Got my 22BR tube but need help

[6and7mm]

A quick follow-up to address the Go & No Go gauges. The gunsmiths I know only have Remington 6BR gauges, and for HEADSPACE they use these for either Remington or Lapua BR chamberings, including 20 BR, 22 BR, 6.5 BR, 7 BR, 30 BR, and of course the 6 BR.

Yes, the Lapua 6 BR chamber spec. is ever so slightly larger at the web/base area; but if you start off with the new Lapua brass and fire it in the same gun, you will never know the difference in this area of the brass.

To the original OP. If you decide you you want to go no-turn and no-trim Lapua-based 22 BR chambering, let me know, I'll show you the appropriate reamer specs via reamer drawing.

To address the other question from NorCal Mike, no, I really don't know why a gunsmith would chamber a rifle these days using the older Remington-based BR specs; but it does happen. This is most likely due to 1) ignorance of the subject, or 2) someone asking for a 6 BR Remington chamber and not knowing the difference -- again, ignorance, whether on behalf of the customer or the gunsmith could vary case-by-case.

As for me, I have been down this highway and got several flat tires. Now, through the school of hard knocks, I am fairly well-versed in this subject. I hope you and others don't have to encounter the issues I have by simply trying to get a super-fun 22 BR built. The ORIGINAL postings on the site, for the 22 BR, are a bit misleading. It isn't intentional, it's just not the Paul Harvey version where we get "The Rest of the Story".

Good luck, and give the gunsmith a fair chance to address before getting too frustrated. It has been my experience that if you can explain the issue well enough, gunsmiths are typically quite happy to make it right. Like us, they can make mistakes too.

 

[NorCalMikie]

SO, what's the latest? Get any info (good or bad) from Northland? Inquiring minds want to know. Don't leave us hanging.

 

[SmokinJoe]

From all you have said you have a barrel with the wrong chamber for Lapua based brass. I would send the barrel back to Northland with a letter of explanation and see if they won't repair or replace. The neck length is not the only problem, the base (rear) of the chamber also needs to be spec'd for Lapua which is a couple thousandths larger than Remington. If that dimension isn't correct for the Lapua brass you will have problems with bolt click on extraction, especially if you load warm to hot loads.

 

[NorCalMikie]

"So with that being said, I'll contact him & see what he says".
cricket.... cricket.... Well??? And Northland said what????

AND, what's the deal with the reamer print? Is that the print of the reamer that was used to chamber your barrel??

No where on the Northland site does it say anything about "custom chambering barrels". All it lists are "pre fit" barrels???

 

[NorCalMikie]

cricket cricket. cricket cricket.???

You talk about leaving Guys hanging??

 

[Justin B]

Ok sorry about the delay. Long story short I trimmed all my brass waited way to long for the tube & didn't want to send it back with summer so short. Most my brass was once fired so I only cried for the first 50 rounds. Side note Frankford trimmer rocks!!

So lesson learned make dang sure your buying a new BR chamber don't trust the guy on the other end of the phone wanting to make a sale and move on I'm sure others have had great luck with Northland but I wished my tube would have went better. With that said I put 15 down the tube a while back & this is my new favorite gun (maybe a vartag will change that??) without any load workup I was .30" MOA at 100 on a 5 shot group with the stock crappy Savage trigger and some wind it's just amazing and flat 1.8 MRAD up at 530 yards with a solid ding on the plate made me smile.

 

[hogpatrol]

Thanks for the update. Still can't figure the reamer situation.

 

[NorCalMikie]

THANK YOU for the update. Looks to me like you're in the "learning process", just like the rest of us at one time or another.
Sounds like maybe you may have gotten the "Quick Shuffle" with a Remington 6 BR chamber? Didn't think ANYBODY did that anymore. Live and learn.

 

[linebaugh]

THANK YOU for the update. Looks to me like you're in the "learning process", just like the rest of us at one time or another.
Sounds like maybe you may have gotten the "Quick Shuffle" with a Remington 6 BR chamber? Didn't think ANYBODY did that anymore. Live and learn.

You should be ashamed of the advice you gave this poster. Many of us have done the research and I for one presently shoot and have the BR Rem reamer in my shop. I bought a BR Rem reamer throated to 95SMK so I could purposely feed the reamer in +.050 for proper neck clearance. I then sized my neck back accordingly and fireformed as a wildcat with proper headspace.

Pressing someone to use a piece of brass and set headspace in this case would have been beyond excessive and resulted in immediate cartridge failure with possible injury to the shooter. Bottom line is if you dont know what you are doing don't be giving someone gunsmithing advice. You sir are indeed the one in the learning curve, not the OP. The OP wanted advice and was smart enough to use due dilligence. Be careful in the future for yourself and certainly for others sake.

 

[Justin B]

I don't want to start an argument here it all came out in the wash & turned out great some guys do use a piece of brass in this case that wouldn't have worked after I did some research I don't but to each there own. Bottom line it's on the shooter to do there own research when building these Wildcats & this fourm is a great tool to get lots of info.

