Hearing Protection ?
- Thread starter shaner72
- Start date
shaner72 said:
Noise Reduction Rating (NRR) is the measure, in decibels, of how well a hearing protector reduces noise, as specified by the Environmental Protection Agency. The higher the number, the greater the noise reduction. Anything over 85 dB can be damaging to your hearing. Here's a sampling of noise levels:
Normal Conversation - 60dB
Auto Traffic - 75dB
Sanding - 85dB
Subway - 90dB
Woodworking - 100dB
Drilling (pneumatic) - 100dB
Power Saw - 110dB
***Gunfire - 120dB***
I recommend Electronic Ear Muffs.
I use Remington® R2000™ Electronic Earmuffs. These muffs selectively monitor sound, "shutting out anything above 84 decibels" but let normal conversation through with individual controls. They're lightweight, thin in profile and have an adjustable headband. An external battery housing makes changing batteries quick and easy. Batteries are included. If you shut off the Electronics they still provide an NRR of about 23 dBs. But DON'T shut off the Electronics. You won't get the benefits you're paying for. You'll find them advertised for around $100 ($99.99 at Midway) or more. I paid $54.95 at Walmart.
The NRR is the real key to proper protection, and many that want to save their hearing will double up using foam earplugs and electronic ear muffs.
I wish I had when I was younger, too much Rock-n-Roll, Construction equimpent and of course Gunfire. I've lost 90% of the high end frequancies on the right side and the left is not much better. If your woman or child, and there's any background noise at all,, I won't hear ya. Being deaf is not fun. Damage piles up and it happens quicker than ya think.
The amount of protection you get is directly related to the cost, I feel Peltor is close to the top but it's close to top $ too.
I'm currently using Caldwell lowprofile with an NRR of 23 w/plugs and use a generic model for my son with a NRR of 25 and plugs. The NRR 23 can still give me a little ringing with the 308 and heavy loads if I use just the muffs with no plugs.
The electornics are really nice, you can hear conversation even with plugs and the volume turned up.
Bottom line, spend as much as you can afford then add $40, it's a lifetime investment. You'll need your hearing for a long time.
Good Luck, spend some time researching and purchase wisely.
I wish I had when I was younger, too much Rock-n-Roll, Construction equimpent and of course Gunfire. I've lost 90% of the high end frequancies on the right side and the left is not much better. If your woman or child, and there's any background noise at all,, I won't hear ya. Being deaf is not fun. Damage piles up and it happens quicker than ya think.
The amount of protection you get is directly related to the cost, I feel Peltor is close to the top but it's close to top $ too.
I'm currently using Caldwell lowprofile with an NRR of 23 w/plugs and use a generic model for my son with a NRR of 25 and plugs. The NRR 23 can still give me a little ringing with the 308 and heavy loads if I use just the muffs with no plugs.
The electornics are really nice, you can hear conversation even with plugs and the volume turned up.
Bottom line, spend as much as you can afford then add $40, it's a lifetime investment. You'll need your hearing for a long time.
Good Luck, spend some time researching and purchase wisely.
Disposable ear plugs provide 30-32dB protection and cost pennies. Combine that with some low-profile muffs for the best protection.
Mine Safety Appliance makes their foam ear plugs in a honeycomb pack of 60 pair ( 120 plugs) that sell for about $14 at Home Depot. NRR is 29 decibels, and combined with a good set of ear muffs, plenty of protection is provided, in fact, sometimes too much if trying to listen to range commands at a match, so that also is a consideration. Part# is 10020803.
I've read that plugs don't protect the side of your head - around the ear, from concussive effect. Supposedly this effect can have nearly as much detriment to your inner ear mechanism as what comes through the canal.
I use these (on sale now) http://www.midwayusa.com/viewProduct/?productNumber=665374 and recommend them at the sale price. They aren't low profile but I don't have a problem with them at the bench.
Just don't leave them in a hot car on a summer day. Refer to my review, last one on the page.
I use these (on sale now) http://www.midwayusa.com/viewProduct/?productNumber=665374 and recommend them at the sale price. They aren't low profile but I don't have a problem with them at the bench.
