Lathe question from someone who has no clue...lol

[Kurz]

Haven't heard about a manual machining course in many years...

Yavapai College Gunsmith Department has a complete curriculum based on the manual shop. 12 manual lathes and 10 manual mills. The 2-year curriculum is based on manual training with hand tools and machines.

There is a separate curriculum which is designed around CNC programming and operation.

 

[tobnpr]

We don't fix things any longer. We throw them away and buy new. So there aren't many manual job needs out there. However... I bumped into a friend of a friend who runs a speed shop / mechanic and his eyes lit up when I said I can run a lathe/mill. Guys like him are desperate for job shop stuff.

And marine/boatyard, as evidenced by some of the cool chit Jackie handles...

 

[243Lapua]

If possible, find a community college with a machinist course. You’ll get to learn on someone else’s equipment, and might very well have a great time doing it.
I did this at 46, and it was incredibly rewarding.

Hire the professor, a friend did that. Teaching him on weekends.

 

[RussellJ]

Think and learn as you go. I have made as many one off parts and dies as I have chambered barrels. A mill and a lathe will get a lot of work done with no wait time. Start with delrin and move up to aluminum. Both are relatively cheap to learn on and both machine pretty darn well.

I would never talk you out of a lathe or a mill. Its quite an entertainment package and keeps the mind working. Go for it!

Community college possibly or just find someone with some experience to get the basics. Be careful as machines that size are very unforgiving on body parts but otherwise play and go slow and learn.

linebaugh: GREAT advice!!!
As stated above: Start with delrin and move up to aluminum. Both are relatively cheap to learn on and both machine pretty darn well.

 

[SKWERLZ]

I will add, there are no intentions of contouring a barrel. Only threads and chambering.
So maybe not need a lathe with long bed. Do have some space constraints plus definitely want a 220 volt machine. No sense in fighting with a machine lacking the power to turn the material properly.

It’s a pain in the ass to profile, I’ve done a few.

 

[jackieschmidt]

We don't fix things any longer. We throw them away and buy new. So there aren't many manual job needs out there. However... I bumped into a friend of a friend who runs a speed shop / mechanic and his eyes lit up when I said I can run a lathe/mill. Guys like him are desperate for job shop stuff.

One reason my business is successful is we fill a need in a particular industry where CNC machining of parts in the realm of repair is just not feasible.
We also do quite a bit of new construction, which would benefit from the advantages of CNC machining if there was enough of it.
It’s a trade off. We can always use the various manual machines, in conjunction with a skilled craftsman, to do any job that comes into the shop.

 

[LVLAaron]

+ Construction and manufacturing needs a lot of manual work... There's still some of that left here.


Jackie, enjoyed seeing you on cortinas video on the tack driver. You should go on his podcast!

 

[kd4avp]

One reason my business is successful is we fill a need in a particular industry where manual machining of parts in the realm of repair is just not feasible.
We also do quite a bit of new construction, which would benefit from the advantages of CNC machining if there was enough of it.
It’s a trade off. We can always use the various manual machines, in conjunction with a skilled craftsman, to do any job that comes into the shop.

Jackie

In my area we have a number of companies still running machines built in the 40s & 50s dealing with handling textile fibers. You just dont buy parts for this stuff new off the shelf. Most is either salvage parts or machined by a skilled craftsman. Newer more efficient equipment is available, but these family owned businesses keep the old stuff running as long as they can.
Lets not even get into the safety aspect of some of this stuff. LOL

 

[ELR LVR]

Haven't heard about a manual machining course in many years...
As said, it's all CNC nowadays.
Being a manual machine dinosaur, I gotta wonder whether this makes sense.
Doesn't it take longer to write the code for some one-off jobs than to chuck up some stock and do it manually? Or, is AI writing code now as I've read?

I worked at a CNC shop for awhile
I didn't write the main programs, the boss did since the company was his liability/reputation and he did not want employees to possibly make any sort of slight mistake ,
we made a lot of Military Contract Communication parts so his 100% perfect recrod meant a lot to secure further new contracts as well.
So if an employee wrote a program and was just a decimal point off in a number
it could crash the tooling into the head. (boss said he did that a few times when learning some of his newer machines) Meaning if even the boss can make such a mistake, the likelihood of an employee doing so is even higher.
I did learn the G-code programs though, and made a slight change to them here and there to an existing program, especially during temp swings when our .0004" tolerances were off slightly.
but when I asked how long it took him to write some of the more complex CNC Milling programs
he said about 8 hours. It's very cool stuff though
But boring if all you're doing is loading material and pushing the green start button over and over all day.
We would often rotate to a different job every few hours from lathe to milling jobs to cure the monotony.
---
So yes many of the parts he would tell the customer, it dont matter if you buy 1 or 100 of these, you're really paying for the all day long programming time.
(such as when they got a quote for 10 ea, and the quote seemed outrageous for 10 parts. you still have to pay for the time to program and setup etc.)
But if they were repeat customers as most were, that was a 1 time thing, since once the program is written, they dont have to pay for that any longer, and they just pay for the parts afterward.

