laser rangefinder

[antitactical]

Listen to catshooter. We use barr and stroud, wilds, and zeiss versions. They are the only way to range on a flat field. I hunt with a bunch of guys that shoot long range groundhogs. One guy got a set of lieca model 19 rangefinder and binoculars (I think that's right) it costs around 19,000$ and even they won't work as well as the wild we use. I have a zeiss laser rangefinder and others I hunt with have Swarovski, and lieca binoculars. If you dig hard enough, you can find the wilds for not a whole lot if money. Would I use the old styles for big game hunting? Hell no. But it's king for long range critter shooting.

 

[CatShooter]

Vectronix Terrapin is the one. If it won't range it you're out of luck.

And the going price on a Terrapin is... ?? But he doesn't want to spend $2000.

 

[snert]

So what are the B and S or the Wildes going for?

 

[CatShooter]

So what are the B and S or the Wildes going for?

You can find a Wild with the short (prone) tripod and a lot of stuff for ~300-ish.

You will need to fit a stand up tripod, cuz all of them are gone - eBay is a good place to look, and you might get one with the short AND tall tripod.

The Swedish Periscopes were coming in NEW for $200 with all the accessories, from Cheaper-than-dirt. it was the steal of the century... but they are now considered made of unobtainium - but you can look on eBay too.

I don't know about Barr & Stroud... also, eBay is a good place.

I have a Wild and a Swedish Periscope.

 

[bigngreen]

A Vectronix Terrapin or PFLR, if your having issues with one it's not the beam it's the low magnification of the reticle, a number of guys have mounted a swaro doubler on them and that give you a more precise aim point. Used them in Wy while antelope hunting on prairie dog towns far enough the only way to reach them was with improved 338's and ranging was very consistent.

 

[searcher]

If you can find used Leica Geovid binoculars, even ones 20 years old, for a reasonable price, I'd take a look at them. They are not junk and were built to last. They are a bit larger and a bit heavier than the current crop by the same manufacturer - but of no importance if not carrying them around (about 6 oz. difference or so). I have a pair I use regularly (a coupLe of days a week) and I have had them for about 25 years. I use them alongside a newer pair of Swarovski EL Range binoculars and the new stuff is only slightly better, mostly due to a more powerful laser system. As Catshooter said early on, they all skip on flat land - and even worse on flat ground with snow. One of the things that really seperates the good ones from the mediocre is the narrow beam they emit, making it much more easy to hit small rocks and things to get a reading way out there.

 

[CSM19Z5M]

None of them work perfectly, some work some of the time and some never give a good reading. I'll be darned if I spend a fortune on a rangefinder. I have a Leupold 1200i TBR that works the best when you can increase the angle to the horizontal plane as much as possible. Standing on a pickup bed, shooting bench or other raised object helps sometimes. Not sure any of them are worth the trouble for sage rat shooting frankly. If you shoot the same places all the time you can take a little time when you are done for the day and make a range card by taking a highly reflective object out to the different places where the dogs are present and ranging to them. Works okay. The better the data on the card the better it works. But it depends on being able to discern between different spots and on the desert that is a problem. We sometimes set up sticks to serve as known points for the card. And your right, not a perfect solution but everything helps.

 

[people]

Range cards are great if you are in one area for a long time. One thing that helps sometimes is turn your range finder sideways. It has to do with how the laser disburses. Sometimes turning it in a way that makes the laser higher will be just enough.

 

[Hydenseek]

My theory is if you spend your hard earned money and time building a rifle that will shoot little tiny groups and capable of hitting your target why not have a rangefinder to tell you the distance. If you have confidence in the distance and your equipment I feel the shots are much more likely to hit the critter.

It's kinda like having a racecar without a steering wheel in my opinion.

 

[CatShooter]

My theory is if you spend your hard earned money and time building a rifle that will shoot little tiny groups and capable of hitting your target why not have a rangefinder to tell you the distance. If you have confidence in the distance and your equipment I feel the shots are much more likely to hit the critter.

It's kinda like having a racecar without a steering wheel in my opinion.

Unfortunately, when ranging over a flat Prairie Dog town or hay field, money does not equal results.

