HOWA 1500 accuracy in .308

[Hamo]

Well... Its finally all arrived! Very excited now. Problem is i'm moving about 1000 km so won't get a chance to shoot for a few weeks. At least Its ready to go though! Sorry about the crappy photos, Had to use my phone and its a bit old.

As for the chassis... its an MDT LSS-XL forend with their mark 2 stock. I'm still forming an opinion on it, but so far i'm impressed with a few features, but I was quite disapointed at the fit of the action. It fits firmly and tightly, but it really feels like its sitting on the stock, rather than in the stock. The cut in the forend for the barrel is off centres with the barrel by probaly 3/8"... it just looks and feels wrong. I have access to a weatherby vanguard so I'll try swapping that in to see if it fits any better (I feel it will be the same... I mean, they are built in the same factory on the same tooling). It does feed very nicely from the magazine though so that's a big bonus, and even with my crazy 60mm scope it doesn't look too rediculous on it.

One big problem (which is my own fault) is that the length of pull is too short. I ordered the MDT stock which they don't recommend for this forend (but there are pictures of the two together on their website... go figure). The length of pull is about 2" shorter than I'd like, and probably a good inch shorter than I'd really find acceptable. I'll machine up a spacer which will work to extend the stock. Its no problem and by no means a fault of the manufacturer but its frustrating. An added advantage is also that currently the cheekpiece blocks the bolt from coming out without removing the stock (one bolt, not too bad). I could cut 1/2" off the cheekpiece, but with the spacer in place it won't be an issue anymore. Time to hit the tools!

I'll do a more detailed review once I get to the range and shoot this bad boy, but for now, here's a few pics:

 

[DHuffman]

Looks good enjoy it!

 

[Flouncer]

Sort of an epic for frustration but also of perseverance !! Let's see some bug holes !!

 

[outlawsix]

Well... Its finally all arrived! Very excited now. Problem is i'm moving about 1000 km so won't get a chance to shoot for a few weeks. At least Its ready to go though! Sorry about the crappy photos, Had to use my phone and its a bit old.

As for the chassis... its an MDT LSS-XL forend with their mark 2 stock. I'm still forming an opinion on it, but so far i'm impressed with a few features, but I was quite disapointed at the fit of the action. It fits firmly and tightly, but it really feels like its sitting on the stock, rather than in the stock. The cut in the forend for the barrel is off centres with the barrel by probaly 3/8"... it just looks and feels wrong. I have access to a weatherby vanguard so I'll try swapping that in to see if it fits any better (I feel it will be the same... I mean, they are built in the same factory on the same tooling). It does feed very nicely from the magazine though so that's a big bonus, and even with my crazy 60mm scope it doesn't look too rediculous on it.

One big problem (which is my own fault) is that the length of pull is too short. I ordered the MDT stock which they don't recommend for this forend (but there are pictures of the two together on their website... go figure). The length of pull is about 2" shorter than I'd like, and probably a good inch shorter than I'd really find acceptable. I'll machine up a spacer which will work to extend the stock. Its no problem and by no means a fault of the manufacturer but its frustrating. An added advantage is also that currently the cheekpiece blocks the bolt from coming out without removing the stock (one bolt, not too bad). I could cut 1/2" off the cheekpiece, but with the spacer in place it won't be an issue anymore. Time to hit the tools!

I'll do a more detailed review once I get to the range and shoot this bad boy, but for now, here's a few pics:

I just ordered this chassis LSS XL for my Savage LA 264 Win build. So with that out of the way...how tall are you? I havent ordered a Butt stock yet, but was planning on either slapping on a Magpul PRS or Lurtar I have laying around. The PRS is said to be 1" longer(not extended ) that the MDT factory butt stock. BTW Im 5'7" so will be interesting to see which stock fits me better. How is the accuracy with your set up? Found a certain torque that tends to be the sweet spot with this chassis?

 

[Hamo]

I just ordered this chassis LSS XL for my Savage LA 264 Win build. So with that out of the way...how tall are you? I havent ordered a Butt stock yet, but was planning on either slapping on a Magpul PRS or Lurtar I have laying around. The PRS is said to be 1" longer(not extended ) that the MDT factory butt stock. BTW Im 5'7" so will be interesting to see which stock fits me better. How is the accuracy with your set up? Found a certain torque that tends to be the sweet spot with this chassis?

The rifle I used for the barreled action was about 2" longer than the MDT stock on the LSS-XL. It was a standard Hogue stock. I'm 6'2. I can shoot this prone pretty easily but it would be uncomfortable shouldered. I still haven't shot it yet (soon I hope) so will post a range report then and can give you more info. All I can say at the moment about it is that it feeds really nicely.

The main disadvantage of the MDT skeleton stock (on a howa at least) is that the stock needs to be removed to put the bolt in and out. I store my rifles with the bolt out so its a big pain to have to remove it. I saw that there are 1" spacers available from DPMS but getting one sent to Australia is verging on impossible or stupidly expensive. As for the adjustable buttplate and cheekpiece, they are great (except the butt plate is now set to its maximum length... Hopefully I can fix this soon though so I can actually have the adjustable bit in a useful range)

If you have a stock laying around I'd try it with that first just to see how you like the length. AR's aren't allowed over here so getting furniture for this thing is not as easy as it would be in the states. You guys have a huge selection over there and the prices I see online kill me compared to the premium they slap on here.