 

[Hohn]

Yep. 6BR Remington, that's the short one.
6BR Lapua is what you needed.
22 BR IS a Wildcat so, got brass? Head space is set with sized brass.
Don't have brass OR don't want to use brass?? Get the proper gauge.
NONE of my Savage rigs use gauges to set head space.
No factory ammo available for my ammo so brass gets used.
First Savage head space,barrel swap job used a gauge and the brass was so sloppy I reset it with brass.
All chamber head space is set on the snug side.
Sold the gauges to someone that wanted them more than I did.

Again, got brass??? Set the head space loose and see if brass will chamber.
Adjust accordingly. Only takes maybe 1/16th. or 1/8th. turn to get where you need to be.
When the brass (Lapua) chambers with a little resistance, snug the nut and work the bolt.
When it works the way YOU WANT IT, smack that nut and go shooting. You can ALWAYS adjust it again. It''s a Savage.

Brass is too variable to be used as a gauge for anything. Size your brass to the chamber, not the chamber to the brass.

Gauges are precision items that don't change. There isn't brass on the planet consistent enough to be as good as a ground gauge.

 

[JSH]

I don’t think anyone here have any bad advice. I have been in the same boat. Have an issue and ask at one of the best forums around.

This is classic for the most part. Understanding one another on subjects such as these gets lost in translation. Helping across the country or even half way around the world is a lot different than sitting across the bench.
The description of the issue by the poster may come off 180 degrees to the reader.

A good learning experience for ALL of us, and something to take note of for future reference.

I waited a while for a barrel from NSS, James is a top notch fellow. My Shilen select has pleased me from the get go, super speed, superb accuracy, easy cleaning. What more could I ask for.
FYI I let my brass and sizing die tell me where my headspace needed to be.

NOW, we all want to see or hear on group size!
Be safe and be well gentlemen.
Jeff

 

[rwj]

Is the 6 BR Lapua cited in this thread actually the 6 BR Norma, or is there another 6 BR chamber being marketed?

 

[NorCalMikie]

I think it IS Norma. I think we refer to the later (Norma) chamber as Lapua because of the availability of the quality Lapua brass. The Norma brass is good but a bit more expensive? And when there was a run on the Lapua brass with questionable availability, folks went with the Norms brand, even tho it cost more. At the time, you got what you could get.
The Remington chamber goes way back and getting a barrel chamber with that spec reamer would seem to be out of place now, unless you "specifically" asked for it.

 

[rwj]

Many of us have done the research and I for one presently shoot and have the BR Rem reamer in my shop. I bought a BR Rem reamer throated to 95SMK so I could purposely feed the reamer in +.050 for proper neck clearance. I then sized my neck back accordingly and fireformed as a wildcat with proper headspace.

I’m trying to understand the process noted above but something seems amiss. If the reamer is throated (free bore made longer?) for a 95SMK bullet, why does it have to be fed inward an additional .050 inches?

 

[linebaugh]

I’m trying to understand the process noted above but something seems amiss. If the reamer is throated (free bore made longer?) for a 95SMK bullet, why does it have to be fed inward an additional .050 inches?

Its not a bullet issue. You are confusing neck length with freebore and they are not the same. The 22 BR Remington is .040 shorter in the neck than a 22 BR lapua/norma so if I feed in my 22 BR Rem reamer deeper I can utilize the extended neck length and increase the case capacity by .050 at the shoulder. This requires fire forming and only sizing the neck back to .050 shy of the shoulder creating a false shoulder and allowing me to fire form brass.

You will absolutely be at risk trying to headspace off the brass in this case. Why? Because you will be seating the barrel to tbe case neck length, not the shoulder as should be done. Why is that completely dangerous? Because now the distance from your bolt face that used to be .005-.010 depending on maker is now .045-.050. In addition you now set the case mouth against the chamber throat which could potentially create a constriction which will spike pressure insanely high if you chamber a slightly longer neck case.
So in this case you potentially spiked pressure and left .040 of your case head unsupported which may or may not cause a catastrophic case failure but it certainly puts you in harms way and in a potentially dangerous situation.

 

[rwj]

Its not a bullet issue. You are confusing neck length with freebore and they are not the same. The 22 BR Remington is .040 shorter in the neck than a 22 BR lapua/norma so if I feed in my 22 BR Rem reamer deeper I can utilize the extended neck length and increase the case capacity by .050 at the shoulder. This requires fire forming and only sizing the neck back to .050 shy of the shoulder creating a false shoulder and allowing me to fire form brass.

Are there SAAMI or CIP standards for the 22BR or is it purely a wildcat? If the latter, where does one find dimensional standards?

 

[linebaugh]

Are there SAAMI or CIP standards for the 22BR or is it purely a wildcat? If the latter, where does one find dimensional standards?

22 BR Remington was standard. To my knowledge the 22 BR lapua/norma never was. That said you can find it on line somewhere as I have seen it. You could also just find the 22 BR Rem print then compare the 6 BR Lapua for a neck length guide.
Both the 22BR Rem and the 22 BR Lapua/Norma would share the same headspace gauge which has not a thing to do with neck length.

 

[linebaugh]

happen to

I’m trying to understand the process noted above but something seems amiss. If the reamer is throated (free bore made longer?) for a 95SMK bullet, why does it have to be fed inward an additional .050 inches?

happen to be at my load bench. Here is the 22 BR Rem print

 

[linebaugh]

And the 6 BR Lapua/norma