Just don't leave them in a hot car on a summer day. Refer to my review, last one on the page.
itchyTF
Gold $$ Contributor
The electronics only serve to amplify low level sounds so you can hear them better. The amplifier attenuates (or shuts off) above a certain threshold. The hearing protection comes from the muff construction itself and is the same with or without the electronics.
I don't know if active noise cancellation would work but I doubt these hearing protectors would have it.
I don't know if active noise cancellation would work but I doubt these hearing protectors would have it.
ryanjay11
Silver $$ Contributor
My personal experience is that the Howard Leights work just as well as some of the expensive Peltors.
http://www.midwayusa.com/viewProduct/?productNumber=671923
I've never been able to use ear muffs when shooting shotguns or rifles because they get lifted when I put my cheek on the stock. I use the What-ya-say custom molded plugs for everything besides pistols. Cathy is at the Bianchi Cup every year making them for competitors and spectators. I think she is charging $35 now for the plugs.
http://www.midwayusa.com/viewProduct/?productNumber=671923
I've never been able to use ear muffs when shooting shotguns or rifles because they get lifted when I put my cheek on the stock. I use the What-ya-say custom molded plugs for everything besides pistols. Cathy is at the Bianchi Cup every year making them for competitors and spectators. I think she is charging $35 now for the plugs.
necchi said:
More appropriate is the fit, as regardless of NNR of the device, without good fit, the NRR is significantly reduced.
The best protection is generally more expensive, but a $0.50 pair of disposable ear plugs can provide better protection than the most expensive muffs. But either requires a good fit for maximum effectiveness.
I bought the Howard Leights shown below, and they lasted less than 6 months before the electronics crapped out. Also, having worn both these and the Peltor Tach Pro's I'd say the difference between 22 db (HL) and 26 db (peltor) is significant - as in at 22db it's really bothersome to have a guy at the bench next to you shooting a .308 with a muzzle break. Not a problem at 26 db. I wouldn't want to go back to 22 db now.
DaveWhite said:
Electronic ear muffs don't work well at most indoor ranges. The noise is continuous enough that the electronics are always "off". For indoor use, I recommend the simultaneous use of a good fitting ear plug and a NRR 29 - 33 rated set of ear muffs. For outdoor use, I use plugs alone, or electronic ear muffs alone, or both simultaneously, depending on the activity around me. In some outdoor situations, I use non-electronic, high NRR earmuffs with good fitting ear plugs. Finding a set of ear muffs that do not interfere with shotgun or rifle stocks can be a challenge if your face structure places your cheek in an inconvenient location for the muffs. Muffs with high NRR values tend to be boxy. The extra space is needed to supply the high rating.
Personally, I rate top notch eye and ear protection as high as quality firearms.
Cort
Personally, I rate top notch eye and ear protection as high as quality firearms.
Cort
normmatzen
Banned
First, let me tell you where I am coming from.
I am an electronic engineer, took the graduate program at a local university in audiology, have a hearing aid dispensers license and worked in the hearing induxtry for a company doing research and product developement for the ear for 10 years.
First, the NRR rating is much misunderstood. It does NOT indicate the noise reduction of a protection device! What it does is force the mfg to measure the best case noise reduction, then measure the deviation from best case by mis-insertion and subtract that from the best case. That is NRR. As an example, the yellow foamies are among the potentially best protection. But, they are rated down as far as 20 dB NRR due to the propensity for mis-insertion.
Second, the ear muffs are NOT the best protection. They rarely exceed 30 dB NRR due to poor fit.
Third, the best protection one can get cannot exceed 40 dB by much as the skull and mastoid bone limit the reduction by what they conduct.
The best protection is a yellow foamie inserted so far that you are afraid you can't get them out! But you can.
Up till recently, I wore nothing but cheap solid or foam plugs inserted WAY into my ear canal.
Now, I wear something from the company I used to work for called "Blast Protectors." They have two models EB-1 and EB-15. The EB-1 have a linear amplifier limited to 115 dB at the ear drum. This is plenty for impulse noise like a 160 dB gun shot blast. The EB-15 have a compressor amplifier that reduces the gain as noise increases to an out put to the ear drum of 115 dB or so where is cannot exceed.
I use the EB-15 as it works really good for Bench rest competition.
Only problem, these puppies are expensive! Over $400. That is so as they use a high quality hearing aid amplifier, microphone and speaker. This makes for high fidelity sound reproduction.
