Howa Mini
- Thread starter JSH
- Start date
I was really interested in the Mini action when I found out they were going to chamber it for the 6.5 Grendel - not because I'm a fan of the 6.5 G, but so I could use a push-feed action with the correct boltface to build another bolt rifle in 6RAT. I'd done one on a CZ527 carbine in 7.62x39, and though it turned out to be a good looking, good shooting rifle, I never have gotten the magazine to feed 100% of the time. I figured the push-feed Howa Mini would work better, and it does feed the 6RAT with 100% reliability. I didn't do any action truing, just fitted & chambered a Bartlein 6mm/1-8tw light Palma blank for it. Initially, McMillan offered to build a stock on the Sako Varmint pattern, but needed a bbl'd action to model the inlet - and they wanted a $500 fee for the custom inlet. I sat on my hands for several months, having spoken with Tom Manners, who wanted to do something like his EH2 stock in the Mini inlet, but again, he also needed a bbl'd action, and talked me into selling him one of my 6.5 Grendel models. Somewhere in this time frame, Boyds started doing the Mini inlet, and not long after that, McMillan decided to waive the $500 custom inlet fee if I'd send them a bbl'd action. So I sent them a 222 Mini, and in due time, received the Sako Varmint pattern stock, which I used for the 6RAT bbl'd action. About that time, DIP came out with their aluminum DBM, which is a huge improvement over the OEM plastic pos. I did the trigger spring mod, clipping about 1.3 coils off the trigger spring, which resulted in a nice, crisp 1.2lb break. This was better than what I'd gotten with a Timney, so since then, I've done this simple mod on all four of the rifles I've built myself on the Mini action.
I eventually decided that the McM Sako Varmint stock wasn't going to work well for shooting prone off a bipod, so sold it to another Mini owner, and got McM to build me a Game Scout stock for my Mini in 6RAT. This is my favorite Mini stock, though the B&C #1003 is a close 2nd. Boyds ProVarmint w/adjustable cheekpiece is also very good, though the laminate stocks are quite a bit heavier than the lighter composites like the Game Scout. So now, I've got four Mini-based customs - the original 6RAT in the Game Scout, a 20 Tactical in a Boyds Prairie Hunter, a 22 Grendel in a Boyds ProVarmint w/adjustable cheekpiece, and a 6.5 Grendel in a B&C #1003. All four have DIP DBM, the spring-clipped factory triggers, EGW or Warne 20 MOA sloped scope bases, and Bartlein bbls. And all four are good, solid, accurate rifles. The main reason I finally went back to the rifle's roots and did one in 6.5 Grendel was that I had purchased a Bartlein 6.5mm/1-8tw blank in Rem mag sporter contour off their inventory list. The shank of this bbl was too short to hold in a 4-jaw chuck to do the bbl work through the headstock; but since I turn shanks for a Mini action down to 1.090" dia, when that was done to this bbl, the shank wound up being plenty long to allow through the headstock chambering & threading. Haven't shot it a lot so far, but with Starline brass & IMR8208 powder with Lapua 123 Scenars, it's impressing me with its 600yd accuracy. Am beginning to see why so many shooters like the little 6.5 Grendel - though I'm still partial to my old favorite 6RAT, and am looking forward to getting some serious load development done with the 22 Grendel after fall farm work is done & out of the way.
The plastic Howa mags for these rifles remains an issue - there's enough variation in the distance between the tops of the feed lips and the lug that engages the magazine catch to cause some issues in getting action height set for reliable feeding in some stocks. And the mags are way over-priced IMHO. I'd sure like to see someone like Magpul come out with a more substantial Mini mag, even if it would require different DBM to work.
I'd also like to see Howa do the Mini with a 6.8 SPC boltface - there are several .22 & 6mm wildcats based on the SPC case, and this little action is the perfect basis for rifles chambered for these cartridges. That includes the 6 HAGAR - I have an AR15 match rifle/spacegun upper for the HAGAR that performed very well for me - after Hornady began making brass. The early cases I formed using R-P 30 Rem & Jamison 25 Rem brass were fairly accurate, but case life was crap, which I found out after going through a labor intensive process to form 1200 pcs. Though there's not a lot of difference in case capacity between the HAGAR & RAT, I'd still like to have a bolt rifle chambered for the HAGAR, and a Mini action with correct boltface would be my first choice.