 

[people]

My theory is if you spend your hard earned money and time building a rifle that will shoot little tiny groups and capable of hitting your target why not have a rangefinder to tell you the distance. If you have confidence in the distance and your equipment I feel the shots are much more likely to hit the critter.

It's kinda like having a racecar without a steering wheel in my opinion.

Unfortunately, when ranging over a flat Prairie Dog town or hay field, money does not equal results.

Very true but it does help.

 

[CatShooter]

My theory is if you spend your hard earned money and time building a rifle that will shoot little tiny groups and capable of hitting your target why not have a rangefinder to tell you the distance. If you have confidence in the distance and your equipment I feel the shots are much more likely to hit the critter.

It's kinda like having a racecar without a steering wheel in my opinion.

Unfortunately, when ranging over a flat Prairie Dog town or hay field, money does not equal results.

Very true but it does help.

Not even a little.

 

[mshelton]

Catshooter is right, I don't care how much you spend on a laser rangefinder, they just don't cut it at long distances on flat surfaces with only small objects to bounce off. I've tried a good amount of them including a $19k Leica on groundhogs over 400yds, there just isn't enough mass to get a good reading. A groundhog head and body poking above winter wheat stalks at best will be 4"x2 1/2", trying to get a good laser reading on that at 800, 900, 1000 yds is pissing in the wind, the old coincidence rangefinders are your only friend there.

 

[people]

Sorry Catshooter but this time you are very wrong. Those of us how can not afford a 20k laser range finder have to make do with far less. Your answer reminds me of a career politician who can not see where a 40hr a week worker is coming from. I guess it is nice to be able to totally disregard those of us who are lowly workers from your ivory tower.

I will ask you to please explain how money has zero barring on ranging in this near the ground application.

Since there is no difference apparently, I have a Bushnell 800 something that I will trade you straight up for your 20K unit. Heck I will pay shipping both ways, packaging and will include 80 AA batteries in the deal to sweeten it.

I can tell you with one hundred percent confidence a better unit ranges better when very close to the ground. I have that Bushnell and a Swarovski unit and the Swarovski is not even in the same class as the Bushnell unit. Even at distances the Bushnell can actually range. The Swarovski can be aimed between clumps of grass where the Bushnell cannot even tell there is a space between them, or if the grass is there depending on what is between me and the grass. Turning the Swarovski on its side has limited affect on ranging ability where on the Bushnell it can actually get a reading where before the ranger was not able to.

Most shooters and hunters are very, VERY hard pressed to shell out a thousand dollars for a good range finder. It does pay to buy once cry once if you have the need. There are always diminishing returns. A bow hunter does not need a unit that will range to a mile plus nor does a long range shooter-hunter need a unit that stops working between 300 to 400yds.

 

[JamesnTN]

The consumer grade range finders are reliable to aproximatly 1/2of there rating so if you get a 1600 expect 90-99% accuracy at 800 yards on non reflective objects.
The more you spend the more accuracy and distance you will get also. For the guy who used a 19,000 range finder and couldn't make use of it over any of the budget range finders, I'll have to say either the unit was bad or you never actually used one.

I have a Vector 23 by Vextronics and I personnally know for a fact it'll range tiny non reflective objects at 2500 yards. We are limited to sight distance here in TN but this unit has been proven over and over again at near 20 miles. It comes with a price as well, I paid 18k for mine and I think now they are above 20k

Here is a very detailed report on the accuracy of range finders if any of you care to read it.

http://precisionrifleblog.com/2013/12/03/rangefinder-binoculars-reviews-field-tests-overall-results-summary/

 

[Hydenseek]

I promise you guys I know it's a large sum of money but a terrapin is steps above..... But I'm not gonna preach it anymore. I'm a 40 hr worker and got tired of not being able to range what I could see that I knew was in range..... So I saved up and bought a terrapin. I live in Eastern NC and it is FLAT for MILES..... I mean Flat!!! I would sample one and see if it would do the job for you.... I'd be surprised if it wouldn't.


What this guy up here said^^^^^

 

[CatShooter]

Sorry Catshooter but this time you are very wrong. Those of us how can not afford a 20k laser range finder have to make do with far less. Your answer reminds me of a career politician who can not see where a 40hr a week worker is coming from. I guess it is nice to be able to totally disregard those of us who are lowly workers from your ivory tower.

