There is another thread going well on this subject but I do not want to hijack that thread or be one of the forum bullies so I am starting another thread on this subject. My question is how do we define flyer? It seems like some folks define a shot that fails to meet their expectations as a flyer. That is ok if that is how we decide to define it but that seems like a poor definition. If I call a shot bad when I pull the trigger and before I look thru the scope and see its actual location I am ok with calling it a flyer but if I call it a flyer after I look then that does not seem appropriate. Most folks would be surprised to see the result of a very large group of what they think is an accurate load. We never get this perspective if we exclude those flyers from our data and only shoot three or five shot groups. So the subject of this thread is how do we define a flyer?
Flyers
- Thread starter chkunz
- Start date
T-REX said:
I will give you MY recent experience I have had with a "persistent" flyer. My last .284 Shehane gave me fits. I could shoot a 5 shot group and invariably I got one that went DIRECTLY higher (straight up at 12 o'clock) or one (maybe 20 pct of the time went straight down at 6:30).. I could put 4 in a nice group BUT ALWAYS, ALWAYS, ALWAYS one would go up or down. It did not matter whether it was at 300, 600 or 1000 yards. BUT at 1000 yards it cost me points on every match. No matter what I did, change powders, change powder charges, change seating depth(s), change neck tension. No matter what I tried, I could NOT get rid of that flyer>>period.
A little wisdom here>>> Credited to Erik Cortina. We put on, for our club (Bayou Rifles) an "Advanced Competition Loading Clinic" in the early Spring. Erik made a statement that made a HUGE impact on me. He asked the question "What is the most expensive piece of equipment in shooting".. I thought "The Scope".. Others chimed in with various parts of the rifle. He said "You are all missing the point"... The MOST EXPENSIVE component is THE BULLET! He was correct. I bet I shot 300-400 rounds in a valiant, albeit a FAILED attempt, to rid myself of that flyer. I just chalked it up to a "less than stellar" barrel. It does not matter WHAT barrel maker>>>they ALL can and will have a bad one. So, instead of putting MORE bullets down the bore, I got another barrel and Omar Alonzo is in the process of installing it. It is FAR cheaper to turn on another barrel than to run 100's of bullets in an attempt to MAKE a barrel shoot. Some will just not ever shoot! We have to come to grips with that and spin off a bad barrel and replace it!
Dusty Stevens
Shiner
More flyers can be traced to rests and bags than anything else. Very overlooked though.
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I would define a flyer as a called good shot that didn't end up where I thought it was going to. If I jerk the trigger or see something shift in the scope as I shoot, that's not necessarily a flyer to me. Might be an "outlier" or "group killer". But to me, a "flyer" is when I get a bullet land somewhere significantly off from where I expected. At that point, its time to figure out why it happened...
I am experiencing the same damn thing. Like I said in my post on flyers, "I am no bench rest shooter" So I know I am doing a lot of things wrong but the thing that gets me is if its me or the bags or rest then why in the hell can I shoot nice clusters with another rifle on the same day at the same time???
I honestly think that there is another reason for the darn things. It could be me or the bags but why is it every time with this rifle??
I honestly think that there is another reason for the darn things. It could be me or the bags but why is it every time with this rifle??
Raptor said:
To answer your question Raptor, re-read Reply #1.... I shoot A LOT.. When ALL my rifles shoot excellent groups and I have one that is giving me fits, and NO AMOUNT of "fiddlin'" helps, it is time to get rid of the barrel! You are POURING $$$s, in the form of bullets and powder, down the bore to only find out what you had already suspected>>>it WON'T SHOOT! The cost of the bullets and powder adds up pretty quick. When does it become cheaper to simply get another barrel??
Dusty Stevens
Shiner
Joe R said:
Heavy sand will pack and cause flyers. Too much sand, too slick, cordura and the super slick reflective vest material causes it, bag not stuck to the bench good like rocking from too much fill or some foreign material between the leather and bench like a wood spacer, stock tape, tons of stuff. When youre shooting zeros you can loosen a butt plate screw and see it. Lots of pain comes from rest setups. They usually look like the group tim posted- typical flyer we see in br. I think he knows how that one happened though.
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