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Lighter Bullets and an Exit Hole

CaptainMal

Silver $$ Contributor
50+ years of big game shooting and I'm still learning things. Cartridges like a 270 Winchester with 140 gr. hunting bullets have 1,000 ft. lbs of energy at 700 yards, plow through and leave an exit hole. Now you probably have a blood trail to follow if needed.

Killed lots of deer with 6mm and 25 cal cartridges BUT all but one under 200 yards using tough-jacket bullets. Rarely get an exit hole unless using partition bullets. Rarely care as the animals usually go down from the shock. NOT so this year.

Tried to use 100gr. Nosler Ballistic Tips at 2,900 fps this year. Great shooting but only 1,000 ft. lbs of energy at 350 yards or so. Shot a doe at 400 yards. Shoulder hit knocked it down, gets up, goes, no blood, no hair, no deer.

Shot what looked like an 8 pt at 286 yards behind the shoulder. Jump and run reaction with no hair, no blood, no deer. No evidence of a hit. I hit. Even set up a little medicine bottle at 300 yards and smashed it to smithereens.

Did kill that 14 pt. but less than 100 yards. No exit holes and no blood but dead deer.

I say NEVER use 243/257 cartridges at ranges past 300 yards. There's no energy. Forget those 100gr. Nosler BT's. I'm going to now start trying 115 - 120 gr. Sierra/Hornady bullets to get a load and use in the future. An exit hole is important if the animal is not shocked down at the shot.

Live and learn. It's nice to be alive.
 
If you want more "shock" then go with barnes ttsx and go as light as possible. You'll get an exit from just about any angle.
 
Have you by chance given the 115 Berger VLD a try ??
The goat I popped last year with them out of my 16" 25/284 XP trashed the off shoulder at 311 yards, and I never found the bullet, but he was easy to find...
 
No. Have not tried Barnes or Berger bullets on game. Most always used Nosler Partition, Hornady Interlock, Sierra GameKing or Speer Spitzer's. Usually seriously hunt with 30-30, 30-06, 338, 375, and 270. Always been 6MM and 257/25-06's for that "extra" deer or just varmints. Only Bergers I currently use are 77 gr. ones I use in the 22-250 Ackley for "dogs". Expensive buggers but shoot sooooooooo good.

Will use a better-constructed bullet for the "little" guns in the future. Thanks for the advice on bullets with tough construction. If others read this and also learn, we are all the better for it.
 
Captain
I agree with you on the exit hole and blood trail. Like you, I've been hunting many years (65+) and have had my share of hits and misses. The smallest caliber I have used on deer is .257 and have settled on the Barnes TSX-TTSX.
It almost always exits and leaves a large exit wound with a good blood trail. I have seen a 130 gr Nosler Part. from a .270 Wby (3300fps) go through both lungs on a broadside doe shot at 25yds. Just before dark, the deer ran about 75yds. with no blood trail. Found her the next morning. The other thing my club has done is to get a good trailing dog that is worth its weight in gold. We shoot a lot of deer just befor dark and we have now found them all in a few minutes. No more searching for an hour with lights and coming up empty.
Personally, I think a 6.5x55, 7mm-08, or 7mmx57 loaded with Barnes bullets is much better than the smaller calibers. Much better penetration and blood trail, still a light rifle, not much recoil. No matter what you use, a dog is a great asset. One of your friends should have one. Give it a try.
Bill
 
Sorry to hear about the lost dear. That is a real shame. Since I'm a smaller fellow, I've always like lighter recoil guns and thats all I've really ever used for deer here in PA, but like you said before the ranges that I've shot the deer have been close. I'm still kinda surprised that it didn't have enough a$$ for you though. I shoot a .243 AI for hogs and deer and the 80 gr BT's really seem to have some power behind them even out there a good ways.

On this link at 1:30 is a hog I shot off a log that just supermans his way to the ground. But this load is throwing the the BT's around 3450.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2XFEOtcvd7k
 
Never had a problem with the little 6mm Rem to 300, or the .25-06 to an honest 400 yards. Mostly 95 gr Nosler Ballistic Tips from the 6, and Berger 115 gr VLD's or 100 gr Barnes TSX from the .25-06 rifle. The VLD typically hasn't exited, but it didn't need to either, three mule deer I've taken with that bullet just dropped on impact. As an alternative, the little Barnes 100 grainer is one tough bullet and tends to exit.

The rifle I normally grab for deer hunting; a factory built Rem 700 CDL in .25-06, with a 6x Leupld, shooting 115 gr Berger VLD's sighted in at 300 yards. It seems to work out real well for me:
1e1841e8.jpg


Regards, Guy
 
LOVE the information and stories. Did kill a doe at appx. 150 yards last year with the 25-06 using 115 Nosler Ballistic Tips. One shot and flip-over/down reaction. NO exit their either. I AM paying attention to your bullet recommendations.

Dogs...I have a story.

Fellow illegally baited deer in Georgia for years. Rarely killed. It's legal to bait now but not two years ago. One day he shot a HUGE buck, or so he said. Could not find it. Came in and demanded a guy contract with him to use a "deer dog". Called the dog's owner and 50 miles later that dog was transported to his hunting property.

The dog made a perfect 50 yard circle and returned. They moved out to where it surely was hit. 50 yard circle and returned. The guy had MISSED.

He paid the dog owner the contracted $250 and sure was mad at the whole thing. It was pay that man or get beat up. The rest of us had bloody inside lips from biting to stop laughing. I still think it's funny.
 