I will ask you to please explain how money has zero barring on ranging in this near the ground application.

Since there is no difference apparently, I have a Bushnell 800 something that I will trade you straight up for your 20K unit. Heck I will pay shipping both ways, packaging and will include 80 AA batteries in the deal to sweeten it.

I can tell you with one hundred percent confidence a better unit ranges better when very close to the ground. I have that Bushnell and a Swarovski unit and the Swarovski is not even in the same class as the Bushnell unit. Even at distances the Bushnell can actually range. The Swarovski can be aimed between clumps of grass where the Bushnell cannot even tell there is a space between them, or if the grass is there depending on what is between me and the grass. Turning the Swarovski on its side has limited affect on ranging ability where on the Bushnell it can actually get a reading where before the ranger was not able to.

Most shooters and hunters are very, VERY hard pressed to shell out a thousand dollars for a good range finder. It does pay to buy once cry once if you have the need. There are always diminishing returns. A bow hunter does not need a unit that will range to a mile plus nor does a long range shooter-hunter need a unit that stops working between 300 to 400yds.

Your comment is so childish, it just reflects on your lack of maturity and credibility.

I am not in politics, and I work as hard (or harder) as anyone else - if you don't like your job, or the number of hours you work, or your life... it is not my problem, nor relevant to this topic, so please stop whining for pity, because it clouds the discussion and makes you sound pathetic.

I will explain, since you obviously do not understand what you are talking about - though I think you shouldn't get into technical discussions on subjects you know nothing about.

1 - A laser rangefinder sends a beam out, and then "listens" for the return, like sonar. It measures the time, and computes the distance to what the beam was reflected from.

2 - the beam has a finite diameter - like a flash light. It is brightest in the center, and gets dimmer as you get further from the center. The diameter of the beam is measured at the "3-db down" or "Half power" points (they are both the same).

If a beam has a diameter of "2", it's actual diameter might be 4 or 7. THis extra diameter is called "spill".

3 - To us, grass and other chlorophyllic plants look dark... but the IR beam's wavelength, they are chalk white, but furry little animals that look brown to us, look almost black to the laser.

So, no matter how much you spend, or how much power your laser has, when you ping a woodchucks head in an alfalfa field... because of the "spill", you will get reflections from every weed and blade of grass in the area, since, at 400 to 800 to 1,200+ yards, the beam is 4 to 20 times as large as the woodchucks head, and you have no way of knowing what is giving you the ping return.

Commenting on ranging an antelope at 400 yards is meaningless, because it is not on the ground, you are pinging it broadside, and it is huge in size (compared to the beam size).

This is why guys that actually use lasers on small animals like PDs and 'chucks, (instead of reading catalogs) will tell you that the lasers have a lot of problems ranging small animals across long, flat fields.

Now, go get a job you like.

:

 

[fredo]

"...long flat fields" being the key point.

Where I 'chuck hunt, and where I've shot p-dogs out west, the country offered enough rolling relief and/or terrain features to allow for accurate ranging of that terrain surrounding the varmint. I was not really concerned with being limited to getting a return bounce to the LRF off a p-dog's body @ 800yds, a return off the mound seemed to suffice. In that regard, a LRF was perfectly usable, as I was not attempting to "range" a small animal silhouetted against nothing but air on a pancake flat field...

From reading this thread, terrain features, or lack thereof, is where I'm seeing how these optical rangefinders come into there own, and would be advantageous.

I've used various Leicas in the past, and now use a 1600-b.

 

[dkhunt14]

The Terapin has a mode where you set it and it gives you three readings. The first one is a range probably short on grass or something, the second one the prairie dog and the third one a grass clump or something beyond. They are very accurate and I have never had a problem ranging anything. The second best one was a Swarovski. It would range most of the time but not always. These are the two that I have the most experience with. The lasers need mounted on a tripod and aimed accurately. I have my rangefinder mounted on my Kowa Highlanders. That way it is as easy to range what you are looking at. The Terapin blows the rest out of the water for the money. I have hunted with guys that had the Russian, the RCA, and the Leica Vector. We have also used the Barr and Stroud and others like it. I like the laser better because it's easier and faster. Matt

 

[Hydenseek]

I'd be interested to hear the situations where s terrapin on a tripod has failed someone. Especially at 800 yards.