I eventually decided that the McM Sako Varmint stock wasn't going to work well for shooting prone off a bipod, so sold it to another Mini owner, and got McM to build me a Game Scout stock for my Mini in 6RAT. This is my favorite Mini stock, though the B&C #1003 is a close 2nd. Boyds ProVarmint w/adjustable cheekpiece is also very good, though the laminate stocks are quite a bit heavier than the lighter composites like the Game Scout. So now, I've got four Mini-based customs - the original 6RAT in the Game Scout, a 20 Tactical in a Boyds Prairie Hunter, a 22 Grendel in a Boyds ProVarmint w/adjustable cheekpiece, and a 6.5 Grendel in a B&C #1003. All four have DIP DBM, the spring-clipped factory triggers, EGW or Warne 20 MOA sloped scope bases, and Bartlein bbls. And all four are good, solid, accurate rifles. The main reason I finally went back to the rifle's roots and did one in 6.5 Grendel was that I had purchased a Bartlein 6.5mm/1-8tw blank in Rem mag sporter contour off their inventory list. The shank of this bbl was too short to hold in a 4-jaw chuck to do the bbl work through the headstock; but since I turn shanks for a Mini action down to 1.090" dia, when that was done to this bbl, the shank wound up being plenty long to allow through the headstock chambering & threading. Haven't shot it a lot so far, but with Starline brass & IMR8208 powder with Lapua 123 Scenars, it's impressing me with its 600yd accuracy. Am beginning to see why so many shooters like the little 6.5 Grendel - though I'm still partial to my old favorite 6RAT, and am looking forward to getting some serious load development done with the 22 Grendel after fall farm work is done & out of the way.
The plastic Howa mags for these rifles remains an issue - there's enough variation in the distance between the tops of the feed lips and the lug that engages the magazine catch to cause some issues in getting action height set for reliable feeding in some stocks. And the mags are way over-priced IMHO. I'd sure like to see someone like Magpul come out with a more substantial Mini mag, even if it would require different DBM to work.
I'd also like to see Howa do the Mini with a 6.8 SPC boltface - there are several .22 & 6mm wildcats based on the SPC case, and this little action is the perfect basis for rifles chambered for these cartridges. That includes the 6 HAGAR - I have an AR15 match rifle/spacegun upper for the HAGAR that performed very well for me - after Hornady began making brass. The early cases I formed using R-P 30 Rem & Jamison 25 Rem brass were fairly accurate, but case life was crap, which I found out after going through a labor intensive process to form 1200 pcs. Though there's not a lot of difference in case capacity between the HAGAR & RAT, I'd still like to have a bolt rifle chambered for the HAGAR, and a Mini action with correct boltface would be my first choice.
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65Grendel Forum has several threads about the Howa Mini, specifically about stock options and feed issues from magazine. General feedback is that when you swap out stocks there is very high chance that your rifle will not feed reliably or at all from the magazine. Bell&Carlson introduced new stock specifically designed for Howa Mini at beginning of May, but it immediately encountered issues. B&C rep was very active in the thread trying to determine issue and identify solutions. I believe B&C got DIP Products engaged in process to design replacement bottom metal. Feeding issues continued for everyone... unless you were one of he "lucky one" where it worked. The final verdict is feeding issues are result of poor construction of plastic factory magazines and bad magazine springs. Apparently, Howa has a QC problem resulting in dimensions of their plastic magazine dimensions varying from batch to batch. The magazine springs are underpowered, which adds to the issue of feeding reliability. Everyone is holding their breath hoping someone will come out with a quality replacement magazine. In the meantime shooters are either lucky or living with it, and lots of people are trying out different solutions to get their guns to feed reliably.
I logged into forum earlier to check for any updates on Howa Mini... no issues. I think it must be on your end.