Another problem, I designed the amplifier so I am biased!
I am an electronic engineer, took the graduate program at a local university in audiology, have a hearing aid dispensers license and worked in the hearing induxtry for a company doing research and product developement for the ear for 10 years.
First, the NRR rating is much misunderstood. It does NOT indicate the noise reduction of a protection device! What it does is force the mfg to measure the best case noise reduction, then measure the deviation from best case by mis-insertion and subtract that from the best case. That is NRR. As an example, the yellow foamies are among the potentially best protection. But, they are rated down as far as 20 dB NRR due to the propensity for mis-insertion.
Second, the ear muffs are NOT the best protection. They rarely exceed 30 dB NRR due to poor fit.
Third, the best protection one can get cannot exceed 40 dB by much as the skull and mastoid bone limit the reduction by what they conduct.
The best protection is a yellow foamie inserted so far that you are afraid you can't get them out! But you can.
Up till recently, I wore nothing but cheap solid or foam plugs inserted WAY into my ear canal.
Now, I wear something from the company I used to work for called "Blast Protectors." They have two models EB-1 and EB-15. The EB-1 have a linear amplifier limited to 115 dB at the ear drum. This is plenty for impulse noise like a 160 dB gun shot blast. The EB-15 have a compressor amplifier that reduces the gain as noise increases to an out put to the ear drum of 115 dB or so where is cannot exceed.
I use the EB-15 as it works really good for Bench rest competition.
Only problem, these puppies are expensive! Over $400. That is so as they use a high quality hearing aid amplifier, microphone and speaker. This makes for high fidelity sound reproduction.
Another problem, I designed the amplifier so I am biased!
ryanjay11 said:
I agree with that. I own those ear muffs and I like them very much. I didn't expect much for that price, but they're quite good.
When I shoot competitions, or even just plinking where there are other people, I always double up - I use foam plugs inside the electronic muffs. I offers slightly better protection, but it gives me peace of mind too if the electronics ever fail.
Doubling up also lets me turn the volume way up on the electronic ear muffs so I'm certain I can hear all range commands. Safety first.Having said that, I've been hunting for 30 years without ear protection (maybe the first couple of years I used my fingers) and I can still hear everyone's comments in my head just fine.
I tried low profile electronic earmuffs, but they didn't cut the sound as much as I'd like. Switched to Peltor ProTac II (MT15H7A2) and they work great for me. At the time they gave the best NRR of the electronic muffs I could find (they do some even higher NRR non-electronic ones) - don't know about now. I don't find low profile or Large profile any different for getting my head down on the stock. I use them for rifle and sporting clays.
normmatzen
Banned
THANK YOU OUTDOORSMAN!!
That video is brilliant!
Do that and you will have the best ear protection possible.
Also, he didn't go into the "second bend" much, but as well as an indication the plug was inserted correctly, you will notice a reduction of "occlusion effect" by insertion beyond the second bend. Occlusion effect is what caused the 'talking into a 55 gallon drum" effect.
The inner 1/2 of the ear canal is the "boney region" which has very thin skin over bone. The outer 1/2 is the "cartilageanous region." inserting only into the outer 1/2 allows the cartilage to resonate with your own voice which distorts and amplifies it. Sealing into the inner 1/2 , or boney region, will reduce occlusion effect.
Properly fitted as the video shows will yield a sound reduction of 38-40 dB, far better than the 25 dB NRR spec would indicate.
My EB-15s are still nicer to use tho!!
That video is brilliant!
Do that and you will have the best ear protection possible.
Also, he didn't go into the "second bend" much, but as well as an indication the plug was inserted correctly, you will notice a reduction of "occlusion effect" by insertion beyond the second bend. Occlusion effect is what caused the 'talking into a 55 gallon drum" effect.
The inner 1/2 of the ear canal is the "boney region" which has very thin skin over bone. The outer 1/2 is the "cartilageanous region." inserting only into the outer 1/2 allows the cartilage to resonate with your own voice which distorts and amplifies it. Sealing into the inner 1/2 , or boney region, will reduce occlusion effect.
Properly fitted as the video shows will yield a sound reduction of 38-40 dB, far better than the 25 dB NRR spec would indicate.
My EB-15s are still nicer to use tho!!
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