. I'm looking for a long range target scope to shoot off a bench or bi-pod out to 1K, possibly a mile. I'm thinking an MOA scope with 1/8 adjustments is still the way to go. Has anything changed about that school of thought in the past three years since this thread was posted? I'm seeing some say MIL is easier to use etc., but imo the adjustments are too coarse for what I want to do.

What do you want to do? Many people shoot 1000 and a mile and farther with mil scopes. What exactly do you think the issue will be in what you plan to do that will make you different?

Also to shoot where you want you need elevation and most of the 1/8 moa scopes have limited elevation. You might make a 1000 but a mile will be tougher.

 

[demarpaint1]

What do you want to do? Many people shoot 1000 and a mile and farther with mil scopes. What exactly do you think the issue will be in what you plan to do that will make you different?

Also to shoot where you want you need elevation and most of the 1/8 moa scopes have limited elevation. You might make a 1000 but a mile will be tougher.

Thanks for the reply. I'm not planning to make me different I'm seeking advise from guys with a lot more experience than I have. The goal is to shoot beyond 1K. I've shot 1K quite a few times. What's hanging me up is all the reading I've done suggests that the finer adjustment MOA scopes make for more precise adjustments for lets say shooting a clay pigeon at 1K. I'm wondering if the finer adjustments would help someone a little less skilled?

I also read a lot of positive things about MIL including what you stated about elevation, and people successful at long distances with them. I figured with a 40 MOA rail and if needed the Burris rings with the inserts I could make up for some of the lack of elevation adjustment. IIRC the F-Class and BR shooters for the most part still use MOA, but what I've been reading is threads like this which are three years old or older.

I could be all wrong too. Thanks again for the reply.

 

[Rob01]

Thanks for the reply. I'm not planning to make me different I'm seeking advise from guys with a lot more experience than I have. The goal is to shoot beyond 1K. I've shot 1K quite a few times. What's hanging me up is all the reading I've done suggests that the finer adjustment MOA scopes make for more precise adjustments for lets say shooting a clay pigeon at 1K. I'm wondering if the finer adjustments would help someone a little less skilled?

I also read a lot of positive things about MIL including what you stated about elevation, and people successful at long distances with them. I figured with a 40 MOA rail and if needed the Burris rings with the inserts I could make up for some of the lack of elevation adjustment. IIRC the F-Class and BR shooters for the most part still use MOA, but what I've been reading is threads like this which are three years old or older.

I could be all wrong too. Thanks again for the reply.

No the F Class and BR guys still use moa but that’s because it’s what their games need. That does not make it better for your casual shooting at distance. As I said you need to look at the scope elevation as well to make sure you have enough. That is what will effect you more if you can’t even dial to where you want to go.

If you can find a 1/8 moa scopes with 100+ moa of elevation then go that route if you like but I can tell you from experience that a mil scope will not hold you back either. I have shot on moa and smaller sized targets out to 2500 yards with a mil scope. Hit a 12” plate at a mile 2 out of three times with the miss being just off at 3 o’clock due to wind, which will effect you much more at those distances than moa or mil.

Again make sure you have enough elevation in any scope you plan to buy. A scope with 50 moa will only have 50 moa no matter how much you put in the base or rings so if you wanted to put enough in to zero at 1000 then you will have 50 moa to go farther and the drop adds up quicker the farther out you go. What caliber do you plan to use?

 

[demarpaint1]

No the F Class and BR guys still use moa but that’s because it’s what their games need. That does not make it better for your casual shooting at distance. As I said you need to look at the scope elevation as well to make sure you have enough. That is what will effect you more if you can’t even dial to where you want to go.

If you can find a 1/8 moa scopes with 100+ moa of elevation then go that route if you like but I can tell you from experience that a mil scope will not hold you back either. I have shot on moa and smaller sized targets out to 2500 yards with a mil scope. Hit a 12” plate at a mile 2 out of three times with the miss being just off at 3 o’clock due to wind, which will effect you much more at those distances than moa or mil.

Again make sure you have enough elevation in any scope you plan to buy. A scope with 50 moa will only have 50 moa no matter how much you put in the base or rings so if you wanted to put enough in to zero at 1000 then you will have 50 moa to go farther and the drop adds up quicker the farther out you go. What caliber do you plan to use?

Thanks for the reply. This is exactly the type of info I was hoping for! The caliber is a 7PRC which is currently in the works.

 

[Rob01]

I was using a 7mmRM at that mile shot so I know the 7PRC will get there no problem. I was also using a mil scope. I had dialed about 20 mils from my 100 yard zero which is about 72 moa for your reference.

 

[demarpaint1]

I was using a 7mmRM at that mile shot so I know the 7PRC will get there no problem. I was also using a mil scope. I had dialed about 20 mils from my 100 yard zero which is about 72 moa for your reference.

What scope did you use?