I've had a barreled action sitting in closet waiting for the magazine feeding issue to be resolved. I have enough other gun projects to keep me busy then trying to solve a design failure that the manufacturer & distributor have no interest in addressing. If DIP would make a replacement bottom metal with hinged floor plate (blind magazine) then I would buy one to use the rifle today while waiting for someone to make a replacement metal magazine.
Here is a link to the DIP upgrade / metal replacement parts for Howa Mini
https://www.diproductsinc.com/Products.aspx?CAT=12462
Here is a link to the DIP upgrade / metal replacement parts for Howa Mini
https://www.diproductsinc.com/Products.aspx?CAT=12462
longtrapshootn
Banned
The real selling point for the CDI bottom metal is the ability to use AICS mags with the 10 round capacity, factory howa mags are limited to 5 rounds and are 10-15 more expensive than the AICS pmags.
Thanks. The CDI bottom metal uses a 308 magazine (5 or 10 round) made by AIC, MDT, and Magpul PMag. They'll even do the inletting to you gun for free as part of the purchase! That's impressive.
http://www.cdiprecisiongunworksstore.com/howa-1500-mini-action-dbm/
One last note: the Howa representative that was very active and responsive to shooters on 65Grendel Forum has left the company to join MDT, which manufactures the LSS and LSS XL Chassis for the Howa Mini. There is some hope/encouragement that MDT might start producing a replacement metal magazine.
Is that the factory chassis? What has been your experience with it?
I thought it was an MDT, but I was confused ... didn't see the company name on receiver (i now see it on underside of receiver) and the machining on the rail (triangle cut-outs) are different than product photos on website.
How do you like the chassis...how's the weight? Who's buttstock are you using? Thanks
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Not a great photo, but it's cloudy & raining outdoors (thank God!), so indoors was the only choice. Top to bottom: 6.5 Grendel, Bartlein magnum sporter contour with shank turned down to 1.090" dia., in B&C #1003 stock. 22 Grendel, Bartlein #3 sporter contour, 1.100" shank, 1-6.8tw in Boyds ProVarmin w/optional adj cheekpiece & laser etched panels. 20 Tactical, Bartlein #2 sporter, 1-9tw, in Boyds Prairie Hunter. 6RAT, Bartlein light Palma, 1-8tw, in McMillan Game Scout. All four rifles have DIP DBM, either Warne or EGW 20 MOA scope rails, OEM triggers with shortened trigger springs, and TBAC flash suppressor or brake CB mounts. Top two have Athlon Midas TAC 6-24x50 mil scopes, bottom two have Athlon Ares 4.5-27x50 mil scopes, all four in TPS TSR low rings.
I swapped the 20 tactical out of the pro varmint stock and into the prairie hunter so I could do some prone shooting with the 22 Grendel. In doing so, feeding 22 Grendel from the magazines went from very reliable to bolt over-riding cartridges unless the magazine is pushed up by hand while running the bolt. Just another case of needing longer mag catch to hold the mag up where it needs to be...
I swapped the 20 tactical out of the pro varmint stock and into the prairie hunter so I could do some prone shooting with the 22 Grendel. In doing so, feeding 22 Grendel from the magazines went from very reliable to bolt over-riding cartridges unless the magazine is pushed up by hand while running the bolt. Just another case of needing longer mag catch to hold the mag up where it needs to be...
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What action is the 6RAT? If it was the Howa Mini then what needed to be done to fit the Howa action to the McMillan Game Scout Stock (inlet for Rem 700 action)? Thanks
Not sure I completely understand your questions Oso. All four of these rifles are built on Howa Mini actions, that should be obvious. The RAT is a necked down, "improved" version of the 6.5 Grendel, fireformed very much in the same way as a 6 Dasher is. The McMillan Game Scout stock was originally inletted for the Mini action by the folks at McMillan when it was built, not re-done from a stock made for a M700.
Sorry - I just wanted to confirm that it was a Howa Mini... Game Scout stock threw me for loop because can only buy in Remington inlet. If you don't mind me asking what was the charge to have custom inlet by McMillan? Thanks
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