Oh, and forgot to mention earlier regarding the epic poor service... When the forend got shipped, they sent it to my dealer instead of my house, and it got lost in the mail for 2 weeks before they finally returned it to the shop... at which point they sent it to my house instead. All I can say is now its here, I am happy with it.

 

[Hamo]

Range report finally in!

I'll break it up into sections as I think that's fairest:

Howa barreled action:
Firstly, I have to say that the 2 stage trigger on this rifle is supurb. I was expecting to have to replace it with an aftermarket unit but it is absolutely perfect. My only criticism of the trigger is that taking the first stage is a little gritty, but I have felt high end triggers that are worse. Breaks cleanly and crisply and there is NO creep in it. Very happy with the trigger.

The action is well built, and the bluing is great. The bolt was blued, but with only 20 rounds through it so far, the bluing on the bolt body is starting to wear. Not unexpected but I thought it would last more than 20 shots. Wearing in I barely noticed any signs of copper fouling, and the only time i've seen this before was when I wore in my Kreiger target barrel. I'm not sure what it says but to me it gives me confidence in a quality product. The action feeds and ejects flawlessly, and the bolt feels firm and sure. 3 position safety works great, although I'm only used to a 2 position so it took me a little getting used to.

MDT stock:
The stock is quite well made. I did notice some machine marks that were a little off from where they re mounted it in the machining process, but nothing that would effect function. Magazines locked in firmly with minimal play, including both plastic MDT mags and aftermarket steel mags. The butt bolted to the for-end with no rattle and it was a positive lock. The adjustable cheek-piece has a little rattle side to side, but I do like the adjustability of it. There is a screw to lock it in place and stop the rattle but it does then require an Allen key to adjust. It would be OK if you only shot from one position, but it defeats the purpose if you're shooting from multiple positions.

The action fits firmly in the stock, although I was a little disapointed as it really did look to me as though the action was sitting on top of the stock, rather than in the stock. You can see the point at which the polished surface of the howa action gives rise to the forged surface at the bottom of the action - something that you couldn't see on the factory howa stock. I'm sure its different for different brands.

Scope: Nikko Stirling "targetmaster" 10-50x60
DO NOT BUY THIS SCOPE!! glass was OK (not great but good for a cheap scope). I adjusted the scope 2 minutes and went from hitting 2" from my mark to missing a sheet of A4 Paper entirely. It was a total disaster to zero in, and only managed to get one "group" after 20 shots. I wasn't expecting great things from this scope, but I was expecting better than what I got.

Shooting:
its hard to say how this shoots as the scope was so rubbish. It took so many shots to get it on target, then when I was at least hitting paper, I decided to fix the zero to the middle of the bull and I missed the target completely. After this, I gave up. I was just wasting ammo at this point. It was a very nice rifle to shoot, and the big rubber MDT butt pad killed the recoil nicely. It did jump around a little after each shot, but not too badly. I was just shooting off a folding bipod, and no bag using reloads straight from the powder thrower (I usually weigh each target load) so I was quite happy with this as the first group I posted. Hopefully there are more coming! it was at 100 yards

 

[Hamo]

Well, good news. Got an awesome deal on a brand new Bushnell 4.5-30 x 50 Tactical scope. Glass looks great quality and all the reviews I have read say they are a great scope. Hopefully get some range time next week to test this rifle properly and see what its capable of!

 

[1000yardstare]

Bought a pair of Smith&Wesson 1500s (Howas) back in the 1980s. Thought it would be nice to have a matched set (.270, .30-06). Had wood stocks (remember that stuff) with low iron sight combs. Use Rem 700 scope ring bases so no problem mounting a scope but the low comb exaggerated the recoil particularly on a bench.

The triggers were adjustable for pull weight but had a lot of creep. Ten years ago had a Weatherby Vanguard in .22-250 with the same trigger - nice weight but a lot of creep.

Looking back at my reloading records, both Smiths would shoot an inch at 100 yards with a number of bullets if I did my part. The Vanguard would regularly do 1/2 moa probably because of the lighter recoil.

The Howa is a good serviceable rifle at a reasonable cost. My three have been traded to finance other projects and were interesting experiences along the road of life.

Bill

 

[Hamo]

Bill, thanks for the info. Howa has a new trigger called the HACT trigger. Not sure what it stands fot but it was a very nice 2 stage out of the box. I have shot a weatherby which was rubbish, but managed to get it nice with an oilstone and a few hours of work.

As for timber stocks... its such a shame they are no longer the norm on cheaper rifles. Plastic feels so cheap and hollow for a stock.

 

[BforByron]

Hey Hamo,
I'm looking at doing a howa on a lss-xl chassis too, only in 6.5cm. What's the barrel length on your howa?

Thanks

 

[Hamo]

I got the 24" varmint barrel. One thing I can say is that this package, with the Skeleton butt piece is a heavy package. If you want anything other than a range rifle, I'd recommend a fluted barrel and a lightweight stock for it.

I have found its been shooting nicely though. I'm shooting tomorrow so I'll try and post a proper range report

 

[Quackhead69]

Howa Precision sells some of the finest mass produced rifles made. I have picked up rifles by Sako that did not shoot any better. My .308 varmint is a consistent 3/8 moa rifle using Hornady 178 amax bullets and imr 4064 in LC brass. The only work done to the rifle was to replace the factory rubber stock with a B&C Mk2. Congrats on the MDT LSS/Howa...it looks beautiful.