This is my experience from small calibers that I only shot for years. In the 25-06, the 115 Ballistic tips are superb. In the 243, 95 gr Ballistic tips were super accurate & totally lacking in blood trail & in my opinion just plain killing power (sure to rile a few) We went to the Barnes 85 gr TTSX & problems ended. Small stuff is really all about the bullet & the bullet needs to be all copper. I've since killed a BUNCH with a AR & 62 gr Barnes. Only 1 took a step & he was easy to trail. Massive blood loss.
 
That is a great story about the dog. The hunter got what he deserved. One of our members has his own dog so it is gratis to us. We do give him $200 a year to help with food. We put him on a leash and start where we think the hit occured. If the is any blood, it takes no time at all. If there is no blood and a lot of frest deer sign, it takes a little longer to sort it out, but the scent of the deer leads him to it after several circles.
Like many of the other posts, I have found Barnes TSX-TTSX bullets the most effective in all calibers.
Good hunting.
Bill
 
no expert but shot placement is very important. i use 55grnrs in my .22-250 no problems, no exit either. they do not always fall where they stood but the do not go far. if the gun is on and you are sure you hit the animal it has got to be close. now as far as the deer shot in the shoulder, that is probly in all honesty a non lethal hit, those animals are very tough. just my thoughts, like i said i am no expert but have had some experience with no exit holes and small bullets.
 
Not defensive but be sure of one thing. Those deer were extensively looked for.

First thing I do/did is mark the hit area with paper. Then start looking straight, in a fan and then circles. I carry a small heat-sensor that has found dead deer before. Used it and nothing. Couple hours later, both times, I called for help. Friends came and it was another couple hours and distances fanned a solid 1/4 mile or more with extensive looking.

Nothing. I mean nothing.

Not sure about the buck hit. Find it implausable I missed but this was a slow stepping, no motion pattern deer, just under 300 yards. I about passed it when it paused, moved, paused and then moved as I shot. Still see the crosshair behind it's shoulder as the shot went off. Also sensed the deer movement during recoil so ...

Sleep good. Man I wish I was perfect. Better bullets here I come. Thanks again.

Another thing. I passed up 16 large-racked bucks this year. Most always the pass was because I did not like the shot as presented. And NO! You will not be the first to ask. YOU cannot hunt my property.
 
Still the best rifle/bullet combination that I've used on deer is the 243 with an 85gr HPBT. Never had to blood trail the first one and have shot em as far at just short of 300yds.

Definately agree that shot placement is key, but that is the way it should be. One shouldn't take a half a$$ed shot on a hog or a deer with about anything. We (gun hunters) should have the same patience that a good bow hunter has.... wait for the good shot or don't take it. IMHO

Have used 30-06, 6-5-06, and blood trailed quite a few 30-30's, 270's, 280's & 7mm Mags. Still the 85gr HPBT is the most consistent for on the spot kills. Just my experience with em. :) WD
 
One of the things I like most about this board is the generally sane and reasonable expressions of opinion. Most of the posters appear to be experienced hunters, freely exchanging information about what has worked, and not worked in their experience.

It's easy to forget that posters to the board may be from anywhere in the nation, or anywhere in the world for that matter. We live and hunt in different areas, under different conditions - and of course we have different levels of skill as well. We will most assuredly have had different experiences, giving rise to differing opinions on what does and does not work.

I like it. Have learned a tremendous amount about hunting other areas from reading books, magazines, and in more recent years, reading what others have posted on this and other forums.

Regards, Guy
 
hey captainmal, i apologize if i came across as rude i was not meaning to but that is no reason not to let me hunt on your property , crap i thought we were all somewhat of friends on here. seriuosly though, was not trying to be rude, deer have been hit and lost with just about every caliber used i would bet, and if you have never shot and lost a deer then just wait your day is coming. i will say though i have not lost 1 with the 250 but i did with the 270, it really was bad shot placement, hit him to far forward and mainly got shoulder, he did not look that badly hurt as he ran away.
 
I have shot the 130gr NBT in the .270 since they have been out..one year i burned up 500 of them at groung hogs and one very long shot on a doe droped in its tracks..I have really liked them..My buddy had shot them also and he does not care for them at all..he says all the deer he hit run..I have had several one shot drop in their tracks with them and if they did run you could tell they were hit and did not go more than 30 yards. but even though i stayed with the NBT every time a new bullet came out i tryed them, some bullets i shot they ran and no sign they were hit at all, then found them 50 to 100 yrds dead. UNTILL the berger VLD bullet came out now i shoot nothing but the berger 150VLD in the .270..I have shot three deer with them all fell to one shot, one of at 400yrds. my buddy shoots them and he also loves them and has shot several deer with them..some at 400+ yards, He said one doe that was all wired up and running, she stoped at @450ish and he shot her, she went 15 yards..So everyone i know shooting the berger VLD"s they seem to work good..as with some of the other bullets i think they pass through before they open up..the VLD's go in a few inches and explode..
 
Probably my fault. I love the comments and surely many of us learn from them. Berger VLD's and Barnes are open in my Natchez catalog right now.

My fault for explaining how hard I looked. Hope there's no negative connotation affecting feelings. I am probably the one coming off "hard".

Hunted with a bow for decades. Lots of kills in the 60's and '70's, including a bear with a bow. From 1981 through 2001 I killed an 8 pt or better with a bow every year in Pa. Now you gotta know, I lost some others during that string. Some were quite big. Developed a reputation as a tracker during that time and helped others recover their deer.

It's a great time to hunt. I say get a good bullet, stop reading this and get back out. The seasons are not over yet.

Heading to a 1,000 yard shoot right now. Gonna make that Dasher talk.
 

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