 

[jackieschmidt]

Jackie

In my area we have a number of companies still running machines built in the 40s & 50s dealing with handling textile fibers. You just dont buy parts for this stuff new off the shelf. Most is either salvage parts or machined by a skilled craftsman. Newer more efficient equipment is available, but these family owned businesses keep the old stuff running as long as they can.
Lets not even get into the safety aspect of some of this stuff. LOL

I edited my post in my first sentence.
One thing we do not compromise on is tooling. The days of a skilled machinist standing by a grinder sharpening his tools is long gone. We have specific inserts and holders to cover any operation the Machinist will encounter.
We also do a lot of heavy lifting. In our four buildings, we have a total of 7 overhead cranes ranging from 5 tons to 20 tons. Starting 5 years ago, we replaced every crane in our buildings, some over 60 years old, new units.
Here are the two in our newest building we built 5 years ago.

 

[Tim Singleton]

In answer to the question of lathe choice
for what you describe as your desired use
IMO no better choice than a GOOD South Bend heavy 10
Mine has served me well

 

[hpshooter]

The problem with many college courses today is they have gone the way of the machining industries.
Everything is CNC. They produce Machine Operators, not Machinist.

Wish I could like Jackie's comments 10 times, he is absolutely correct! There are a few Community Colleges around that teach hobby level gunsmithing and knife making courses that focus on manual machines. They are often hard to find.

 

[Buttstock-TX]

If a person wanted to purchase a lathe and learn the craft of doing your own barrel etc...what would you suggest?
I have a small amount of knowledge on using a lathe.
No intention of doing this as a business, just for my son and I.
He is into restorations and has need of lathe work from time to time.
I want to learn to do my own barrels.
Call it my upcoming retirement adventure into my 3rd or 4th childhood...least according my bride.

The NRA summer gunsmith courses are a good place to start. These are offered at the gunsmithing colleges in several states. I took four different one-week courses on lathe, mill, re-barreling and muzzle devices shortly after I retired. All were taught on manual machines. I knew something about lathe work from high school 42 years prior and watching my gunsmith friend work on my own and other firearms more recently.

I purchased my own lathe (Jet-Chinese) before I took the NRA classes. Today, I would suggest looking for a highly reconditioned South Bend or one of the new Taiwan manufactured machines. Sharp is a good brand to look at as they offer Meehanite casting lathe beds which hold up better over time.

As others have mentioned, the machine is only about 1/2 the outlay. Tooling cost is significant.

 

[Cnsane]

Surprised no one has mentioned Grizzly for a gunsmithing lathe. The owner is one of us

 

[jackieschmidt]

Surprised no one has mentioned Grizzly for a gunsmithing lathe. The owner is one of us

For general hobby work, in particular barrel work, the Grizzly line of machine tools are perfectly adequate.
Their Gunsmith Lathe is specifically designed for those that do barrel work in what has become a very popular way in setting up barrels to chamber. Mainly, a short headstock with a 1.5 center hole.

They are user friendly in that many run on single phase 220, a big plus for someone who has his garage set up as a shop.

Some years back, I visited a fellow shooter’s shop in the Houston area that had a small Grizzly. I think one of the big negatives is the machine simply looked cheap. And when you turned it on, the gear noise was very noticeable, leaving one to believe that the fit and finishof the internals is sub par.

But then, if you want better, it cost. And high cost tends to defeat the purpose of the Grizzly line of machine tools aimed at the hobbiest.

In the past years, I think their fit and finish has improved. This lathe here would be a good choice for a serious hobbyist.

Grizzly G0709 - 14" x 40" Gunsmith Gearhead Metal Lathe - Grizzly Industrial, Inc.

<h1>G0709 14" x 40" Gunsmith Gearhead Metal Lathe</h1> <h2>A powerful, feature-packed lathe designed for extended production.</h2> <p>The G0709 14" x 40" Gunsmithing Lathe comes with features typically not found on standard lathes, such as high-precision NSK bearings, extra-large 1-9/16" spindle...

www.grizzly.com

 

[ridgeway]

I use a little 12x36 Grizzly. I can hold a tenth if need be, but that is more a talking point rather than practicality. I did some work to it to be a better machine. Its not a stout rigid machine, but barrel work, general gunsmith work...works perfectly. I've chambered record setting barrels and national winning barrels on it. The individual behind the machine is where its at. Attention to detail and asking yourself the "why" behind everything you do goes a long way. I train apprentices on a daily basis and I've seen it all, haha.

 

[ArtinNC]

Your NOT going to the moon !!! I had a old junky Enco 12x36 lathe and read a book I think I got from Butch Lambert and Mike Bryant .Threaded and chambered my first barrel . When I was done I loaded one round held the gun on the back side of a tree and fired the first round went back in the shop checked the measured the brass it was perfect . So I loaded a HOT round and shot it out of the back of my shop and that brass measured the same . After that I was on a roll I rebarreled every gun I had and they all shot pretty good groups . The thing is it is easy to goof up dialing in the barrel took me 2 days to get zero run out , Threading is tricky for someone that has small amount of knowledge on using a lathe , chambering not so bad . I never won a shooting match but I have posted some pretty good groups and posted on here . I just sold my bench gun because I will never shoot another match , but the guy I sold the gun to shot 5 targets with 6BR 3 shot in the same hole a Hall action a Broughton barrel and McMillion stock . So I didn't do to bad .

​

 

[Fuj]

Jackie......i see you have a Carlton radial. We had a American hole Wizard.
Nobody wanted to go near it......LOL I'll save those stories for another time.

 

[jackieschmidt]

Jackie......i see you have a Carlton radial. We had a American hole Wizard.
Nobody wanted to go near it......LOL I'll save those stories for another time.

Here is a better view.
It is a great Radial Drill.

 

[LVLAaron]

Here is a better view.
It is a great Radial Drill.View attachment 1714336

Yeah, but do you have a big drill?