The bullet failure stuff is of interest to me. I have probably shot 1,000's of Amax's and never a blow up. Most of these have been from 7.7 twist .22-250 rifles (75) , 8 twist 6mm AI, .243W, & 6mm (105), and 8 twist 6.5-06 & 6.5X47 (120). I am guessing the new ELDM and Amax bullets have similar jackets. This leads me to think the blow up stuff is related to a combination of things like barrel defects, long ogives, weak areas in the ogive area (expansion cracks) and quick twists. I can get 75 grain .224 ELD's for about $0.20 each so I will continue using them in a 7.7 twist .22-.250 and possibly a .22 CM. Paying $0.80 for a 6mm AMP, aluminum tip bullet, is a real barrier for my casual shooting, more so than paying $0.34 for a comparable 6mm ELD bullet. I don't think the new AMP bullets will replace the ELDM bullets. The .22-.250 is budget friendly with mid 30 grain powder charges and $0.20 bullets.
Hornady ELD-Ms, gone and good riddance!!!
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JayHHI6818
Silver $$ Contributor
I went to the range yesterday and ran into a guy that shoots competitively. Discussion came up about ELD’s blowing up with a couple of other guys at the range. He said that he knows guys that order barrels .001-.0015 larger bore diameter and that was the end of bullets blowing up.
Not trying to be a dick, but that is the solution?
Whoever is buying larger dia barrels to shoot a bullet wants to shoot that bullet 20 times more than I do.
I may think about something like this if I wanted to shoot solids, or a custom bullet in need of a larger bore, not for factory bullets though.
That's why I only use custom bullets when I shoot for accuracy. Down to my last 900 Alley Huber 65 gr 6mm bullets and will now have to find a replacement source for something comparable.
I'm positive it's not the bullet construction. If it was, many, many more people would have issues from factory barrels as well.
What makes a bullet bad in my estimation is the difference in weight and ogive. Measure ten bullets and you will find a big difference in both weight and ogive distance. These measurements are critical to accuracy.
It would appear that long and heavy for caliber bullets are subject to more frequent failures. Possibly precession could be a factor with fast spin rates.
In this forum I have read about certain barrels having a reputation of being bullet destroyers. Apparently and unfortunately, these barrels were tossed without being subjected to a real intense analysis of their innards.
Upon sectioning various bullets I see longitudinal ridges and valleys running along the inside of the ogive towards the tip. Jacket thickness increases at some point where the ogive curve straightens near the tip or opening. Looks like a moderate amount of work hardening with grain size reduction.
At this point some metallurgist would help.
In this forum I have read about certain barrels having a reputation of being bullet destroyers. Apparently and unfortunately, these barrels were tossed without being subjected to a real intense analysis of their innards.
Upon sectioning various bullets I see longitudinal ridges and valleys running along the inside of the ogive towards the tip. Jacket thickness increases at some point where the ogive curve straightens near the tip or opening. Looks like a moderate amount of work hardening with grain size reduction.
At this point some metallurgist would help.
Jdne5b
Gold $$ Contributor
With Ned's confirmation above.. that makes it known that every single heavy bullet option for .223 has been known to blow up in a 6.7 to 7 twist. Some more than others. So if ordering a .219 vs .218 bore reduces or eliminates the risk, then Im all for it. Im 300 rounds into my first one and have another on order. I dont see a downside.
I was under the assumption the bore size was greater, like .225 in your case then, not groove dia.
Jdne5b
Gold $$ Contributor
.219 bore, .224 groove.
That's not how it works, .224 is bore, .219 is groove.
Jdne5b
Gold $$ Contributor
Better call Bartlein and tell them they've got it all wrong.
https://bartleinbarrels.com/calibers/
Krieger too.
https://kriegerbarrels.com/caliber#showcal
This thread gets more incredulous by the post!!
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The ph of the soil in a particular strata is dependent on the factors associated with that strata...
Ned Ludd
Silver $$ Contributor
Jeremy - approximately what was the [final] powder differential between similar .219" and .218" bore barrels to obtain comparable velocity?
There are at least two other approaches that are likely to minimize or eliminate jacket failures. The first is to use monolithic/solid bullets. The second would be to use a completely smooth bore, like in the old ball muskets
. Of these, the second approach may be the more difficult. However, since you have already focused your efforts toward minimizing jacket failures using a bore-based approach (i.e. - trying the 0.219" bore), I'd love to see you try out the smooth-bore approach as well. 
I love them. I switched from Bergers to Hornady BC I can buy 3 boxes of ELDMs to 2 boxes of Bergers. I don't know about the jackets but if you look at Litz's book you can see that they are designed very well.
We are waiting to hear your story or you just trolling? Let's hear it.
We are waiting to hear your story or you just trolling? Let's hear it.
danny
Silver $$ Contributor
They are the guys that had nothing on their website or in their emails about R. Lee Ermey passing, correct? Same guys that didn't respond to my emails of "what was up with that?"
Danny
Incorrect.
Bore size is the tops of the lands. In this case .219” which is considered standard size.
Groove size is the grooves which in this case standard size is .224”.
When ever someone calls and starts asking questions about changing bore size the first thing I ask them is are you talking bore size/tops of the lands? Or are you talking groove size?
The term bore is used too much as a general term in speaking of the bore of the barrel but you are actually talking two different things.
Look at SAAMI or a CIP spec in regards to calibers/chambers/barrels. They will say Bore size = .2190” + the tolerance. They don’t say bore size = .2240”. They will call it out by saying groove size.
In a .308” caliber barrel they say bore size = .3000”. They don’t say bore size = .3080”.
Later, Frank
Bartlein Barrels
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Here take a look at the attachment. I couldn't do this at home as it's on my computer at work. This might help explain it a little better. Take a look at the circled area.
Also when we talk about reaming the bore when we make the barrels. Bore reaming is again the tops of the lands.
Later, Frank
Also when we talk about reaming the bore when we make the barrels. Bore reaming is again the tops of the lands.
Later, Frank
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